4th Revision - The new revised Clutch TSB 10-3-8

[gmc1958]

what if you have a 2008 GT 500 with only 700 miles, and you just change the flywheel, can you avoid the problems

[Grabber]

what if you have a 2008 GT 500 with only 700 miles, and you just change the flywheel, can you avoid the problems

 

 

Per conversation with a SVT engineer, the flywheel and clutch both need to be replaced at the same time so both surfaces are brand new to each other. This way they both mate correctly.

[DrBob]

I recently experienced clutch slippage at 17k miles with my April 2008 GT500. The dealer told me that the clutch was no longer under warranty and it would cost me about $6k to fix. So I called the Ford Customer Hotline and the person I spoke to seemed more optimistic. She said if the dealer found the flywheel to be the cause of the trouble, the repair would be covered. So, I let the dealership work on the car. They tore apart the clutch system, took photos, and sent them to Ford. The photos must have resembled the ones in the TSB because a week later, Ford ruled that a warped flywheel was the cause of the premature clutch failure and they authorized the replacement detailed in the latest Clutch Drag TSB to be done under warranty. Interesting note, the first repair did not work. After the parts were replaced, the mechanic couldn't even shift into 1st gear because the new clutch would not disengage. He thought the new clutch plate may have been deffective, so Ford, not wanting to take any chances, authorized replacement for all the new parts. So, they did the complete replacement, and now my car runs better than it ever did. No hiss, clatter, chatter, or any unusual noise. The feel of the clutch is lighter and much smoother. That is because the TSB called for replacing the old clutch with the same one as in the 2010 GT500. All the car mags raved about the improved clutch in the 2010 GT500 and they are right. It definitely works much better; and, hopefully, this new clutch, with twin 10-inch diameter plates (vs. 8.5), improved surface materials, and a beefier flywheel, will last a lot longer.

[acarli3]

Why is it such a hit and miss whether or not Ford will pay for this? My dealer refused to even onsider it being covered under warranty. Went out with 16k miles. They never even gave it a thought to warranty it until I refused to pay, but they then held my car hostage until I did. I tried to called the Ford hotline several times and all I got were emplyees that cold only tell me "the dealer says"...and never have an inteligent onversations about our car. They knew nothing about cars at all. They only knew how to read form a computer monitor what the dealer already told me....we dont ever warranty lutches. I call BS but nobody at Ford will call me back to talk. This car will be my last Ford vehicle....they lost my business for life. Ford didn't stand behind their product at all for me. How do i get a hold of an SVT engineer? Everyone I talked to on the hotline said they dont contact customers at all. Very poor customer service at Ford. I guess I just dont know the right people.

[DDT]

I believe it has to do with status and communication

between the Dealer and Ford Corperate..........

 

Galpin, the "Biggest Ford Dealer" in the World probably

Has done a record number of these under Warranty with

no questions asked.........I know they did it for me.........

[txshavers]

So sorry to hear about your trouble. I just went through kind of the same thing, but it was Ford Corporate that was refusing to cooperate. I called SVT, Ford Customer Care, and also sent an email to GM and Service Manager. I got a call back within a few hours from the SM who said that he would talk to someone at Ford and see if anything could be done. Ford ended up paying all but 327.00 for the repair. I think like you said it's very hit or miss with this issue. The best thing from my experience, is to just try and remain calm and courteous, as I found sometimes that goes a long way. If all else fails speak to another dealership.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Why is it such a hit and miss whether or not Ford will pay for this? My dealer refused to even onsider it being covered under warranty. Went out with 16k miles. They never even gave it a thought to warranty it until I refused to pay, but they then held my car hostage until I did. I tried to called the Ford hotline several times and all I got were emplyees that cold only tell me "the dealer says"...and never have an inteligent onversations about our car. They knew nothing about cars at all. They only knew how to read form a computer monitor what the dealer already told me....we dont ever warranty lutches. I call BS but nobody at Ford will call me back to talk. This car will be my last Ford vehicle....they lost my business for life. Ford didn't stand behind their product at all for me. How do i get a hold of an SVT engineer? Everyone I talked to on the hotline said they dont contact customers at all. Very poor customer service at Ford. I guess I just dont know the right people.

[txshavers]

Just got my car back, and I love the feel of the new clutch. Much lighter and seems to engage much sooner. One question I have is, I talked to my service advisor and asked him about the flash that was suppose to be done. He said they did install the flash, but it doesn't override my custom tune, because it's not in the PCM, but the TCM. My car isn't throwing any codes which I'm assuming it would considering I'm not running any cats. Is there anyway to tell if my tune is still in the car and loaded?

[CobraCrazy]

Well my clutch finally failed. 07 Shelby GT500 with 32K. It lasted as long as it did because I never rod it. Now the dealer wants 2900.00 to fix it. I feel like I'm being punished for taking care of it. I've argued, using the info Grabber has supplied, but don't know yet if it will help; nevertheless I too want to thank Grabber once again!

[glroy]

Well my clutch finally failed. 07 Shelby GT500 with 32K. It lasted as long as it did because I never rod it. Now the dealer wants 2900.00 to fix it. I feel like I'm being punished for taking care of it. I've argued, using the info Grabber has supplied, but don't know yet if it will help; nevertheless I too want to thank Grabber once again!

 

 

Mine went out at about 7000 miles and Ford did the TSB and not very well. I now have some where around 34k and I have been babying since the TSB expecting it to go out at anytime. I am not sure what version of the TSB I had done but it is not the 2010 clutch. When goes it will be aftermarket time; I have heard the 2010 clutches do not like 700+ RWHP and I do know that there are very few Ford dealers the realize the GT500 is a race car and it is not like putting a clutch in a Range.

long and short go I am going after market installed not by a Ford dealer just my 2 cents.

[CobraCrazy]

My dealer is willing to split 50/50 which I still think sucks considering this was an engineering failure, not abuse, but better than nothing.

[jasonport]

I got my clutch done last month at frontier ford!! awesome dealership!! Darren jackson was the best! love the car now drives beautiful!! so easy to drive!

 

 

Jason

[shel-b001]

Great to hear there are some good dealers out there.

[Joe G]

My dealer is willing to split 50/50 which I still think sucks considering this was an engineering failure, not abuse, but better than nothing.

 

 

 

Don't forget - you picked your car up over 4 years ago, so you're WAY past the 3 year warranty period.

 

Getting them to pick up 1/2 the cost is pretty good IMO for an out of warranty car.

[Grabber]

Don't forget - you picked your car up over 4 years ago, so you're WAY past the 3 year warranty period.

 

Getting them to pick up 1/2 the cost is pretty good IMO for an out of warranty car.

 

 

I agree with Joegie on this.

[AlloyDropTop]

Don't forget - you picked your car up over 4 years ago, so you're WAY past the 3 year warranty period.

 

Getting them to pick up 1/2 the cost is pretty good IMO for an out of warranty car.

 

 

Depends what caused the failure. If it was clutch material wear, then I agree. If it was warped flywheel causing other damage, then I think Ford should cover 100 percent, as flywheel us a 5 year 50k mile item.

[kna4977]

Just got mine back. Covered 100%, no questions asked, no hassle. It just took some time, but it was well worth the wait. Simply amazing! Wow! what a difference a decent clutch makes.

[CobraCrazy]

Don't forget - you picked your car up over 4 years ago, so you're WAY past the 3 year warranty period.

 

Getting them to pick up 1/2 the cost is pretty good IMO for an out of warranty car.

 

 

I see what you're saying, but it would seem everyone who has the first-run 07 has had clutch problems; I know I've taken exceptional care of my dream car and it only has 31K; it's an engineering flaw, so yes I do have a bit of a problem paying for any of it.

[AlloyDropTop]

I see what you're saying, but it would seem everyone who has the first-run 07 has had clutch problems; I know I've taken exceptional care of my dream car and it only has 31K; it's an engineering flaw, so yes I do have a bit of a problem paying for any of it.

 

 

I agree with you CobraCrazy. When a manfacturer knows they messed up, and I am certain Ford knows they messed up on this one, the right thing to do would have been to offer to all owners, and extended warranty on the problem parts. They could have extended the warranty for problems related to the known cause, to something like 90K miles. I have had both Lexus and Acura do this with cars I have owned. Lexus extended a warranty on the radiator of my wifes RX330, when they figured out they had a manufacturing problem with them, to 90K miles. I had it go at something like 95K, and they still replaced it, no questions asked. According to alot of guys on this site, that have been apparently conditioned by Fords low level of customer service, Lexus should have made me pay to replace the radiator, since it only had a 50K mile warranty. Yet they went 45K miles over that, because they know a radiator should last more than 50K miles. I guess that is why, other than the GT500, all I have bought for the past 10 years have been Lexus and Acura....

[acarli3]

I agree with CobraCrazy as well. Ford knows they screwed up on this, but don't appear willing to do the right thing and extend the warranty to cover the clutch. Granted there are those that race their vehicles and it's probably hard to tell those from daily driver vehicels like mine. This is my last Ford because they just don't know customer service at all. Their screw up cost me $2400 for a new clutch at only 16k commuter, never raced miles. The defect rates on these clutches is staggering. I do like the lighter feel of the replacement clutch. Just made me sick that Ford refused to warranty despite the flywheel being warped beyond belief. I'm actually considering suing as I've received a second opinion from a GM dealership head mechanic that was shocked. His diagnosis was the warped flywheel was engaging the clutch and caused the premature failure. My clutch pads looked like they had 100k miles on it.

[AlloyDropTop]

I agree with CobraCrazy as well. Ford knows they screwed up on this, but don't appear willing to do the right thing and extend the warranty to cover the clutch. Granted there are those that race their vehicles and it's probably hard to tell those from daily driver vehicels like mine. This is my last Ford because they just don't know customer service at all. Their screw up cost me $2400 for a new clutch at only 16k commuter, never raced miles. The defect rates on these clutches is staggering. I do like the lighter feel of the replacement clutch. Just made me sick that Ford refused to warranty despite the flywheel being warped beyond belief. I'm actually considering suing as I've received a second opinion from a GM dealership head mechanic that was shocked. His diagnosis was the warped flywheel was engaging the clutch and caused the premature failure. My clutch pads looked like they had 100k miles on it.

 

 

acarli3,

 

I know this is easy for me to say, but I really think I will pursue legal action if my clutch fails during the powertrain warranty period, due to warped flywheel, a part covered by the power train warranty, and Ford makes me pay for it. I certainly will discuss with a good automotive lawer if they think I have a case, should this happen. I'll bet a well written letter with legal ramifications, backed up by all the problems we know of in the public forum, and Ford pays the bill....

 

Sure, clutches are wear items, but these problems are not wear problems.

[perrytbiii]

This thread is very helpful,,,

 

I do have a small difference on the issue with the shutter in first gear at 1500-2000 RPM. It does it when the clutch is fully released and foot is off the pedal (on dead foot rest). The TSB was recently applied and they claimed to change the lclutch to the 2010 version. Now I notice a shutter in 1st at 1500-2000 and 2nd at 1000 RPM. I do not feel it in third but based on the direction it is going that would be around 500 RPM with the foot completely off the clutch. The shutter is more pronounced at moderate accelerations ( almost scary). Any suggestions. the Ford hotline called for an EVA test and determined a vibration in the driveline. After swapping parts from a similar mileage vehicle( Dealership) now both cars have the shutter. So it has been determined that this is normal. I want to get the "learning to drive", thing out of the way. Again my foot is off the pedal completely when this is happening. Any additional ammo for the dealership rebuttal would be helpful.

 

Thanks.

[DrBob]

This thread is very helpful,,,

 

I do have a small difference on the issue with the shutter in first gear at 1500-2000 RPM. It does it when the clutch is fully released and foot is off the pedal (on dead foot rest). The TSB was recently applied and they claimed to change the lclutch to the 2010 version. Now I notice a shutter in 1st at 1500-2000 and 2nd at 1000 RPM. I do not feel it in third but based on the direction it is going that would be around 500 RPM with the foot completely off the clutch. The shutter is more pronounced at moderate accelerations ( almost scary). Any suggestions. the Ford hotline called for an EVA test and determined a vibration in the driveline. After swapping parts from a similar mileage vehicle( Dealership) now both cars have the shutter. So it has been determined that this is normal. I want to get the "learning to drive", thing out of the way. Again my foot is off the pedal completely when this is happening. Any additional ammo for the dealership rebuttal would be helpful.

 

Thanks.

 

I just had the TSB work done in November and I do not experience shudder any more. It may be your clutch is still slipping. Or you could have tranny damage from the clutch drag. Did they do the complete repair or the partial one detailed in the latest TSB?

[Shelbyville]

OK, I have my clutch TSB set up and (hopefully) ready to go. These are the part #s that came in:

 

AR3Z - 7A508 - A

 

7R3Z - 7C391 - B

 

AR3Z - 7B546 - A

 

AR3Z - 6375 - A

 

Are these the right parts? (I left off the small stuff)

 

What else should I be thinking about having done at the same time? I have an MGW shifter ordered, thinking about 3.73s.

 

All I need now is some decent weather to get it to the dealer.

[5.4 Shelby]

What's up Grabber? Long time no speak. Hope all is going well for you. What's up to anyone else I know on here and haven't talked to in a while.

 

I have a 2008GT500 built late July 2007. I had the flywheel/clutch repair done fall of 2008. It still did not shift well, so I had the rest of the (current at that time) transmission repair done. That included new synchros. It never has been perfect since. It does not grind or exhibit any of the other clutch symptoms. It is just a little "Sticky" going into 2nd gear about 20% of the time. Clean, but, not smooth about 60% and smooth as silk the other 20%.

 

I have taken it in several times complaining of this. I have even taken it to 2 different dealers. Of course, they can never reproduce the problem. Seems to be worse when cold, but, will show up occasionally when warm.

 

I decided to take a look at the forum to see what was going on with it and found this update. Thank you Rob. As always, you have come through for many people.

 

I performed the test quoted below on the synchros to see if they were malfunctioning. I was hoping for either a fully negative result or a positive result so that I had something to prove to the service tech.

 

Well, I would say the result was equivocal. The TSB says you should get a clash or grind if the synchros are bad. I do not get either of those, but, I do get a slight vibration or hum only in second gear. The other gears are silent.

 

What do you guys think? Anybody else try this and experience the same thing? Have some of you tried it and not gotten anything but silence? Would some of you mind trying the procedure and tell me what you get? I am trying to decide whether to take it in for another service appt.

 

Thanks

 

Transmission Synchronizer Diagnosis Procedure

 

 

 

 

The following procedure is to be used to determine if the synchronizer assemblies in the transmission may have been damaged by attempting to operate the vehicle with a dragging clutch.

1.Set parking brake.

2.Transmission in neutral.

3.Start engine and allow it to idle.

4.Clutch engaged - pedal fully released.

5.Attempt to shift transmission into first gear by firmly pushing shift lever approximately 5-10 lb-ft (22-45 N-m) force for 2-3 seconds.

6.If the synchronizers are okay, the transmission will not make any clash or grinding noise. You will not be able to move the gearshift lever into the selected gear (the synchronizer will block out gear engagement) and the engine RPM will decrease slightly.

7.Repeat the synchronizer test (Step 5 and 6) on all of the other forward gears.

1.If the transmission passes the synchronizer test, the transmission will not require additional service; proceed with clutch/flywheel replacement only. Refer to Clutch Replacement procedure.

2.If clash/grinding noise is found when performing the synchronizer diagnostic, the transmission will need to be repaired along with the replacement of the clutch. Refer to Transmission Repair procedure.

 

 

[Grabber]

LONG TIME NO SEE. DID YOU FALL OFF THE PLANET ?

 

Your 3 year warranty is going to be up soon and you will be SOL. Take it in and get the work done if it's not right. That's my advice. If you are out of warranty Maybe you should get the Spec Super Twin clutch & flywheel. Many here like that one.

[5.4 Shelby]

LONG TIME NO SEE. DID YOU FALL OFF THE PLANET ?

 

Your 3 year warranty is going to be up soon and you will be SOL. Take it in and get the work done if it's not right. That's my advice. If you are out of warranty Maybe you should get the Spec Super Twin clutch & flywheel. Many here like that one.

 

Nah, I didn't fall off. Just got burned out on forums. Not really doing any mods and not really having any problems (aside from this one).

 

I dont think the clutch is bad. It does not exhibit any of the clutch symptoms. I think it is either the synchros or second gear itself. In fact, it could even just be that I am not trusting it after having problems with it. It is minor, but, just not as good as I would like.

 

Hope it isnt clutch. 3 year warranty is up. I got a 6 yr extended. Prob doesnt cover clutches. I will have to check it.

[Grabber]

Nah, I didn't fall off. Just got burned out on forums. Not really doing any mods and not really having any problems (aside from this one).

 

I dont think the clutch is bad. It does not exhibit any of the clutch symptoms. I think it is either the synchros or second gear itself. In fact, it could even just be that I am not trusting it after having problems with it. It is minor, but, just not as good as I would like.

 

Hope it isnt clutch. 3 year warranty is up. I got a 6 yr extended. Prob doesnt cover clutches. I will have to check it.

 

I see you have not made a post since May of 2009. We missed you dude.

 

Don't be a stranger.

[Tom Robinson]

I got my clutch done last month at frontier ford!! awesome dealership!! Darren jackson was the best! love the car now drives beautiful!! so easy to drive!

 

 

Jason

 

 

Hi Jason,

 

I'm looking to have the clutch TSB work done by frontier ford. Who should I contact? Did you have any problems getting them to agree to do the work? Heard the 2010 clutch is the current replacement but not robust enough to handle high HP. Are you nodded, and if so are there any clutch issues?

 

Thanks,

Tom

[5.4 Shelby]

I see you have not made a post since May of 2009. We missed you dude.

 

Don't be a stranger.

 

Thanks Rob. I missed it here too. I need to make an effort to spend more time on here and even get involved in some of the events. I have never been to a meet and greet type thing. I will have to try to do that.

 

Anyway, if any of you have any odd findings on the synchronizer test, please post them. I would like to know what people are finding with it. It is really simple to perform and wont harm your tranny.

[Texastinlegs]

About to hit the dealer with my '09. Purchased from new Feb 2009. 13,000 very gentle miles on it and it's beginning to show clutch slip.

 

Best illustrated in 3rd or 4th at around 40 then hit the gas, spool up the supercharger to hit the power band and......engine revs out, no wheelspin, mysterious mechanical noises....all sounds like the dread clutch issue.

Will illustrate to my local dealer where I bought the car, try to confirm the diagnosis then talk warranty. Definitely NOT interested in a $5000 repair bill.

 

I recognise I am out of the 12/12 - but there are enough posts here in a similar situation where the dealer has come through and applied the TSB under warranty.

Will keep y'all posted.