Jason1320 Posted January 18, 2012 Report Share Posted January 18, 2012 So the media ban has been lifted and the reviews are in, as an avid Shelby/Ford fan I figured a few of you like me might be interested. Hopefully the links below work (their my first), but the short version is 12.1 @117mph to 12.6 @116 in the 1/4, 0.98 to 1.01G on the skid pad and 60-0 in 108ft. Motor Trend ZL1 vs. Boss LS http://www.motortren...ca/viewall.html Car and Driver http://www.caranddri...zl1-test-review Autoweek http://www.autoweek.com/article/20120117/CARREVIEWS/120119856 Automible http://www.automobilemag.com/features/news/1203_2012_chevrolet_camaro_zl1_and_2012_chevrolet_corvette_grand_sport/index.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SGT/SC#0471 Posted January 18, 2012 Report Share Posted January 18, 2012 So a 550 whippled GT/SC is faster, at least mine is....sweet! LOL ZL1 is seriously cool IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ilmor Posted January 18, 2012 Report Share Posted January 18, 2012 None of the links worked when I tried them. Now we wait for the 2013 GT500 numbers...by which time the ZL1 will be updated...and then... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigsnake Posted January 18, 2012 Report Share Posted January 18, 2012 Links didn't work for me either. Here's the Motor Trend and C&D links. http://www.motortren...ca/viewall.html http://www.caranddri...zl1-test-review Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
svttim Posted January 18, 2012 Report Share Posted January 18, 2012 Interesting, they compare the Boss 302 instead of the SVT 2012 Shelby. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mustang let back Posted January 18, 2012 Report Share Posted January 18, 2012 what this means to me is with all of that talk about the things the zl1 was going to have on it,yes it beat the BOSS 302 but did not kill it.12.1@117 for the zl1 and 12.4 for the BOSS.Evan Smith took a 2010 GT500 stock and got 11.9@120.the BOSS was not too far behind on the track.it seems to me if the BOSS had just 500hp it would have beat the zl1.going by if FORD has the same set up as the BOSS for the 2013 GT500,or better,the zl1 will get DESTROYED. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supersnake94 Posted January 19, 2012 Report Share Posted January 19, 2012 Ugh, they are now doing the test drives and road tests on the damn thing, and we are still sitting on a carshow floor. FORD I KNOW THE ZL1 HAS BEEN OUT LONGER THAN THE 2013 SHELY GT500, BUT YOU NEED TO START PRODUCTION NOW AND START SELLING IN THE USUAL SPRING BESIDES THE STUPID SUMMER. WE NEED TO SEE THE 2013 GT500 BEING DRIVEN NOW!!!!! WHY AM I WRITING IN CAPS LOCK?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bpmurr Posted January 19, 2012 Report Share Posted January 19, 2012 I'm pretty sure the 2013 GT500 will be significantly faster in a straight line. I think the ZL1 will still have the handling edge. It seems from the reviews the ZL1 is really composed and showing the true advantage of having a high tech suspension with IRS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Beyond Posted January 19, 2012 Report Share Posted January 19, 2012 So...based on those 1/4 mile times, it looks like the almighty ZL1 isn't any quicker than the current model GT500. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Beyond Posted January 19, 2012 Report Share Posted January 19, 2012 Interesting, they compare the Boss 302 instead of the SVT 2012 Shelby. Hmm... is it because they aren't so sure that the ZL1 will beat the current GT500? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0201212 Posted January 19, 2012 Report Share Posted January 19, 2012 Nice to know. Guess I don't need an upgrade after all lol. Can't wait to meet a few at the track so I can hurt some feelings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EL SHELBY Posted January 19, 2012 Report Share Posted January 19, 2012 I like the ZL1, but,,,,, I still find it amusing that it took the ZR1 parts bin to bring the Camaro to same performance level as the BOSS & GT500 which are based on 7 year old platform. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Canfield Posted January 19, 2012 Report Share Posted January 19, 2012 Comparing the ZL1 to the LS just seems wrong. From a price point it doesn't sit well with me, and the idea of putting a blown engine that's over an entire liter larger against a normally aspirated, smaller sngine just seems like stacking th edeck. The'ys have gotten less negative response if they'd have run it against a V6 Track Pack Mustang...or a Fusion Hybrid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisSD Posted January 19, 2012 Report Share Posted January 19, 2012 I like the ZL1, but,,,,, I still find it amusing that it took the ZR1 parts bin to bring the Camaro to same performance level as the BOSS & GT500 which are based on 7 year old platform. The ZR-1 is based on a platform first sold in 2005. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisSD Posted January 19, 2012 Report Share Posted January 19, 2012 Comparing the ZL1 to the LS just seems wrong. From a price point it doesn't sit well with me, and the idea of putting a blown engine that's over an entire liter larger against a normally aspirated, smaller sngine just seems like stacking th edeck. The'ys have gotten less negative response if they'd have run it against a V6 Track Pack Mustang...or a Fusion Hybrid. The car is 500lbs heavier. They took the fastest track Mustang available. How is that not fair? Should they just not compare it to the Mustang? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EL SHELBY Posted January 19, 2012 Report Share Posted January 19, 2012 The ZR-1 is based on a platform first sold in 2005. What's your point? I don't see anyone comparing anything from Ford to the ZR1. All of the parts taken from the ZR1 (and then improved) for the ZL1 where not available from GM until 2009. GM has thrown every techno suspention gadget they have at the ZL1 and it's '09 (production yr) platform to match or ever so slightly top the BOSS & GT500 numbers with their passive suspension, solid rear axle, and 7-8yr old chassis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisSD Posted January 19, 2012 Report Share Posted January 19, 2012 My point is both cars are awesome. I hate how everyone has to pick a "team". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerseygator Posted January 19, 2012 Report Share Posted January 19, 2012 My point is both cars are awesome. I hate how everyone has to pick a "team". I read your previous 2 posts and could not find that point anywhere... Come on this is TeamShelby. You're in the Ford locker room. Good luck swimming against the current... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freak Posted January 19, 2012 Report Share Posted January 19, 2012 12.1@117 for the zl1 and 12.4 for the BOSS.Evan Smith took a 2010 GT500 stock and got 11.9@120.the BOSS was not too far behind on the track.it seems to me if the BOSS had just 500hp it would have beat the zl1. Thats great and all, but Evan Smith wasn't driving, Someone from MT was, and they only got 12.7 out of the 2010 Shelby (and they state that Ford themselves only claims 12.3). Also, keep in mind that the LS has Racing compound tires, where the ZL1 has the same tires that the SVTPP cars have. So...based on those 1/4 mile times, it looks like the almighty ZL1 isn't any quicker than the current model GT500. To keep it as fair as possible, you need to look at the times from the same magazines. I couldn't find 2012 numbers but the best I could find for the 2011 was 12.3. Which seems faster to me. Comparing the ZL1 to the LS just seems wrong. From a price point it doesn't sit well with me, and the idea of putting a blown engine that's over an entire liter larger against a normally aspirated, smaller sngine just seems like stacking th edeck. KInda reminds me of the tests between the Camaro SS (which you could get into for 32K) and GT500 (which I believe started at 46K at the time) when the 4.6 was still being used, and got it's ass handed to it. At least the LS is only about 6K less than the ZL1. Of course when the GT500 was the obvious winner, few on the Mustang side complained. I like the ZL1, but,,,,, I still find it amusing that it took the ZR1 parts bin to bring the Camaro to same performance level as the BOSS & GT500 which are based on 7 year old platform. Magnetic ride has been on Corvettes since at least 03, and the launch control doesn't make things any faster, just easier for the average guy to launch. Plus this is the next generation, if it ends up on the Vette, it will be coming FROM the ZL1. And anyway, thats how things work, Technical stuff gets put on the higher end stuff and trickles down. Didn't Ford put a detuned Ford GT motor in the Shelby? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhlgt500 Posted January 19, 2012 Report Share Posted January 19, 2012 Didn't Ford put a detuned Ford GT motor in the Shelby? For the 2013 GT500, Ford detunes it with an extra 100 HP :happy feet: More seriously, one can endlessly debate how the various Ford v8's in different models and across different years are related or not related and how they evolved to create the current product offerings. Describing the GT500 motor as simply a detuned Ford GT motor is probably a bit simplistic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
William Rodgers Posted January 20, 2012 Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 Time will tell what the 2013 GT500 will do, one message this throws out to ford is the GT500 better not be over $60K, they will lose customers for sure. This also puts more pressure to make the next Mustang even that much better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freak Posted January 20, 2012 Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 Describing the GT500 motor as simply a detuned Ford GT motor is probably a bit simplistic. It is, absolutely. But no more so than saying the only way to get a Camaro to keep up with a Mustang is by raiding the ZR1 parts bin. The entire argument is as rediculous as the old "Ford had to supercharge a Mustang to beat the LS1" argument of '03. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SGT/SC#0471 Posted January 20, 2012 Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 My point is both cars are awesome. I hate how everyone has to pick a "team". +1000. Not to be a jerk, but to me nothing shows more lack of car history and knowledge than the "I am a ________man mentality". They are all cool from time to time...I like the picture of Mr. Shelby driving that Maserati Birdcage. I once mentioned that picture to a "Ford" guy with a Shelby and he just asked.."Whats a Birdcage". I answered but I don't think he listened past Maserati. LOL. And as far as bad cars go I am an equal opprotunity hater...every manufacturer has made a few boners.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EL SHELBY Posted January 20, 2012 Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 It is, absolutely. But no more so than saying the only way to get a Camaro to keep up with a Mustang is by raiding the ZR1 parts bin. The entire argument is as rediculous as the old "Ford had to supercharge a Mustang to beat the LS1" argument of '03. Never said the Camaro couldn't keep up with the Mustang (or at least that was not my intent), clearly it can and has. My intent was that it took the ZR1 bin to match or best the performance numbers of the BOSS and GT500. I'm sure GM could have taken the Camaro to the next level without the ZR1 bits, but they didn't and I don't fault them for it. As I said, I find it 'amusing' that it took ZR1 bits to bring the Camaro to/past Ford's current offerings. I find it amusing because I would have hoped that adding the magnetic fluid controlled shocks and struts would have had a much greater impact on the Camaro's performance around a track. Obviously, the ZR1 suspension is not a direct bolt on to the Camaro. GM applied the tech to improve the Camaro's suspension which is based on the Ausie designed Holden. To be completely honest, GM has to hold back the performance of the Camaro as to not step on the Vette's toes, assuming the Camaro's platform can perform well beyond it's current level. I made it very clear 'I like the ZL1'. I never thought my 'throw-away' comment would stir so much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EL SHELBY Posted January 20, 2012 Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 Magnetic ride has been on Corvettes since at least 03, And the radial tire has been around since the '60's. The ZR1's suspention is an absolute marval of the latest suspention tech. I do not see how it can be compared to earlier counterparts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mustang let back Posted January 20, 2012 Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 Thats great and all, but Evan Smith wasn't driving, Someone from MT was, and they only got 12.7 out of the 2010 Shelby (and they state that Ford themselves only claims 12.3). Also, keep in mind that the LS has Racing compound tires, where the ZL1 has the same tires that the SVTPP cars have. To keep it as fair as possible, you need to look at the times from the same magazines. I couldn't find 2012 numbers but the best I could find for the 2011 was 12.3. Which seems faster to me. KInda reminds me of the tests between the Camaro SS (which you could get into for 32K) and GT500 (which I believe started at 46K at the time) when the 4.6 was still being used, and got it's ass handed to it. At least the LS is only about 6K less than the ZL1. Of course when the GT500 was the obvious winner, few on the Mustang side complained. Magnetic ride has been on Corvettes since at least 03, and the launch control doesn't make things any faster, just easier for the average guy to launch. Plus this is the next generation, if it ends up on the Vette, it will be coming FROM the ZL1. And anyway, thats how things work, Technical stuff gets put on the higher end stuff and trickles down. Didn't Ford put a detuned Ford GT motor in the Shelby? it does not matter if Evan Smith drove that day.the point is with a better driver the GT500 can do 11.9@120. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bpmurr Posted January 20, 2012 Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 Never said the Camaro couldn't keep up with the Mustang (or at least that was not my intent), clearly it can and has. My intent was that it took the ZR1 bin to match or best the performance numbers of the BOSS and GT500. I'm sure GM could have taken the Camaro to the next level without the ZR1 bits, but they didn't and I don't fault them for it. As I said, I find it 'amusing' that it took ZR1 bits to bring the Camaro to/past Ford's current offerings. I find it amusing because I would have hoped that adding the magnetic fluid controlled shocks and struts would have had a much greater impact on the Camaro's performance around a track. Obviously, the ZR1 suspension is not a direct bolt on to the Camaro. GM applied the tech to improve the Camaro's suspension which is based on the Ausie designed Holden. To be completely honest, GM has to hold back the performance of the Camaro as to not step on the Vette's toes, assuming the Camaro's platform can perform well beyond it's current level. I made it very clear 'I like the ZL1'. I never thought my 'throw-away' comment would stir so much. From the Motortrend review it seems like the magnetic suspension did a hell of a job keeping handling very composed and effortless to the driver. I'm also tired of hearing this ZR1 parts bin raiding. Who cares if some of these parts might be on the ZR1. When the hell did that become a bad thing? In this day in age why does a car company have to come up with entirely new stuff for just one car? Why not spread the development costs among multiple cars making things cheaper. Given the MSRP of the ZL1 it did just that. it does not matter if Evan Smith drove that day.the point is with a better driver the GT500 can do 11.9@120. I'm sure the ZL1 can run high 11's with a good driver as well. Let's wait until someone does a straight up comparison with a GT500 before we say which car is really faster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EL SHELBY Posted January 20, 2012 Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 I'm also tired of hearing this ZR1 parts bin raiding. Who cares if some of these parts might be on the ZR1. When the hell did that become a bad thing? Who 'in the hell' said it was a bad thing? You are absolutely right that GM was smart to carry the tech over to the Camaro (Caddie is using it as well) as it helps to dilute the development cost and improves the ZL1's 'wow' factor. I really don't understand why some are getting their panties in bunch over my so called rediculous post. Please, someone tell me what I'm missing! I haven't bashed GM or the Camaro. All I did was state a fact, and that I thought it was amusing. Where am I in the wrong? If anyone is tired of my post then ignor them, it will not bother me in the least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freak Posted January 20, 2012 Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 it does not matter if Evan Smith drove that day.the point is with a better driver the GT500 can do 11.9@120. Driver doesn't matter? Wow. To think, this whole time I've assumed that the skill of the driver made a huge difference. Who 'in the hell' said it was a bad thing? You are absolutely right that GM was smart to carry the tech over to the Camaro (Caddie is using it as well) as it helps to dilute the development cost and improves the ZL1's 'wow' factor. I really don't understand why some are getting their panties in bunch over my so called rediculous post. Please, someone tell me what I'm missing! I haven't bashed GM or the Camaro. All I did was state a fact, and that I thought it was amusing. Where am I in the wrong? If you aren't using the term amusing as a negative, then I'm lost. If someone said they found it amusing that Ford had to supercharge the Mustang to keep up with the LS1 F-Body, are you saying you WOULDN'T think that was stab at Ford? Clearly I'm not the only one who's reading it that way. But if you truly don't mean it that way then I misunderstood, and apologize. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
William Rodgers Posted January 20, 2012 Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 Now the question is what are they going to do with the Corvette???? The Camaro has never had more power than the Vette until now. Now it is not even close, the Vette is beyond due for an updated, has been the same for 6-7 years now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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