bpmurr Posted June 10, 2010 Author Report Share Posted June 10, 2010 The service manager sent over pictures to SVT this morning. It seems they are interested in this case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ripcurrent Posted June 10, 2010 Report Share Posted June 10, 2010 Did they say how much they would charge you to fix it normally? Just curious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eagledriver Posted June 10, 2010 Report Share Posted June 10, 2010 stop! hammertime! No seriously though even wear items like clutches ARE part of the 12month 12K addendum on the warranty! If this dealer so much as gives you any crap at all take the car to one that will repair legit under warranty which covers the 12/12 wear items! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kpevin Posted June 10, 2010 Report Share Posted June 10, 2010 I was a Ford warranty writer who worked with three large dealers for 8 years, if the car was abused or modified they can deny anything they want, matter of fact they can void the whole powertrain warranty if they choose. Hopefully the dealer is the one who installed the pulley/tune, if not it can get a little rough.. Contrary to popular belief the dealer makes 25-30% on the parts and gets paid book time from Ford to fix it under warranty and these days work is work. BUT, trying to warranty a clutch in a modified car that has no obvious part failure and is not going to be easy with 10K miles since I'm sure Ford will want the parts back to look at before they pay the claim. If SVT says there was nothing wrong with the parts and it was was caused by abuse or a NDF the claim gets denied and the dealer has to eat it. A lot revolves around how much the parts cost, if its a $2K clutch like I have read elsewhere then it could be a battle, the cost of the parts plus the labor is a lot to eat these days with dealers struggling. The clutch could have been burned up when the car was transported, by a lot jocky trying to do a burnout or a saleman who doesnt no how to drive. All it takes is one screw up where you can smell the clutch and you just reduced its holding capacity by 50% forever, it will never come back. Dealers arent always the evil people they are potrayed to be (some are of course), dont throw a fit and try to work with them, if all else fails you may have to take the car out of there but remember you will have to pay for taking it apart and checking it if you decide to go elsewhere. They will give you car back in pieces unless you pay to put it back together as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blazeone Posted June 10, 2010 Report Share Posted June 10, 2010 I was a Ford warranty writer who worked with three large dealers for 8 years, if the car was abused or modified they can deny anything they want, matter of fact they can void the whole powertrain warranty if they choose. Hopefully the dealer is the one who installed the pulley/tune, if not it can get a little rough.. Contrary to popular belief the dealer makes 25-30% on the parts and gets paid book time from Ford to fix it under warranty and these days work is work. BUT, trying to warranty a clutch in a modified car that has no obvious part failure and is not going to be easy with 10K miles since I'm sure Ford will want the parts back to look at before they pay the claim. If SVT says there was nothing wrong with the parts and it was was caused by abuse or a NDF the claim gets denied and the dealer has to eat it. A lot revolves around how much the parts cost, if its a $2K clutch like I have read elsewhere then it could be a battle, the cost of the parts plus the labor is a lot to eat these days with dealers struggling. The clutch could have been burned up when the car was transported, by a lot jocky trying to do a burnout or a saleman who doesnt no how to drive. All it takes is one screw up where you can smell the clutch and you just reduced its holding capacity by 50% forever, it will never come back. Dealers arent always the evil people they are potrayed to be (some are of course), dont throw a fit and try to work with them, if all else fails you may have to take the car out of there but remember you will have to pay for taking it apart and checking it if you decide to go elsewhere. They will give you car back in pieces unless you pay to put it back together as well. Ah a voice of experience and reason. Good post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F150 Duke Posted June 10, 2010 Report Share Posted June 10, 2010 All it takes is one screw up where you can smell the clutch and you just reduced its holding capacity by 50% forever, it will never come back. What kind of screw up are we talking here? What if someone pops the clutch without enough gas and stalls the car, does that burn up the clutch? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kpevin Posted June 10, 2010 Report Share Posted June 10, 2010 What kind of screw up are we talking here? What if someone pops the clutch without enough gas and stalls the car, does that burn up the clutch? Trying to do a burnout in 3rd instead of 1st, its easy for people to think they are spinning the tires and the clutch is smoking, or making a blast and leaving your foot on the clutch enough to disengage it and it slips, or slipping the clutch too much at the dragstrip trying to keep the tires from spinning. Any OE clutch s a compromise between holding the power, chatter on takeoff and force on your left leg, in a stock application holding usually is the least of the concern. I have seen 16 year old girls destroy a clutch in a 4cyl mustang in 100 miles, its not no much the power but as much as technique. Problem is when a clutch overheats it glazes both the disc and the flywheel/pressure plate, once you do that you will get hard spots in the metal and the disc material is burned enough to make it rock hard. Just like holding you foot on a brake pedal when driving, the brake pads and rotors will overheat and glaze up, once you get past a certain point the brakes will never stop again 100%. Stalling the car by not slipping the clutch enough on a normal takeoff doesnt hurt anything except your pride Here is good example of how to destroy a clutch in 30 seconds, the car will still drive but the clutch is done after this little stunt - pretty extreme but you get the point.. (NWS for language) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bpmurr Posted June 10, 2010 Author Report Share Posted June 10, 2010 Here are some pics the dealer took. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kpevin Posted June 10, 2010 Report Share Posted June 10, 2010 Well its definately been overheated/slipping, its going to be tough to determine who did it. Like I said someone could have killed it before you even started driving it. I would guess SVT will give the OK to replace it if you push them, I'm sure they dont want the bad press on their super-duper new clutch considering what happened with the older GT500s. But you never know, money is tight these days and they are watching expensive claims pretty close and you have quite a few miles on it.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bpmurr Posted June 10, 2010 Author Report Share Posted June 10, 2010 Well its definately been overheated/slipping, its going to be tough to determine who did it. Like I said someone could have killed it before you even started driving it. I would guess SVT will give the OK to replace it if you push them, I'm sure they dont want the bad press on their super-duper new clutch considering what happened with the older GT500s. But you never know, money is tight these days and they are watching expensive claims pretty close and you have quite a few miles on it.. Only time will tell I guess. I wouldn't consider 9500 miles a lot of miles. Only for those who have Garage Queen Shelby's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Son of GT Posted June 10, 2010 Report Share Posted June 10, 2010 Only time will tell I guess. I wouldn't consider 9500 miles a lot of miles. Only for those who have Garage Queen Shelby's. I agree. 9,500 miles is not alot of miles, and unless driven abusively, it's certainly not alot of miles for a clutch to get cooked like that. Dare I say it....? Z06's and ZR1's do not have any clutch problems that I have heard of, and both of those models exceed 500 H.P., so why can't our cars have reliable clutches from the factory? There has been WAY too many gen1 clutch failures, and all those started with the 1st failure before the engineers went back to the drawing board to fix the flywheel, and I hope that your clutch is not the start of another round of gen 2 clutch failures due to another poor component design. If it comes down to it, do not roll over on this. I would fight tooth and nail to get your clutch covered under warranty if I were you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Light66 Posted June 10, 2010 Report Share Posted June 10, 2010 Only time will tell I guess. I wouldn't consider 9500 miles a lot of miles. Only for those who have Garage Queen Shelby's. Agree!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kpevin Posted June 10, 2010 Report Share Posted June 10, 2010 Only time will tell I guess. I wouldn't consider 9500 miles a lot of miles. Only for those who have Garage Queen Shelby's. Depends if those 9500 miles were easy highway driving or if it was 9500 miles of full throttle beating, if its the latter than 9500 miles is a lot of miles The whole clutch thing on a modded 500+ HP car is a big grey area warranty-wise, a lot rides on the dealer's opinion or if they get a rep involved. If they think you beat the car then its going to be a tough sell, good luck on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kpevin Posted June 10, 2010 Report Share Posted June 10, 2010 I agree. 9,500 miles is not alot of miles, and unless driven abusively, it's certainly not alot of miles for a clutch to get cooked like that. Dare I say it....? Z06's and ZR1's do not have any clutch problems that I have heard of, and both of those models exceed 500 H.P., so why can't our cars have reliable clutches from the factory? There has been WAY too many gen1 clutch failures, and all those started with the 1st failure before the engineers went back to the drawing board to fix the flywheel, and I hope that your clutch is not the start of another round of gen 2 clutch failures due to another poor component design. If it comes down to it, do not roll over on this. I would fight tooth and nail to get your clutch covered under warranty if I were you. Early C5 Z06s and 4th gen F-bodies had some crappy clutches, I know plenty of people who killed clutches on 07+ Z06s with a few mods if they drove them hard. No matter what a 4000lb car with 500ft lbs of torque is going to be hard on clutches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bpmurr Posted June 10, 2010 Author Report Share Posted June 10, 2010 Early C5 Z06s and 4th gen F-bodies had some crappy clutches, I know plenty of people who killed clutches on 07+ Z06s with a few mods if they drove them hard. No matter what a 4000lb car with 500ft lbs of torque is going to be hard on clutches. Well the car had a few thousand miles before it was tuned. Then about 7000k the pulley went on and it retuned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slabo Posted June 10, 2010 Report Share Posted June 10, 2010 Trying to do a burnout in 3rd instead of 1st, its easy for people to think they are spinning the tires and the clutch is smoking, or making a blast and leaving your foot on the clutch enough to disengage it and it slips, or slipping the clutch too much at the dragstrip trying to keep the tires from spinning. Any OE clutch s a compromise between holding the power, chatter on takeoff and force on your left leg, in a stock application holding usually is the least of the concern. I have seen 16 year old girls destroy a clutch in a 4cyl mustang in 100 miles, its not no much the power but as much as technique. Problem is when a clutch overheats it glazes both the disc and the flywheel/pressure plate, once you do that you will get hard spots in the metal and the disc material is burned enough to make it rock hard. Just like holding you foot on a brake pedal when driving, the brake pads and rotors will overheat and glaze up, once you get past a certain point the brakes will never stop again 100%. Stalling the car by not slipping the clutch enough on a normal takeoff doesnt hurt anything except your pride Here is good example of how to destroy a clutch in 30 seconds, the car will still drive but the clutch is done after this little stunt - pretty extreme but you get the point.. (NWS for language) Sorry about your clutch but at least you didn't toast it in one motion like this guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bpmurr Posted June 10, 2010 Author Report Share Posted June 10, 2010 Sorry about your clutch but at least you didn't toast it in one motion like this guy. I can say for sure that never happened. Wow, talk about an EPIC FAIL! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kpevin Posted June 10, 2010 Report Share Posted June 10, 2010 I can say for sure that never happened. Wow, talk about an EPIC FAIL! Worst part is the guy who pulled yours off the transporter may have done the same thing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F150 Duke Posted June 10, 2010 Report Share Posted June 10, 2010 Trying to do a burnout in 3rd instead of 1st, its easy for people to think they are spinning the tires and the clutch is smoking, or making a blast and leaving your foot on the clutch enough to disengage it and it slips, or slipping the clutch too much at the dragstrip trying to keep the tires from spinning. Any OE clutch s a compromise between holding the power, chatter on takeoff and force on your left leg, in a stock application holding usually is the least of the concern. I have seen 16 year old girls destroy a clutch in a 4cyl mustang in 100 miles, its not no much the power but as much as technique. Problem is when a clutch overheats it glazes both the disc and the flywheel/pressure plate, once you do that you will get hard spots in the metal and the disc material is burned enough to make it rock hard. Just like holding you foot on a brake pedal when driving, the brake pads and rotors will overheat and glaze up, once you get past a certain point the brakes will never stop again 100%. Stalling the car by not slipping the clutch enough on a normal takeoff doesnt hurt anything except your pride Here is good example of how to destroy a clutch in 30 seconds, the car will still drive but the clutch is done after this little stunt - pretty extreme but you get the point.. (NWS for language) Wow, yeah that doesn't look good. How in the world did he do that? Leave the clutch partially engaged the entire time? The only reason I want to be 100% clear is I'm looking seriously at a '11 GT500 and this will be my first manual transmission purchase. Though I have driven a stick in the past with no problem, there weren't any burnouts, hard 0-60 runs or 550 HP cars invovled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kpevin Posted June 11, 2010 Report Share Posted June 11, 2010 Wow, yeah that doesn't look good. How in the world did he do that? Leave the clutch partially engaged the entire time? The only reason I want to be 100% clear is I'm looking seriously at a '11 GT500 and this will be my first manual transmission purchase. Though I have driven a stick in the past with no problem, there weren't any burnouts, hard 0-60 runs or 550 HP cars invovled. My guess would be he was in 3rd or 5th gear instead of 1st or 2nd, but all it takes is a good hook and something has to give, clutch could have been weak, who knows. I've seen lot of people do the same thing over the years, doing a burnout with a manual trans car takes a little practice, Honestly a big v8 with a lot of low end torque is very easy to drive, when you start beating on any manual trans car you run the risk of hurting something, especially at a dragstrip. I did a lot of work on C5/C6 vettes and LS powered F-bodies. Some guys could do 500rwhp with a supercharger and the stock clutch lasted 100,000 miles. And then I've seen people kill a clutch on a stock car with under 1000 miles. I wouldnt let clutch issues scare you away from one of these, the 2010+ clutch seems to be pretty stout. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsarkis Posted June 11, 2010 Report Share Posted June 11, 2010 I've been told by my Ford Tech friend & a good mod shop in Houston to never keep on TC unless you have to bc it wears the clutch out. Just throwing that out there not sure how correct they are or aren't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bpmurr Posted June 11, 2010 Author Report Share Posted June 11, 2010 I've been told by my Ford Tech friend & a good mod shop in Houston to never keep on TC unless you have to bc it wears the clutch out. Just throwing that out there not sure how correct they are or aren't. I thought it was the rear brakes.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kpevin Posted June 11, 2010 Report Share Posted June 11, 2010 I've been told by my Ford Tech friend & a good mod shop in Houston to never keep on TC unless you have to bc it wears the clutch out. Just throwing that out there not sure how correct they are or aren't. Maybe some truth to it depending on the TC system, usually it would kill engine power first, then apply brakes. I dont do know how these work exactly, usually with a limited slip rear there is little braking from the TC, unlike an open diff that needs to brake one wheel to send power to the other if one is spinning badly. But yea, if you want to drive hard or do burnouts/doughnuts I'd probably turn the traction control off.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bpmurr Posted June 11, 2010 Author Report Share Posted June 11, 2010 The dealer is telling me Ford will not honor the warranty because of the pulley swap. The additional power has lead to the premature wear. I'm not sure what to do... I bought this car last year because I believed strongly in Ford not taking bailout money. It was about a year too soon for me but I wanted to do something as an individual to help out Ford and the people who work there. It felt really good when I was contacted by someone on the niche line and get to put faces with my car. Now I have Ford looking for a quick out to save a buck on a long time and very loyal customer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blazeone Posted June 11, 2010 Report Share Posted June 11, 2010 The dealer is telling me Ford will not honor the warranty because of the pulley swap. The additional power has lead to the premature wear. I'm not sure what to do... I bought this car last year because I believed strongly in Ford not taking bailout money. It was about a year too soon for me but I wanted to do something as an individual to help out Ford and the people who work there. It feld really good when I was contacted by someone on the niche line and get to put faces with my car. Now I have Ford looking for a quick out to save a buck on a long time and very loyal customer. You can not blame Ford for not wanting to warranty a clutch on car with a power increasing mod. I know this is an old addage but if you play you gotta pay. Sure it would be nice if they covered it but it's their call. If the money was an issure you could have returned the car back to stock before taking it in. Although I don't believe this is right either as it is fraud. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bpmurr Posted June 11, 2010 Author Report Share Posted June 11, 2010 You can not blame Ford for not wanting to warranty a clutch on car with a power increasing mod. I know this is an old addage but if you play you gotta pay. Sure it would be nice if they covered it but it's their call. If the money was an issure you could have returned the car back to stock before taking it in. Although I don't believe this is right either as it is fraud. What Ford is also saying then is their clutch can't handle anymore then stock power levels. In fact even at stock power levels they are saying it's not under warranty as it's a wear item. They are really nickel and diming a loyal customer. It's going to cost them more then $1207.00 in parts long term by losing me as a customer. Combined my imediate family has bought seven Ford cars in the last 5 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kpevin Posted June 11, 2010 Report Share Posted June 11, 2010 The dealer is telling me Ford will not honor the warranty because of the pulley swap. The additional power has lead to the premature wear. I'm not sure what to do... I bought this car last year because I believed strongly in Ford not taking bailout money. It was about a year too soon for me but I wanted to do something as an individual to help out Ford and the people who work there. It feld really good when I was contacted by someone on the niche line and get to put faces with my car. Now I have Ford looking for a quick out to save a buck on a long time and very loyal customer. Unless the dealer did the pulley swap you are at their mercy. This has been beat to death over the years but when you modify a new car you are pretty much on your own. Chevy has been voiding C6 Z06 powertrain warranties for nothing more than a CAI and a tune, their position is if you change ANYTHING they are no longer responsible if you blow up your 20K engine. Same with the diesels, you put a tune in and blow up a 5K allison trans, voided pwertrain warranty. Some dealers will do the mods and stand behind them but I bet they still wouldnt cover the clutch. Even without the pulley there was a good chance they wouldnt fix it under warranty, they seldom do for clutches, especially after 10K miles. I commend you for sticking with Ford because they took no bailout money, that was one reason I bought the Shelby over the C6. But they are not covering a lot of things for 'good will' like they used to do when I was there, all you can do is start calling and bitching, at the least you may get Ford to pay half labor and/or get the parts for cost if you are good terms with the dealer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bpmurr Posted June 11, 2010 Author Report Share Posted June 11, 2010 Even without the pulley there was a good chance they wouldnt fix it under warranty, they seldom do for clutches, especially after 10K miles. I have less then 10k Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blazeone Posted June 11, 2010 Report Share Posted June 11, 2010 What Ford is also saying then is their clutch can't handle anymore then stock power levels. They are really nickel and diming a loyal customer. It's going to cost them more then $1207.00 in parts long term by losing me as a customer. That's your opinon. I've toasted two stock clutchs in C5 corvettes within a 1000 miles of adding 100hp, yes, I'm rough on them. Both cars were in warranty and I knew better than to take them in for warranty. I put Textralia's in them and all was good. I'm not trying to sound like a holier than thou guy. My clutch cooking came from hitting 2nd and 3rd gear like a madman, no hard launchs with slicks. Certainly you have some skin in the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bpmurr Posted June 11, 2010 Author Report Share Posted June 11, 2010 That's your opinon. I've toasted two stock clutchs in C5 corvettes within a 1000 miles of adding 100hp, yes, I'm rough on them. Both cars were in warranty and I knew better than to take them in for warrnty. I put Textralia's in them and all was good. I'm not trying to sound like a holier than thou guy. My clutch cooking came from hitting 2nd and 3rd gear like a madman, no hard launchs with slicks. Certainly you have some skin in the game. I concerned that the issue with trying to shift into second that a lot of us have might have contributed to the premature wear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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