DubbsFaris Posted January 19, 2011 Report Share Posted January 19, 2011 Well, along with having a few things hashed out on my car and getting it dialed in just right, I tried to give as many rides and test drives as humanly possible. BUT, that said, we were descreetly keeping track and data logging and really flogging the hell out of the car to see just what the GT350's capabilities are. So here are the nuts and bolts and details of what we found out. A GT500 supersnake 725 with probably the best driver I know does laps of 2:12 on the track with race tires and a harness. We decided to use that as a baseline for our numbers, because it is very hard to measure against anything else apples to apples. The Falcon race car was averaging laps of just about 2 minutes flat. Those of you who have seen this car at all the bashes know it is the best car out there consistently, and that guy can friggin drive! My GT350 with Jeff Harris (SVOC) behind the wheel was turning 2:04 to 2:05 lap times depending on heat soak and time on the track (with me near 285 lbs. in the passenger seat). My car has the stock Goodyear F1 supercar G2 tires. They are quite slippery when cold, so it would take an average of 3 laps to get them to grip at optimum. We were running them at 33psi after my spinout with the tires at 45psi. Dont know how it happened. I put them at 35psi, but that changed after just 2 laps. So my first advice is to take two easy laps, bring it in and check the pressure, or use Nitrogen to fill your tires to keep a constant psi. The car was slightly pushing through the turns, but we also did not adjust the camber on the front wheels, and Gary Patterson recommends a 3 degree adjustment for track use. I only have the front brakes and we had no issues at all. They are more than enough for 20 minute lap sessions. Gearing seems to be a slight issue. I am going to raise my rear end gearing to 3.55s to see how this affects the performance. In the front straight, we were in 4th gear hitting 120mph and the rev limiter which I have raised to 7200rpms, but feel like we might get a little more out of it going to the larger gears. Torque and Horpsepower are no issue, so there shouldnt be a negative affect. Even on the street, you are already in 5th gear once you hit 70 at about 4000rpms, as Tony can probably attest to as well. This is in stark contrast to the GT500 3.31 rears where you drop to 3rd to do a 60 mph pass on the street. If I did that in the 350, I would probably already be on the limiter. Other issues- the clutch pedal issue is present. It would drop to the floor and not return. This is due to the fact that the stock brake fluid is getting too hot and we need to change that out to a performance fluid, and it should help both braking and clutch return. (They use the same reservoir) Also, this car is not cone friendly. If you hit a cone, you WILL have broken pieces, so avoid them if you can. The body does just fine, but the front splitter will break and the brake cooling ducts under the car may break too. Just dont hit cones. What would I change? If my car had track tires and a racing harness, it would be untouchable. Change the camber and you have one hell of a machine! Engine ran flawlessly, even on 91, and heatsoak was not even an issue. Loosing less than 1 second on 20 minutes of hard driving, and I dont even have the cooling upgrade. Temperature was around 55-65 F. Fun factor? Off the charts. Taking a street car and dominating on the track is just icing on the cake, but this car is FUN! It does have more power under the 624 tune than the car can handle. You cant just mash the pedal, but a good driver will appreciate the extra power. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MY500SS Posted January 19, 2011 Report Share Posted January 19, 2011 Well, along with having a few things hashed out on my car and getting it dialed in just right, I tried to give as many rides and test drives as humanly possible. BUT, that said, we were descreetly keeping track and data logging and really flogging the hell out of the car to see just what the GT350's capabilities are. So here are the nuts and bolts and details of what we found out. A GT500 supersnake 725 with probably the best driver I know does laps of 2:12 on the track with race tires and a harness. We decided to use that as a baseline for our numbers, because it is very hard to measure against anything else apples to apples. The Falcon race car was averaging laps of just about 2 minutes flat. Those of you who have seen this car at all the bashes know it is the best car out there consistently, and that guy can friggin drive! My GT350 with Jeff Harris (SVOC) behind the wheel was turning 2:04 to 2:05 lap times depending on heat soak and time on the track (with me near 285 lbs. in the passenger seat). My car has the stock Goodyear F1 supercar G2 tires. They are quite slippery when cold, so it would take an average of 3 laps to get them to grip at optimum. We were running them at 33psi after my spinout with the tires at 45psi. Dont know how it happened. I put them at 35psi, but that changed after just 2 laps. So my first advice is to take two easy laps, bring it in and check the pressure, or use Nitrogen to fill your tires to keep a constant psi. The car was slightly pushing through the turns, but we also did not adjust the camber on the front wheels, and Gary Patterson recommends a 3 degree adjustment for track use. I only have the front brakes and we had no issues at all. They are more than enough for 20 minute lap sessions. Gearing seems to be a slight issue. I am going to raise my rear end gearing to 3.55s to see how this affects the performance. In the front straight, we were in 4th gear hitting 120mph and the rev limiter which I have raised to 7200rpms, but feel like we might get a little more out of it going to the larger gears. Torque and Horpsepower are no issue, so there shouldnt be a negative affect. Even on the street, you are already in 5th gear once you hit 70 at about 4000rpms, as Tony can probably attest to as well. This is in stark contrast to the GT500 3.31 rears where you drop to 3rd to do a 60 mph pass on the street. If I did that in the 350, I would probably already be on the limiter. Other issues- the clutch pedal issue is present. It would drop to the floor and not return. This is due to the fact that the stock brake fluid is getting too hot and we need to change that out to a performance fluid, and it should help both braking and clutch return. (They use the same reservoir) Also, this car is not cone friendly. If you hit a cone, you WILL have broken pieces, so avoid them if you can. The body does just fine, but the front splitter will break and the brake cooling ducts under the car may break too. Just dont hit cones. What would I change? If my car had track tires and a racing harness, it would be untouchable. Change the camber and you have one hell of a machine! Engine ran flawlessly, even on 91, and heatsoak was not even an issue. Loosing less than 1 second on 20 minutes of hard driving, and I dont even have the cooling upgrade. Temperature was around 55-65 F. Fun factor? Off the charts. Taking a street car and dominating on the track is just icing on the cake, but this car is FUN! It does have more power under the 624 tune than the car can handle. You cant just mash the pedal, but a good driver will appreciate the extra power. Great write up Warren.....thanks. Sorry to hear about the cones and the 45 psi spin which was fun to watch. Some track tires at around 28 psi will help your times.......along with the mentioned camber adjustment you'll have a fantastic machine my friend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FiaCobra Posted January 20, 2011 Report Share Posted January 20, 2011 Great write up. I too ate some cones on the back straight after NordicShelby went through there sideways....lol I had a rental so some elbow grease got the marks off the bumper. I did have to re-secure the chin spoiler with a few screws. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shel-b001 Posted January 20, 2011 Report Share Posted January 20, 2011 Just think by next year you will be running 2min . times . All in all sounds like you enjoyed it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stngfever Posted January 20, 2011 Report Share Posted January 20, 2011 Great write up. I too ate some cones on the back straight after NordicShelby went through there sideways....lol I had a rental so some elbow grease got the marks off the bumper. I did have to re-secure the chin spoiler with a few screws. Nordic sideways Why does that not surprise me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SVOC Posted January 20, 2011 Report Share Posted January 20, 2011 Few few other comments on this matter is: The Ford Traction Lok does not, and never has held up very well to road tracks, with this said the one on Warren's car is GONE, it is a one wheel peeler now, a formidable locker would make a HUGE difference on the track being able to plant the power down much earlier coming out of the corners, other wise you have to selfdiscipline your foot to apply the power. Rear axle seals may turn out to be a concern also as the right rear one started to leak, different sysnthetic fluid with better heat disapation properties may cure this. Pending on how you like your car set-up, a softer setting on the front sway bar is in order, since the rear bar is not adjustable, the car is safe for intermediates, with the push, but be VERY forewarned that the snap over-steer is/and can be very violent, taking you off track or looking the other way without being able to catch the car, with brake or throttle. High temp brake fluid is a MUST, half of the sessions where driven like a truck, using no clutch pedal at all, this condition usally happens right after being hard on the loud peadal, as the conduction of heat soaks the slave cylinder, and Ooooop's no clutch!!, just bleeding the system will not render a fix, "You Must Cycle ALL of the Fluid Out of the Slave" this can be done by removing the transmission or drilling a hole in the bell housing and manually cycling the slave with a pry bar, with the supply hose disconnected, this is a deadhead system, you can't just suck the fluid out. Never once did I enccur a heat soak condidtion with the engine, but did see up rated cooling temps, cooling sytem upgrade or not these cars need an oil cooler, I have two other cases, with N/A cars with upgraded cooling systems that didn't get back to normal on the track till the oil cooler was installed. Adjustable dampners would be the cat's ass for finite tuning of the suspension and with upgraded upper and lower control arms the minimal rear defelction would be eliminated. Out of the box this is a mean machine, and once the tires are warmed, is a hoot + 1 to fling around the track, yes as mentioned above, gear, tires, cambered, a harness, and the other things that need to be attended too, this thing will give you the feeling of Godzilla in Tokyo. Now not everyone is going to take they're GT350 to this extreme state on the track, but for those of you who do tend to push it to that point, the above things should be seriously considered, and minuimun duely noted. I appreciate Warrnen letting me push the limits of his car all week long at the track, it was full of data that I can pass on to others, and use to make his car even that much better/faster, to me is was a two day labratory of information, but yes I will admit there was maybe a scoasch bit of fun on the side. On a personal note, I loved the fact there was no blower whine to drowned out the exhaust note :happy feet: Jeff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SVOC Posted January 20, 2011 Report Share Posted January 20, 2011 I should probably mention that with "Advance Tac" in the off position, I belive the car is much more controllable to drive point in case: With it on, if you squeeze the throttle in exit of a turn at speed, and you break the tires loose it will quickly close the throttle upsetting the balance of the car causing you to have to do some piloting manuvers to keep it from getting away from you. (Tail coming around) The brake had a firm pedal with excellent modulation, and predictabillity of pending lock-up at the limit rushing up on a turn in. Only once did the pedal drop a little due to heat, and in that case is was only a slight amount with very little concern of not having them in the next braking zone, I know for a fact Warren never knew this was happening as a passenger, and the brakes recovered at the second turn after this since I layed off of them a little. That is an easy fix with a fluid change, again. It would have been really nice to have driven an N/A car, seeing as though you would have been able to stay in the throttle more and a slight bit of less weight on the nose, and has to use the "Carry Momentum Technique" to keep the speed up, in thereory this could have made the N/A car had faster lap times, cause with a blown car you relying on the power to get you back to speed (you could apply the same N/A driving technique but you forget with all that power), either way would have nice to see the difference. All in all, a really nice, nice package, and one that really delivers, "Riced out Mustang GT" as someone said in a another thread, this it is NOT, a turn key performer, yes this IS!! To be able to take this to the track, and litterally shake down this thing right out of the box for two days, and basically drive it home hits high marks on everyones books, including mine. Make note this that even though this car replicated the GT350 of yor, even those cars where not of the floor ready for the track, so don't go in thinking this is a turn key track car, special preperation is ALWAYS needed for any car that is going to see serious track duty. But for what was delivered........... Great work Shelby Jeff, no one special, just a guy who drives a 25 year old truck, so what would I know? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mywickedshelby Posted January 20, 2011 Report Share Posted January 20, 2011 great write up......... do any of these look familiar? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MY500SS Posted January 20, 2011 Report Share Posted January 20, 2011 Great stuff Jeff............this is the kinda info I like to see. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SVOC Posted January 20, 2011 Report Share Posted January 20, 2011 Thanks for this pictures Mike, those look great!!!!!! And your welcome on the insight, I really hope it helps, and doesn't hender, please take it as positive criticism, as like mentioned above, most would never ever drive they're GT350's nearly that hard. Jeff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SVOC Posted January 20, 2011 Report Share Posted January 20, 2011 On a funny note, the guys working the corner on the far, far end sure did like it when Jeff and I were ""Show Boating" around that corner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vapor08GT500 Posted January 21, 2011 Report Share Posted January 21, 2011 Great write ups Warren and Jeff. Great to see you both again as always!!! Awesome driving and GT350!!! :happy feet: Alex Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffJ Posted January 21, 2011 Report Share Posted January 21, 2011 On a funny note, the guys working the corner on the far, far end sure did like it when Jeff and I were ""Show Boating" around that corner Yea I think the guys on that corner were into a little bit of drifting!! Good time. Thanks for the great ride! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tony356 Posted January 21, 2011 Report Share Posted January 21, 2011 Warren and Jeff, thanks for the review. Points duly noted regarding brake fluid, pressures, etc. Hopefully my car will be repaired in time for the pocono event so I can add my own review. I would love to beat on a few race cars at 55-65 degrees and not worry about over heating a motor - especially some air cooled pcars. It seems like at the east coast road courses it is always 90 and humid. Warren, Agree on the gearing. During my cross country jaunt home it did take some getting used to the gearing and I thought with all the owed that running out of gear on the track might be an issue. I'll just have to deal with it - someday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
svttim Posted January 22, 2011 Report Share Posted January 22, 2011 Might as well add my review. I was able to keep pace with Mike (falcon) with Warens car and with Shannons GT500 SVT. With Shannons car, the advance track was on which, i felt was something that slowed it down a bit. The car was pretty well stock, SVT has done a great job with this car. Warrens GT350 was a great ride as well. It was easier to drive faster that the 500, some of that was the advance track issue. The front rotors were well warped by the time I got in, the clutch made regular trips to the floor without returning. We were faster than Mike and were actually doing well with Paul Brown (Boss 302s Proto) but, the car shut itself off in one corner. We were still catching mike but, he was too far ahead by this time and, that man and car is fast! The GT350 did not feel like it had 624 hoursepower but, the power was so smooth, I think its deceptive. Overall, a great track car Thanks for letting me take her for a spin Warren Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tony356 Posted January 22, 2011 Report Share Posted January 22, 2011 Might as well add my review. I was able to keep pace with Mike (falcon) with Warens car and with Shannons GT500 SVT. With Shannons car, the advance track was on which, i felt was something that slowed it down a bit. The car was pretty well stock, SVT has done a great job with this car. Warrens GT350 was a great ride as well. It was easier to drive faster that the 500, some of that was the advance track issue. The front rotors were well warped by the time I got in, the clutch made regular trips to the floor without returning. We were faster than Mike and were actually doing well with Paul Brown (Boss 302s Proto) but, the car shut itself off in one corner. We were still catching mike but, he was too far ahead by this time and, that man and car is fast! The GT350 did not feel like it had 624 hoursepower but, the power was so smooth, I think its deceptive. Overall, a great track car Thanks for letting me take her for a spin Warren Shut off? Why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DubbsFaris Posted January 22, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 22, 2011 Dont know why that happened, but it did happen when I spun out as well. So Im not sure what the issue is. I did notice another new problem today. I tried to fill it up with gas today and the pump kept shutting off. I also got a strange fuel spill code. Im not sure if a hose got kinked or came loose or it was a faulty pump I was using. More on that at my next fill. Again, the clutch uses the brake hydraulic fluid, so that MUST be changed out before you track it. Now, Tim and Jeff were floggin the ever livin you know what out of the car, because, obviously, if it breaks, all they have to do is throw me the keys and say "thanks for the ride", but none of that happened when I drove it, and strangely enough, I have absolutely ZERO vibration in the brakes today, and I did as aggresive stopping as I possibly could on the streets today. Gary Davis did mention to me that the rotors sometimes seem to warp when they get hot, and then straighten when they cool off. I have never experienced that previously, but Jeff said the same thing about the vibration and I did everything but straight up lock them up today and there was just no vibration whatsoever. Now my tires? They are shot. I now have slicks. So now Im thinking I will get a second set of rims and tires, and keep these wheels and tires for the track because my rims have rock chips and scratches and my tires look like $h1t. But, if you track it, its not going to stay pretty very long. Well, if you track it like SOME people, it wont. I drive my car on the track and have fun, but I dont drive it like that exactly. I guess once you have driven competition driving, its just not something you can turn off. Every time I saw Jeff drive into the pits, I noticed he was looking around like the topless girls and the media were gonna run over to do an interview while he chugged a bottle of milk on the podium. I guess it gave me a little insight to why Rick Titus runs me off the track in group 2 every year. Jeff and Tim, dont get me wrong, it was fun to watch what the car can do, and Im just playing with you guys to a certain extent, but I think its kind of like going out with some friends back in high school I never hung out with and Im innocent and naive thinking we are gonna go shoot some pool and drink some beer, and the guy driving shouts "you boys ready to go to Mexico?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SGT/SC#0471 Posted January 22, 2011 Report Share Posted January 22, 2011 Try some BFG KDW N2's mine hold up very well on track days...I also have ATE super blue in my system...NO FADE whatsoever with back to back sessions nailing brakes and clutch hard....I did install some cooling ducts and Ferrodo DS2500 pads...perfect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khood1 Posted January 22, 2011 Report Share Posted January 22, 2011 Just an FYI on the fuel spill. I had the same problem with my 2010 GT500. I noticed it not long after I had a JBA X-pipe installed. The shop that does the work on my car said they have seen this with several 2010+ mustang GTs. Even those with stock exhaust. In my case it turned out the heat from pipe was too much for insulation which caused the sensor to read the tank as full when it was not. So my suggestion would be to get your car on a lift and check the insulation along your exhaust line. It's a cheap fix but you have to put the car on a lift to find and fix the problem. I hope this helps. Dont know why that happened, but it did happen when I spun out as well. So Im not sure what the issue is. I did notice another new problem today. I tried to fill it up with gas today and the pump kept shutting off. I also got a strange fuel spill code. Im not sure if a hose got kinked or came loose or it was a faulty pump I was using. More on that at my next fill. Again, the clutch uses the brake hydraulic fluid, so that MUST be changed out before you track it. Now, Tim and Jeff were floggin the ever livin you know what out of the car, because, obviously, if it breaks, all they have to do is throw me the keys and say "thanks for the ride", but none of that happened when I drove it, and strangely enough, I have absolutely ZERO vibration in the brakes today, and I did as aggresive stopping as I possibly could on the streets today. Gary Davis did mention to me that the rotors sometimes seem to warp when they get hot, and then straighten when they cool off. I have never experienced that previously, but Jeff said the same thing about the vibration and I did everything but straight up lock them up today and there was just no vibration whatsoever. Now my tires? They are shot. I now have slicks. So now Im thinking I will get a second set of rims and tires, and keep these wheels and tires for the track because my rims have rock chips and scratches and my tires look like $h1t. But, if you track it, its not going to stay pretty very long. Well, if you track it like SOME people, it wont. I drive my car on the track and have fun, but I dont drive it like that exactly. I guess once you have driven competition driving, its just not something you can turn off. Every time I saw Jeff drive into the pits, I noticed he was looking around like the topless girls and the media were gonna run over to do an interview while he chugged a bottle of milk on the podium. I guess it gave me a little insight to why Rick Titus runs me off the track in group 2 every year. Jeff and Tim, dont get me wrong, it was fun to watch what the car can do, and Im just playing with you guys to a certain extent, but I think its kind of like going out with some friends back in high school I never hung out with and Im innocent and naive thinking we are gonna go shoot some pool and drink some beer, and the guy driving shouts "you boys ready to go to Mexico?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
svttim Posted January 22, 2011 Report Share Posted January 22, 2011 Try some BFG KDW N2's mine hold up very well on track days...I also have ATE super blue in my system...NO FADE whatsoever with back to back sessions nailing brakes and clutch hard....I did install some cooling ducts and Ferrodo DS2500 pads...perfect. Your better off with different wheels and tires for track days. If legal, Call Rehagen Racing and get a set of the Boss 302 comp wheels, 18 X 10 for 2200 then a set of decent track tires. I have used the ATE product and was happy with it. Now Jeff and I did got a lot out of the car. With R compounds, good brakes and no clutch issues, I would have ran Paul down too, well, maybe . And niether Jeff or I went 4 wheelin . Besides Warren, the car has a reputation to live up too! Thanks again Bud. Very generous of you!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SGT/SC#0471 Posted January 22, 2011 Report Share Posted January 22, 2011 I agree Tim, as long as you have a tow set up. I drive mine on the street to track and back...maybe a set would fit in the rear? haha! Cool, nice to meet you at the bash as well man!! GT350 rally cars next right? ;@) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
svttim Posted January 22, 2011 Report Share Posted January 22, 2011 I agree Tim, as long as you have a tow set up. I drive mine on the street to track and back...maybe a set would fit in the rear? haha! Cool, nice to meet you at the bash as well man!! GT350 rally cars next right? ;@) Point well taken. I gave up driving to the track years ago, wife made me. Said we were not getting stuck anywhere with a broken car Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SGT/SC#0471 Posted January 23, 2011 Report Share Posted January 23, 2011 Sounds killer to me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SGT/SC#0471 Posted January 23, 2011 Report Share Posted January 23, 2011 In my mind if I was towing a rig Id just buy a dedicated purpose built race car...like a late model stock car or a full caged roadcourse car etc... But sayong that after going uhaul to Vegas to avoid the snow passes I could see a set of race tires and an enclosed trailer for the car... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
svttim Posted January 23, 2011 Report Share Posted January 23, 2011 In my mind if I was towing a rig Id just buy a dedicated purpose built race car...like a late model stock car or a full caged roadcourse car etc... But sayong that after going uhaul to Vegas to avoid the snow passes I could see a set of race tires and an enclosed trailer for the car... I hope to haul out next year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
COBRA SCOTTY Posted January 23, 2011 Report Share Posted January 23, 2011 Awesome info and write guys. Thanks for letting us know what needs to be done to prep for race day. Scotty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SVOC Posted January 24, 2011 Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 but I think its kind of like going out with some friends back in high school I never hung out with and Im innocent and naive thinking we are gonna go shoot some pool and drink some beer, and the guy driving shouts "you boys ready to go to Mexico?" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vaDboRMB7xE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DubbsFaris Posted January 24, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vaDboRMB7xE Meow, what makes you think I had that movie in mind? You meow know what it was like to watch Jeff drive my car. Meow dont deny it Jeff, you drove my car much harder than that police cruise was being driven! And thats all I have to say about that meow. Oh, and MEOW! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
svttim Posted January 30, 2011 Report Share Posted January 30, 2011 Meow, what makes you think I had that movie in mind? You meow know what it was like to watch Jeff drive my car. Meow dont deny it Jeff, you drove my car much harder than that police cruise was being driven! And thats all I have to say about that meow. Oh, and MEOW! I did notice Jeff was a bit out of control Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DubbsFaris Posted January 30, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 30, 2011 Yeah, restrain is not in his vocabulary. Its kind of like giving rocks to a window installer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.