speedrx Posted February 3, 2014 Report Share Posted February 3, 2014 Before I would consider this vehicle, I would want before and after pics. Accident history definitely affects value, collectors (and most buyers) are going to want a car with no stories. This will probably go to someone wo wants one to drive (not a bad thing) but will not bring the same $'s as a car without the collision history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twobjshelbys Posted February 3, 2014 Report Share Posted February 3, 2014 Before I would consider this vehicle, I would want before and after pics. Accident history definitely affects value, collectors (and most buyers) are going to want a car with no stories. This will probably go to someone wo wants one to drive (not a bad thing) but will not bring the same $'s as a car without the collision history. This car has a recorded accident. Many are unrecorded. under no circumstances should you buy this car without a pre purchase inspection by a qualified person that can assess the damage and quality of repairs. Frankly I would steer clear even with one since you can find no stories cars for just a few this and more. It wull forever have a stigma assocuated with it abd the spread will increase over time. And with the market adjustment over the past week or so, soon to be lots less Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDB Posted February 4, 2014 Report Share Posted February 4, 2014 The release of KR parts/wheels/etc. is accelerating the devaluing of these cars. How could it not. Forget the right or the wrong of it or who or who is not responsible. It's just a simple fact. When the hoods come out - the value of these cars will be marginally above GT500's. Just watch. And remember the lesson before you drop a big hunk of cash on anything Shelby related. Agree 100% And remember the lesson before you drop a big hunk of cash on anything Shelby related. Worth repeating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jewish Santa Posted February 4, 2014 Author Report Share Posted February 4, 2014 this thread has gained a lot of steam, all good reading . im a very patient man i will find the right kr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
summerrodeo Posted February 9, 2014 Report Share Posted February 9, 2014 Here is another well priced 2009 black KR for 44k. Would consider myself buying but wife says too many toys and Porsche has to go first... http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?listingId=365332189&LNX=MYATCALERTSEMLSRCH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FiaCobra Posted February 9, 2014 Report Share Posted February 9, 2014 Here is another well priced 2009 black KR for 44k. Would consider myself buying but wife says too many toys and Porsche has to go first... http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?listingId=365332189&LNX=MYATCALERTSEMLSRCH The wife unit......sometimes they have too much to say ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REAL ONE Posted February 11, 2014 Report Share Posted February 11, 2014 I think the values of KRs will be fine in the long run and increase in spite of the crap SAI pulled. SS parts are all available separately but you still can't build a SS on your own. Putting KR parts on a Mustang doesn't make it a KR. The only thing that would really kill the KR is if they did another KR. I don't put that beyond them either. Their conduct on the KR parts dumping was a major factor in my buying a Boss 302 recenty as opposed to a comparable Shelby GT 350 and really did turn me off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDB Posted February 11, 2014 Report Share Posted February 11, 2014 The project SAI quoted for me was over $75,000. Glad I didn't pull the trigger. Jer can complain all he wants about not wanting to rehash legacy issues, but if you don't appropriately address them guess what...they never go away. I've been religiously watching the KR market since the auto show and I can tell you exactly when and why the values suddenly dropped to the $50k-$52k mark. It was the first crashed KR and hood pricing debacle. As great as a carbon fiber hood is, people don't want to be jerked around or blatantly-obvious price-gouged. And since even I questioned whether I should get a KR at that time, most other hopeful's moved onto something else at that point. The #1 determining factor for pricing is the supply v. demand ratio...and the demand simply went away. And every instance of disrespect to KR owners not only drops the value of KR's further, but also equals lost sales to the already finite group of people who might buy an expensive Shelby product. On a side note, I'd like to thank the relative on my wife's side who owns a Ford dealership and advised me not to buy a new KR if he had gotten one on lottery. He was smart enough to know that the values would tank even on something being pitched as being as exclusive and limited as the KR. I was ready to spend $10k over, and am glad I waited just a couple years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
svttim Posted February 11, 2014 Report Share Posted February 11, 2014 I don't see a major drop in value due to the parts issues. You cant just look at KR's but the market as a whole. New cars depreciate period. Some will regain value, some never will. I believe the KR will at some point but, with the Government mandating production cars like they do may make that impossible. When everything is electric, what will we do with these cars. JDB, one thing I will agree with you is, I would not have bought the car new. Too much hype, too much money. And, I highly doubt they will ever be close to a standard GT500. Saying the parts will drop them to that level when compared to the number of GT500's that were made and the parts you can still buy to make a car look like a 500 is unrealistic. Buy it to drive it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDB Posted February 11, 2014 Report Share Posted February 11, 2014 I respect your opinion Tim, but I stick by my assertion that the fast and hard price drop happened at the time of the hood debacle. If you want to think that was normal market adjustment, good for you. To clarify, I don't think the recent wheels issue had as significant of effect like the hoods. But if SAI sells KR hoods to the general public, I predict a significant drop in values. A cheaper GT500 will be improved with a KR hood, and a KR will be devalued to slightly more than a GT500 just as frank bullitt stated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REAL ONE Posted February 11, 2014 Report Share Posted February 11, 2014 I don't see a major drop in values. What I see is inconsistently in values. God willing this country will get back on track after the current regime is gone. If not, nothing will be going up in value. With this KR parts dump and from what I understand this new genuine simulated commemorative "Shelby" signature being sold I have had enough of their nonsense and but for being completely turned off I would have bought a GT350 instead of the Boss. They have completely turned me off. I was at one time one of their biggest proponents and fan and even advocate on some sites that were shall we say less than Shelby friendly. Never even got a so much as a thank you from anyone at SAI but instead a parts dump on a car that was supposed to have exclusive parts. Still pisses me off. Glad I bought the Boss instead. As much performance naturally aspirated in a less expensive package and likely truly limited and special run with a great legacy. I doubt Ford will be doing another Boss in that they said this was the last and they are on to the Mach 1 and new GT350. Those with current GT350s from Shelby who are "celebrating the end of GT350 production" and think they have the last of breed and have what Shelby said would be a limited run vehicle will be sorely disappointed and won't be very happy when they start seeing Shelbyized Ford GT350s over taking them and being pumped out of SAI. If you don't think that's gonna happen I need some of whatever it is your smoking. Get the popcorn ready guys for when that happens cause its a come'n. My take. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frank bullitt Posted February 13, 2014 Report Share Posted February 13, 2014 I think the KR lost a great deal of its mystique with the parts dump. I also agree guy who hit the deer and parted out his KR after learning the price of the hood might have been the beginning of the end. I just can't see why someone would pony up and spend for Shelby exclusivity if they know about the KR program and what eventual took place. I believe protecting the KR was protecting the brand. I followed the program for a long time and was convinced the protection was real. So I jumped aboard. Only two companies are ever involved. Ford and Shelby. If either decides not to protect the brand, the customer takes a hit. Both companies are naïve to believe they can walk away unharmed. If I don't buy a Shelby, I don't buy a Ford. if I don't buy a Ford, I don't buy a Shelby. Real One's purchasing choice - Boss over a 350 is what I'd be concerned about if I was Shelby. Real One, a loyalist, is one step out the door. Isn't it the loyalists who shell out for these high ticket items? Cash for part upgrades? Sure. But who in there right mind gives Ford or Shelby cash for exclusivity now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REAL ONE Posted February 13, 2014 Report Share Posted February 13, 2014 As Frank Bullit said the decision to dump one of the cornerstone exclusive parts (KR wheels) of the KR on the general public, or from what I have concluded SAI's involvement in it, which is based on the negative inferences I have drawn is based on the fact that SAI refused to explain (and continues to refuse to explain) what happened and was asked to over and over. It's hard to believe such a mass sale of the KR wheels would happen without SAI decision or their input or approval or prior knowledge. I clearly saw this refusal to explain to KR owners what happened and the parts dump as total disrespect for us or lack of interest or concern. The silence on this issue continues and will continue because I would venture to say that SAI likely can say nothing good about it. SAI can quickly shed very bright light on what happened but choose not to. As I recall we were told the KR had exclusive parts that would remain exclusive to the KR and their owners. Someone broke that representation or totally disregarded that it was made. Who is the $64,000.00 question. The sale could have been announced to us as KR owners first and at least give KR owners First crack at the wheels at a discounted price. I even over a year ago spoke to a least two persons in right positions at SAI to suggest that a KR "Power Pack" be offered to owners and sold to owners directly for their own installation with an official certificate and registry for Power Pack owners now that the KR's are out of warranty and the restriction of only offering the previous power "upfitter package" install only at SAI was history likely so restricted to SAI installation due to warranty issues or just concerns that the increase in power etc.. would lead to more warranty claims and to offer an extra set of KR wheels at a discount to kit purchasers. I though this would be highly desired by KR owners looking to upgrade power to SS territory with a SAI sanctioned and official power pack kit and move a lot of inventory off SAI shelves. A win win. Great idea I was told! Cricket, cricket. Nothing ever happened. I even followed up a number of times. Nothing except a KR parts offering to the public as a surprise! Sigh. In my book, not a way to treat customers, loyal Shelby fans and the like. Hey, maybe its just me. Now they are selling genuine simulated Carroll Shelby signatures. I don't know again maybe it's me. Just seems silly and brassy to me. I think the their parts are very expensive too. Regardless, the KR is still special despite all this. KR parts being sold to the public aside, no one can recreate a genuine KR except Shelby. So some guy buying KR wheels an putting them on his standard GT500 or Mustang GT doesn't worry me in fact it's a form of flattery as far as the KR is concerned. Just about every part you need to build a Super Snake is available for purchase from SAI but you can't build a genuine SS yourself. However, if Shelby decides to build another KR that would without any doubt torpedo the 2008-2009 KR completely. Absent SAI offering a new KR I think the KR will eclipse the SS in years to come for a number of reasons despite SAI. Super Snakes are still being pumped out in all kinds of variations, years, colors, wide bodies, etc... and they will continue to be made into the foreseeable future by SAI as long as orders come in. My decision to sell the KR has nothing to do with the selling of the KR wheels to the public. I really love the car and it is a great car. I was just running out of room for cars with the new Boss and wavering on buying a Porsche Carrera GTS with the aero cup package. I am still really on the fence as to selling the KR but if a buyer came forward with $59,900.00 (which I believe is the right price for an original stock Torch Red KR with only 2500 miles) I would sell it. Not a dime less since I am looking for any excuse not to sell it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDB Posted February 14, 2014 Report Share Posted February 14, 2014 I agree with a lot of the points you guys are making. In a similar scenario, here's my opinion of what will happen in the near future regarding the hoods: Because of the court case, we can estimate that SAI paid $3,000/ea and has maybe 100 extra hoods. Aside from the physical warehouse space that costs money AND the fact that it's a $300,000 stack of product that won't sell, how long do you think SAI will want to keep paying the annual inventory tax on that $300,000? Answer: not long. But selling them to KR owners at a discount goes against their very business model of brand-hyped prices, which is a problem. The likely solution mirrors what Ford did with the wheels because it's the easiest way out... At some point SAI will sell the stack of hoods to a liquidator like Mike for $0.20 on the dollar. They will take a one-time write-down for accounting, and try to let someone else take the heat for selling the hoods to the public. The only question is when, and how much flack they think they will get from KR owners who understand what they're doing. The first ones to the public will be around $1,500 so they can quickly recover a good chunk of their investment, then raise the price to $2,500 to sit on the rest...every one being pure profit at that point. Of course, a better solution would be for SAI to offer hoods to KR owners for a 6 month period, $2,000 raw or $3,000 turn-key (painted/striped/logos/pins/delivered) with the disclaimer that any unsold hood after 6 months would go to the general public. I'm not going to hold my breath on that one since it's technically sold at a loss (but very close to break-even). The last "discounted" price I got from SAI was $4,675 and I doubt there's many KR owners buying an extra at that price. They have to add value by making them turn-key and delivered close to Shelby's cost to make KR owners want to spend money just to have an extra "just in case". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Beyond Posted February 14, 2014 Report Share Posted February 14, 2014 These are all great points guys. Somehow, our KRs just don't feel as special anymore. I know I will be selling/trading mine on a 13/14 GT500. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FCCOBRAJET Posted February 14, 2014 Report Share Posted February 14, 2014 I do not see what the big concern is . Shelby cars have been duplicated since the first GT350 hit the streets .1968 GT500KR'S were duplicated Cobra kit car's are everywhere. The real ones will always bring top money. It makes my KR feel special because you couldn't make it real GT500KR in 1968 and you can't make a real 2008 GT500KR today. If some one drives around in a imitation so be it. Remember the old saying that imitation is the best form of flattery. I can say mine is real and they can't Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
08KR525 Posted February 14, 2014 Report Share Posted February 14, 2014 I've read where the molds to these hoods still exists and that it may be possible to get a hood made. That would throw a curve in this situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
08KR525 Posted February 14, 2014 Report Share Posted February 14, 2014 As far as another KR being produced, I kinda doubt it. When I contacted Ford (numerous times and through different departments) about offering COAs for these cars I was met with an almost disdain for the KR package. They kept saying that it was a SAI deal and that FORD really had no say in it even though I pointed out that this car was sold new as it stands from the dealerships unlike the SS package. Somehow I don't think FORD deemed the KR program a success. You couldn't even get the ESP on one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShelbyKR664 Posted February 14, 2014 Report Share Posted February 14, 2014 I will buy a new KR hood for $1500 and hang it in my office. Piece of art to me. Objects of desire will always duplicated. Rolex watches, 427 Cobras, Alcoa wheels, Yenko Camaro's, 65-66 GT350's ,68 KR's are all being re- created or built as tributes to the originals. I don't think any of the previously mentioned have had their value harmed as a result. I am fortunate and proud to own an original KR and if my neighbor wants to build a KR from a 08 V6 Stang and build it from a parts dump from SAI, go for it. Mine will always be original and his will not. I did not buy my KR as an investment. I bought it to drive and enjoy. If I have to sell one day, I will just be happy with what the market bears and move on to the next chapter. Not much I can do about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDB Posted February 14, 2014 Report Share Posted February 14, 2014 They kept saying that it was a SAI deal... Somehow I don't think FORD deemed the KR program a success. Ford's business model is volume, not limited runs. The success of the Mustang from the beginning was based on its fair price points. Shelby's business model is the exact opposite: low volume, charge as much as the customer will bear and then some. The KR was definitely an SAI deal. I love my KR. I have no intentions of selling my KR. None of these issues make me look at the car differently. I actually enjoy driving it more knowing it does not have a larger monetary value. I am an enthusiast owner. My disdain is for the way Shelby does business and its history of handling situations poorly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
08KR525 Posted February 14, 2014 Report Share Posted February 14, 2014 I too enjoy my KRs. I'm comfortable with the price that I had to give for them and still chuckle when other Shelby enthusiasts ask what they are. I have modded them to my liking (TVS, 20" Alcoas, etc..) and drive them when I can. I agree with others that in the end the real KRs will still hold their value better than a clone. Like it has been said, look at how many "tribute" '67-'68 Shelby Mustangs are running around and the real ones still bring strong money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShelbyKR664 Posted February 14, 2014 Report Share Posted February 14, 2014 I actually think the parts dump may eventually bring prices back up as the supply/demand theory takes effect. Demand will eat up the supply and thus make it very limited and expensive to acquire parts down the road. Cloning will make little to no sense financially. I have a 66 K code fastback. Back in the late 90's when I started to restore my car, original parts were hard to find but available. You could find them at swap meets and on Ebay with just a little effort. Today, you are lucky if you find any original "K" code part such as a 4 blade fan or 8k tach. As a result, my car keeps going up in value. Since I completed the restoration 7 years ago, my car is worth $12k more than my original appraisal. If I took my original parts off the car and sold separately, I would more than double or triple my money I paid for those. How much would a original KR CF hoods or 18" Alcoa KR wheels go for in 10 yrs??? Hard to say but I bet they will be worth more than today's value. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REAL ONE Posted February 14, 2014 Report Share Posted February 14, 2014 I actually think the parts dump may eventually bring prices back up as the supply/demand theory takes effect. Demand will eat up the supply and thus make it very limited and expensive to acquire parts down the road. Cloning will make little to no sense financially. I have a 66 K code fastback. Back in the late 90's when I started to restore my car, original parts were hard to find but available. You could find them at swap meets and on Ebay with just a little effort. Today, you are lucky if you find any original "K" code part such as a 4 blade fan or 8k tach. As a result, my car keeps going up in value. Since I completed the restoration 7 years ago, my car is worth $12k more than my original appraisal. If I took my original parts off the car and sold separately, I would more than double or triple my money I paid for those. How much would a original KR CF hoods or 18" Alcoa KR wheels go for in 10 yrs??? Hard to say but I bet they will be worth more than today's value. Great point. You can clone a KR but it will never be a KR. Period. End of story. Still believe the KR values will eclipse Supersnake values in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDB Posted February 14, 2014 Report Share Posted February 14, 2014 I agree. But they haven't hit anywhere near bottom yet and it will be a LONG time (decades) before they rise to respectable levels again. Don't be near-sighted like Shelby's "instant collectible" marketing ploy wants you to believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldlugs Posted February 14, 2014 Report Share Posted February 14, 2014 I agree. But they haven't hit anywhere near bottom yet and it will be a LONG time (decades) before they rise to respectable levels again. Don't be near-sighted like Shelby's "instant collectible" marketing ploy wants you to believe. I think talk like the above will actually help the cars become more valuable in the long run. If more folks think that KRs aren't so special, more will become modified, abused, trashed and resold. Eventually very few nice ones will be left, out of the 1700 or so made. I think people will spend more looking for a clean one. Good thinking, JDB; thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
08KR525 Posted February 14, 2014 Report Share Posted February 14, 2014 For me personally I would prefer a tastefully modified car that has parts that may no longer be available and includes all the original parts as well, over a 100% stock specimen. For instance a factory dual quad intake installed on Boss 429. It's these kinds of things that separate your cars from all the rest. The FRPP TVS has been discontinued as well as the 20" Alcoas, but to each his own. I bought mine for my enjoyment and not as an investment as I plan on passing them on to my son's when I'm done with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
judgeman6970 Posted February 14, 2014 Report Share Posted February 14, 2014 I don't own a KR(yet), but I do think they're still a very cool car, my personal favorite being red. Imo, I think the real problem is that the car, along with many other "special late-model shelbys", was over-priced to begin with. I think the KR is a special car, and will hold its value better than most cars, its just that, in the used car market, it needed a pretty large "market-adjustment" right up-front. Clones are a fact of life(the GTO "Judge" being a good example), but the real thing is still the real thing... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FiaCobra Posted February 15, 2014 Report Share Posted February 15, 2014 Well, count me as one of the "lucky ones". When the KR first came out, I gave it a quick glance at the NY Auto Show but really didn't show much interest because I already owned a brand new '08 GT-500 and the price (and markup) on the KR simply turned me off. Nearly 2 years later, I find a new '09 Vista Blue KR sitting on a showroom floor with 9 miles on the odometer. By this time, the economy tanked and the car just sat there. I made an offer and took that car home and paid close to what used ones are going for today ! To be honest, I really don't care what this car may be worth 10 or 20 years down the road. I'll never sell it. I did not buy it as an investment, I bought it to enjoy. You want to buy an investment? I'd recommend real estate. Stay away from cars, they are terrible investments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FCCOBRAJET Posted February 15, 2014 Report Share Posted February 15, 2014 I own a 1969 Mach1 428 r code, 1993 triple black Mustang GT convertible, 2003 Mach 1, 2007 GT500, 2008 GT500KR. I have these cars because I enjoy them I love driving them .As for values what happens happens I don't keep them for that I just enjoy them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShelbyKR664 Posted February 15, 2014 Report Share Posted February 15, 2014 Amen brother! Nice collection of Stangs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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