jumpincactus Posted July 8, 2007 Report Share Posted July 8, 2007 Spent the moring this morning and took my baby to the Horsepower Ranch here in Seattle. They specialize in guess what??? Horsepower lol............... dude is an awesome tuner. I am however really bummed with the results. Car is bone stock. I will scan and post when I get to work tomorrow. The tests were run on a Powerdyne Mustang Dynamometer. Ambient air was 67 degrees and the humidtity was 36 % First run put down 407 RWHP and 424 RWTQ Second run 399 & 322 Not sure bout the rest of you guys........... but this is not right. I have seen many posts that claim 440 bone stock and that would make sense from a standpoint of 500 @ the crank. So with my rear wheel numbers I am only getting approx 440-445 at the crank. Were is my other 60 HP going?? Whats up with that? This car was sold and advertised as 500 HP The AF ran 9.5 thru 3140 RPM and stays consistant until 5200 and dives to 15.0. overall avg was listed @ 11.2 Why does the AF nosedive to so lean @ 5200rpm? I know a tune will fix that, I guess my point of contention is why did I get a car that touts 500 HP @ the crank and Im only getting 430-445. This opens up the whole implied warranty thing. I paid for and expect 500 Crank HP. How many of you would pursue this with Ford? Or are the posters that are claiming 445 at the Rear wheels bone stock Bull********??? Any input now that I have vented. For those of you that remember me when I first came to this board I p***** a lot of you off claiming my ride didnt feel as gutsy as my 03 termie. Well now I know why because this GT500 isnt as gutsy that why I did not feel a SOTP difference and was disapointed. My 03 termie was 450 RWHP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nilkilla Posted July 8, 2007 Report Share Posted July 8, 2007 have it checked for the AF recall? pm me the vin and i'll run an OASIS on it. it was on earlier versions, where the AF was actually choking the intake. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Snake Posted July 8, 2007 Report Share Posted July 8, 2007 Spent the moring this morning and took my baby to the Horsepower Ranch here in Seattle. They specialize in guess what??? Horsepower lol............... dude is an awesome tuner. I am however really bummed with the results. Car is bone stock. I will scan and post when I get to work tomorrow. The tests were run on a Powerdyne Mustang Dynamometer. Ambient air was 67 degrees and the humidtity was 36 % First run put down 407 RWHP and 424 RWTQ Second run 399 & 322 Not sure bout the rest of you guys........... but this is not right. I have seen many posts that claim 440 bone stock and that would make sense from a standpoint of 500 @ the crank. So with my rear wheel numbers I am only getting approx 440-445 at the crank. Were is my other 60 HP going?? Whats up with that? This car was sold and advertised as 500 HP The AF ran 9.5 thru 3140 RPM and stays consistant until 5200 and dives to 15.0. overall avg was listed @ 11.2 Why does the AF nosedive to so rich @ 5200rpm? I know a tune will fix that, I guess my point of contention is why did I get a car that touts 500 HP @ the crank and Im only getting 430-445. This opens up the whole implied warranty thing. I paid for and expect 500 Crank HP. How many of you would pursue this with Ford? Or are the posters that are claiming 445 at the Rear wheels bone stock Bull********??? Any input now that I have vented. For those of you that remember me when I first came to this board I p***** a lot of you off claiming my ride didnt feel as gutsy as my 03 termie. Well now I know why because this GT500 isnt as gutsy that why I did not feel a SOTP difference and was disapointed. My 03 termie was 450 RWHP Heres the link to my stock Dyno baseline 449.7 rwhp contact Justin maybe he can explain? http://www.stangsunleashed.com/forums/inde...376&hl=Dyno Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin00Stang Posted July 8, 2007 Report Share Posted July 8, 2007 Do you know what type of dyno was used? can you scan or take a pic of the dynographs and post them on here? The A/F numbers you are describing sound backwards, 15 is lean and 9 is rich. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GT500FLYBOY Posted July 8, 2007 Report Share Posted July 8, 2007 I showed poor dyno runs for my stock GT500 a while back. I think it's just heat soak. I had a hot day and high humidity, but what I think is significant is the car is sitting there with a little fan to cool the engine. That ain't gonna do it. Justin and a couple other guys pointed out the low A/F for mine - starting at 4000 - was due to the ECU dumping fuel to cool the cats. That all seems to make sense on the stock tune. I since got the JLT/Evo I setup and it was like night/day. I still have yet to do another dyno, but I expect much better numbers. Another thing folks pointed out is that Dynojets have industry set standards they follow during a dyno run. The Mustang dyno on the other hand is completely tailorable - you plug in numbers and you can make your run look as good or poor as you'd like. Remember - a tune shop is looking for business, too. http://www.stangsunleashed.com/forums/inde...mp;hl=poor+dyno Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jumpincactus Posted July 8, 2007 Author Report Share Posted July 8, 2007 Do you know what type of dyno was used? can you scan or take a pic of the dynographs and post them on here? The A/F numbers you are describing sound backwards, 15 is lean and 9 is rich. Powerdyne Mustang Dynamometer. Mustang 1750 Dynamometer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jumpincactus Posted July 8, 2007 Author Report Share Posted July 8, 2007 I showed poor dyno runs for my stock GT500 a while back. I think it's just heat soak. I had a hot day and high humidity, but what I think is significant is the car is sitting there with a little fan to cool the engine. That ain't gonna do it. Justin and a couple other guys pointed out the low A/F for mine - starting at 4000 - was due to the ECU dumping fuel to cool the cats. That all seems to make sense on the stock tune. I since got the JLT/Evo I setup and it was like night/day. I still have yet to do another dyno, but I expect much better numbers. Another thing folks pointed out is that Dynojets have industry set standards they follow during a dyno run. The Mustang dyno on the other hand is completely tailorable - you plug in numbers and you can make your run look as good or poor as you'd like. Remember - a tune shop is looking for business, too. http://www.stangsunleashed.com/forums/inde...mp;hl=poor+dyno If you reread my post the air temps were very cool 67 deg and 36 % humid As for the tuner are you saying he may have altered the #'s to make my HP seem weak to sell me the Diablo tuner? If this dyno can be altered what type of dyno can one trust for accurate readings? Below is a breakdown of his facility. Shop: Our shop was designed around dyno tuning and is the most advanced tuning facility available. The dyno cell features an in-ground Mustang 1750 Dynamometer capable of measuring in excess of 2,000 horse power and chassis loading in excess of 1,000 horsepower. The cell features advanced air evacuation that moves 20,000 CFM of air through the cell during a dyno run - something most shops don't have. It has been proven that to get repeatable and accurate results you need to move 7,500 CFM per every 500 wheel horse power otherwise you run will be bringing in spent exhaust gasses back into the intake air of the engine. Our cell can properly circulate air for up to 1,400 wheel horsepower. The facility also features a giant 32" display screen on the dynamometer so that the customer can see exactly what is happening during every run. The facility is also designed around the enjoyment and comfort of the customer. It has a full heat and air conditioning system along with a 42" LCD for customers to watch recorded or live television as they wait. Computers are also available for customers to browse the internet while their vehicle is being tuned. Tuning Experience: Our primary tuning technician is John Garner who is primarily known for his custom 1990 Mustang GT that has been featured in Car Craft, Hot Rod, and 5.0 Mustang & Super Ford Magazine. John won the inaugural 5.0 King of the Street competition, won Most Legit Street car at the Hot Rod Pump Gas Drags, and was the first (and only) car to ever run 9's in the Car Craft Real Street Eliminator. John has also been the "secret tuner" behind many shops across the nation to solve complex tuning problems with high end exotics and full on race cars when the existing tuning staff was unable to resolve tuning issues. He has operated dynos across the united states and is sponsored by many product vendors including Vortech Superchargers, AEM, Baer Brakes, and more. The shop as a whole has tuning experience for nearly every aftermarket tuning system from Fel-Pro, FAST, and AEM to tuning factory processors like Ford EEC-IV & EEC-V, LS1 Edit, and Honda tuning. We have the experience to tune your vehicle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nilkilla Posted July 8, 2007 Report Share Posted July 8, 2007 vin? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PbFoot Posted July 8, 2007 Report Share Posted July 8, 2007 Did you ride it hard the first 20-50 miles or break it in real easy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alloy Dave Posted July 9, 2007 Report Share Posted July 9, 2007 A couple things to consider. 1) I believe the Mustang dyno typically reads lower than other types like a Dynojet....so you may not be able to use the same "gross up" factor as others have used. 2) You say the A/F went "rich" when it went to 15? Actually an A/F of 15 is LEAN, not rich. As for why this happened...I don't know...but if you post the dyno graphs there are some people here good at reading the charts and may be able to offer more insights. 3) When people refer to heat soak, it doesn't necessarily mean the ambient temperature. If you had gone through any SC activation on your trip to the shop, this may have heat soaked the S/C and robbed you of power...the heat soak can be significant. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jumpincactus Posted July 9, 2007 Author Report Share Posted July 9, 2007 Thanx for the input so far fellas. Nilkilla I will get the vin tomorrow and have you do aa Oasis check. I hope it something like the AF as this is a tuning issue. I also see that I did state in my original post that it was too rich. I stand corrected it is way lean. Weird how it dives suddenly @ 5200 rpm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgussin1 Posted July 9, 2007 Report Share Posted July 9, 2007 mustang dyno's give lower numbers than dynojets...your numbers look spot on where they should be. I bet your car would dyno 430-450rwhp on a dynojet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1sweetazzgt500 Posted July 9, 2007 Report Share Posted July 9, 2007 "Mustang Dyno's" do typically read lower than a Dynojet, Mustang's put a "load" on the rollers simulating the weight of the car or something to that effect. Wouldn't be too worried. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
littlejohn Posted July 9, 2007 Report Share Posted July 9, 2007 A Mustang dyno typically reads 8-10% lower than a Dynojet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HotRodHarry Posted July 9, 2007 Report Share Posted July 9, 2007 yep...just because its a Mustang Dyno..so your Shelby is fine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mach1fever Posted July 9, 2007 Report Share Posted July 9, 2007 Definately because its a mustang dyno. Also the operator can put in the wrong weight and really manipulate your numbers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin00Stang Posted July 9, 2007 Report Share Posted July 9, 2007 Get it on a dynojet for a good baseline. MDs sometimes read low, and sometimes high depending on how they are calibrated. Since your numbers were low it sounds like this shop was not fuding anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ssss07 Posted July 9, 2007 Report Share Posted July 9, 2007 Nice article in the newsest Modified Mustang mag on dyno graphs and reading them. I think I have found the problem with my 04 cobra from reading the article and will contact VMP and Justin to confirm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HotRodHarry Posted July 9, 2007 Report Share Posted July 9, 2007 I just went and dyno'd today...501 rwhp.(std)(490 trq.).... 490 rwhp(sae)(479 trq.) dynojet dyno. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5.4 Shelby Posted July 10, 2007 Report Share Posted July 10, 2007 I just went and dyno'd today...501 rwhp.(std)(490 trq.).... 490 rwhp(sae)(479 trq.) dynojet dyno. That's stock aside from a FRPP exhaust? Wow, you got a good one. How did you break it in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HotRodHarry Posted July 10, 2007 Report Share Posted July 10, 2007 I took it easy on her for about 300 miles(nothing over 4k)....mostly changed speeds with arount town driving...10 mile trips. Alittle on highway...then at 300 started getting on her more....upped the rpm to 5k and had fun with her. Then at 500(changed oil) I let her rip and started power shifting alittle too. I heard a few of these cars have everything just right in their motors.Some having uneven timing between banks. And mine must be one that is right no the money... The break in was over a 4 month period with the low miles I still have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brands5.0 Posted July 10, 2007 Report Share Posted July 10, 2007 No way 501 rwhp. stock , What did Ford run out of GT500 motors and put a FORD GT motor in YOUR car. I am not saying your not telling the truth but someone is not maybe the dyno owner did know how to use his dyno. 500 RWHP would = 575+ fwhp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HotRodHarry Posted July 10, 2007 Report Share Posted July 10, 2007 LOL...that is standard on the 501....489.98 SAE And plus..its my car...that gives it an extra 20 or so right there..LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmpireStateGT500 Posted July 10, 2007 Report Share Posted July 10, 2007 HRH. It sounds like you read the Motorman article on how to break in high performance motors: http://mototuneusa.com/break_in_secrets.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HotRodHarry Posted July 10, 2007 Report Share Posted July 10, 2007 never read that...hmmm...darn..should have patent my break in procedure!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5.4 Shelby Posted July 10, 2007 Report Share Posted July 10, 2007 HRH. It sounds like you read the Motorman article on how to break in high performance motors: http://mototuneusa.com/break_in_secrets.htm I get the opposite from reading that article. He gets on it right from the get go to "seat" the rings. HRH took it easy for the first 300. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HotRodHarry Posted July 10, 2007 Report Share Posted July 10, 2007 To some....only waiting 300 miles is getting on it early..LOL My dad waits like 2000 miles! I just can never do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jumpincactus Posted July 11, 2007 Author Report Share Posted July 11, 2007 Well who woulda thought there was that much diff between dyno machines. thanks for all the input guys. I am attempting to post my dyno sheet. Take a look at the AF geeesh files 805 too big Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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