cbrbear Posted December 18, 2014 Report Share Posted December 18, 2014 So Shelby sells wilwood and baer kits. Question is which is the better option. Wilwood is significantly cheaper but do they provide significant braking over the stock brembos? I dont want to half ass it but at the same time dont want to spend a grip for minimal improvement. Also anyone have experience with a brake cooling kit for the 14 GT500? I have my car undergoing surgery soon for a complete BMR/Koni suspension upgrade and want to knock out the brakes at the same time to eliminate double work. Also putting an exhaust CAI pulley plugs and tune so before i put some go i want more whoa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
05mustangman Posted December 18, 2014 Report Share Posted December 18, 2014 Well I have the Baer Extreme setup on mine and I can tell you it is a massive improvement over the Brembos. I can't say how much better if any it is over the Wilwoods because I've never had them. But for me, my vote goes to Baer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SVT NAJA Posted December 18, 2014 Report Share Posted December 18, 2014 ^ +1... Baer Extreme's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ViperNC Posted December 18, 2014 Report Share Posted December 18, 2014 I got the Wilwoods for front and rear replacements on mine. Vast improvement over stock and plenty of clearance for a deep dish wheel as the rotor hat design sets the brake calipers further back from stock as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert M Posted December 18, 2014 Report Share Posted December 18, 2014 Bear Extremes on all four corners of my 2008. I recently upgraded from the original Baer 14" front Extremes to the 15". My heavy nosed 2008 GT500 stops very well. R Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbrbear Posted December 19, 2014 Author Report Share Posted December 19, 2014 I had a lengthy conversation with Baer today and they basically said the 14 brembos that come on the car are great brakes and are on about the same level as their pro kit and probably comparable with the wilwood kit. He asked why I felt I needed to upgrade and really best option is the 15" because there will be a significant measurable difference. If I stay with 14's the calipers maybe be a little better but best get better pads... so I guess im gunna settle on the baer's. Wish they would give me a family discount cuz these things are expensive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbrbear Posted December 26, 2014 Author Report Share Posted December 26, 2014 So i ordered the baer extreme front and rear kits with az copper calipers with shelby logos. Two days after my order i noticed my account hadnt been charged so i shot an email to baer asking if they were waiting to charge me and i received an email back stating they made a mistake after completing the process they made a mistake on the military discount and i needed to pay an additional near 900 dollars. I was ready at my max with the agreed price that i provided payment information for but now im busted over the additonal money. Needless to say im less than happy and now back to square one with brakes. Sorry for the rant just made what was gunna be a merry christmas to me a shitty one for the first one ive actually been able to be home for since 2009 due to deployments, duty and training cycles.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ViperNC Posted December 26, 2014 Report Share Posted December 26, 2014 So i ordered the baer extreme front and rear kits with az copper calipers with shelby logos. Two days after my order i noticed my account hadnt been charged so i shot an email to baer asking if they were waiting to charge me and i received an email back stating they made a mistake after completing the process they made a mistake on the military discount and i needed to pay an additional near 900 dollars. I was ready at my max with the agreed price that i provided payment information for but now im busted over the additonal money. Needless to say im less than happy and now back to square one with brakes. Sorry for the rant just made what was gunna be a merry christmas to me a shitty one for the first one ive actually been able to be home for since 2009 due to deployments, duty and training cycles.... That sucks. Sorry to hear about that. Seems they could fall on the sword for the error and make it right. I don't know what the cost for the Baer system is in relation to the Wilwood, but I can tell you I have been extremely pleased. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbrbear Posted December 26, 2014 Author Report Share Posted December 26, 2014 The shit part for me being in the motorcycle industry for 15+ years almost everything between dealer cost and retail has about a 40% mark up some as high as 65% and thats still giving the manufacture a profit. So it would seem to me them eating 10% wouldnt be a thing as im going straight to them and they were charging full retail. Also its not like i am trying to scam them shit they are still getting almost 7k for a brake system. I dont want to go with wilwood so i may just do some minor changes myself like cooling ducts braided lines better fluid and some better bite pads first to see what kind of improvement i get. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kawwy600 Posted December 27, 2014 Report Share Posted December 27, 2014 I also have the Baer extremes on my car and I'm happy. I only upgraded the rotors on the rear because I was informed that increasing caliper size was mainly for cosmetics or track use. All the respondents on your thread have 2012 or older Shelby's that used the 4 piston Brembos so we all have noticed the difference when upgrading to a 6 piston set up. I would recommend you upgrading your rotors and keep the stock calipers. You may be happy with the results. Happy holidays Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbrbear Posted December 27, 2014 Author Report Share Posted December 27, 2014 Kawwy- thanks for the reply. Main reason for caliper upgrade would be to change to a mono block caliper. The stock brembos are great but i did notice even in 4 15 minute track sessions brakes fadding and getting spongy. A lot of that can be fixed i think with better pads braided lines and some dot 5.1 fluid and then adding some cooling ducting. I dont have the track pack so im thinking i can tap into the two outside corners of my lower grill with some bezels from the earlier gt500 then use the ford racing cooling kit which would plumb lines right to my rotor backs vice just a little air directing fin. I really wish i had the room and a lift to do stuff myself like i did with my race bikes... Guess thats why it took me so long to get into cars not only the room to do the work but the cost. I always did my own everything on my bikes. I spose i could take it to base and use the lifts there to play around assuming the arms will clear my side splitters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vapor08GT500 Posted December 27, 2014 Report Share Posted December 27, 2014 Chad, it could be a blessing in disguise for you. Since Todd Gartshore passed away a few years ago (one of the owner's of Baer) the rotors shortly after have gone down in quality and warp with one track day or aggressive driving on the street. They have cheapened their products that used to be excellent. I have removed several sets of Baer's for customers and installed Wilwoods as they are tired of the warped rotors (as am I!!). Baer has done nothing to improve the low quality, import rotors and continue to blame the driver or bedding of the pads/rotors. Those who actually DRIVE their cars hard on a track or aggressively on the street will tell you the same thing. It is a shame as the Baer brakes used to be incredible!! Go with the Wilwoods, or upgrade the stock rotors and lines with braided steel. Make sure they are bled properly and season the rotors and pads correctly. Alex Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert M Posted December 27, 2014 Report Share Posted December 27, 2014 Chad, it could be a blessing in disguise for you. Since Todd Gartshore passed away a few years ago (one of the owner's of Baer) the rotors shortly after have gone down in quality and warp with one track day or aggressive driving on the street. They have cheapened their products that used to be excellent. I have removed several sets of Baer's for customers and installed Wilwoods as they are tired of the warped rotors (as am I!!). Baer has done nothing to improve the low quality, import rotors and continue to blame the driver or bedding of the pads/rotors. Those who actually DRIVE their cars hard on a track or aggressively on the street will tell you the same thing. It is a shame as the Baer brakes used to be incredible!! Go with the Wilwoods, or upgrade the stock rotors and lines with braided steel. Make sure they are bled properly and season the rotors and pads correctly. Alex Alex - Is that the case with the Baer solid/slotted rotors also? I have heard nothing but good results from the OT guys who use the solid slotted Baers vs. the drilled/slotted when the car is put on the track? There is a 2013 owner on another forum who upgraded to 15" solid/slotted Extremes on all four corners, tracks his fully street heavy 2013 often and has had good results. ***I don't see any info. on the solid/slotted rotors on the Baer site, but I know that they have them because they were offered to me when I upgraded to 15". If I remember correctly, the solid/slotted rotors were recommended to me by the Baer rep. over the drilled/slotted if I was going to use my car for competition, and the price was the same for either option. I chose to stay with the drilled/slotted for the 15" fronts since I already have the drilled/slotted 14" rear Extremes and may not upgrade the rears to 15" for my street use. I had no issues with my 14" front Extremes, but they looked a little small when viewed from the side and I just wanted to get a larger rotor inside on my 20" Alcoa's..............fill the gap between the caliper and the inside of the Alcoa's. R Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbrbear Posted December 27, 2014 Author Report Share Posted December 27, 2014 Alex, Thanks for the info last thing i want is warped rotors. Baer is attractive to me in several ways over wilwood. Fit form and function are always priority over beauty however wilwood are only 14's and i dont want smaller rotors and i havent been able to determine that they are a significant improvement over the 2014 stock brembos. Which makes me wonder if a majority of the inprovement really is the lines and pads. Plus I really dont want to go smaller than stock size rotors. Onto the beauty part... I like the color options with baer for the calipers. Since my car is ruby red the red, black red, and silver red calipers will look bad with it. Also like to be able to have the shelby logo. Now maybe someone can point me to specs but 2014 gt500 stock brembo brakes are what size rotors front and rear and also are the calipers mono block? I get really confused because some reading says 15" front 14" rear and front calipers are monoblock then i see 14" front 13" rear calipers non monoblock. Also insee shelby uses wilwood and baer for supersnakes so for a 2013/14 does it provide a measurable increase in stopping power because of better calipers/ rotors? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vapor08GT500 Posted December 28, 2014 Report Share Posted December 28, 2014 Chad, From my experience with quite a few cars, the Wilwood 14" front, 13" rear are considerably better in brake fade, stopping power and pedal feel over the Track Pack 13-14 GT500 15" brakes. 2 of my own cars have this set-up now, 1 with Alcoa's, and they look fine. Obviously slot only for aggressive street and track will be better Baer wise than slotted/drilled. Funny thing though, the slotted/drilled 14" Wilwood's seem to not warp under the same conditions. The dedicated track cars I build really show me what parts and fluids survive under consistent track use, and those that do not. Alex Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert M Posted December 29, 2014 Report Share Posted December 29, 2014 Chad, From my experience with quite a few cars, the Wilwood 14" front, 13" rear are considerably better in brake fade, stopping power and pedal feel over the Track Pack 13-14 GT500 15" brakes. 2 of my own cars have this set-up now, 1 with Alcoa's, and they look fine. Obviously slot only for aggressive street and track will be better Baer wise than slotted/drilled. Funny thing though, the slotted/drilled 14" Wilwood's seem to not warp under the same conditions. The dedicated track cars I build really show me what parts and fluids survive under consistent track use, and those that do not. Alex Alex - From your experience, is there any brake fluid other than moisture obsorbing DOT3 or 4 that works well in our cars to minimize rust in the brake system? I noticed that the DOT5 silicone fluid is not recommended for ABS systems............ R Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbrbear Posted December 29, 2014 Author Report Share Posted December 29, 2014 Robert, Im no expert but from what I understand the problem fluid is the synthetic dot 5 fluid, the 5.1 is non synthetic and completely compatible and can be used in ABS and also can mix with DOT 3 or 4 fluid with no detrimental effects. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert M Posted December 29, 2014 Report Share Posted December 29, 2014 Robert, Im no expert but from what I understand the problem fluid is the synthetic dot 5 fluid, the 5.1 is non synthetic and completely compatible and can be used in ABS and also can mix with DOT 3 or 4 fluid with no detrimental effects. Ok, maybe it is synthetic instead of silicone, I thought I remembered the DOT5 fluid sold by Vette Brakes in St. Pete as being silicone, but that was quite a few years ago. So the DOT5.1, is that only a higher temp advantage? but it still absorbs moisture/humidity just like the other fluids which in turn internally rust the brake system over time? It would be nice to find a brake fluid that preserves the internal workings of the brake system, especially when many $$$ are spent on brake system upgrades. I know flushing the system regularly is a must, and many neglect their brake system, but having a fluid that does not attract moisture from the air would be great!! One other thing I have noticed, as it relates to brakes...............When installing new/thick pads, I have seen the pistons pressed back into the calipers which is required.........but what about all of that contaminated/rusty fluid that is then pushed back into the seals of the master cylinder and it's reservoir?? It almost seems like the more wise approach would be to first flush the system and then push the pistons back into the calipers and install the new pads. All of these brake upgrades are expensive, Wilwood, Baer, or any of them...............Trying to protect that investment will be of Great benefit in the future, but it takes planning now. Here is a link to a brake fluid tech article, the third paragraph talks about DOT5...... http://www.mossmotors.com/SiteGraphics/Pages/brake_fluid/page1.html ^^^I see synthetic mentioned at the beginning of the paragraph and silicone further down........ I guess the fourth paragraph second sentence answers my question about the 5.1 and water absorption. : ( R Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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