shelbydream1 Posted January 31, 2010 Report Share Posted January 31, 2010 All right all my engine building building buddies-I have been shopping for new heads for the SGT. Does anyone have any suggestions for a nice set without breaking the bank? Looking for the most bang for the buck. Doesn't seem to be a whole lot of choices in 3v that I have found (Ford Racing, Livernois) I'm thinking I'm going for the old school, naturally aspirated muscle car route. Looking at heads, cams, better CAI, long tube headers, KR mufflers and tune (maybe underdrive pulleys). Possibly new Ford racing intake also. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GT500-07 Posted January 31, 2010 Report Share Posted January 31, 2010 All right all my engine building building buddies-I have been shopping for new heads for the SGT. Does anyone have any suggestions for a nice set without breaking the bank? Looking for the most bang for the buck. Doesn't seem to be a whole lot of choices in 3v that I have found (Ford Racing, Livernois) I'm thinking I'm going for the old school, naturally aspirated muscle car route. Looking at heads, cams, better CAI, long tube headers, KR mufflers and tune (maybe underdrive pulleys). Possibly new Ford racing intake also. FR would be cheaper, Livernois would be better also try Fox Lake http://www.foxlakeracing.com/index.php also check out the S197 forum http://s197.com/forum/showthread.php?t=26294&highlight=3v+heads Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RACERX009 Posted February 1, 2010 Report Share Posted February 1, 2010 All right all my engine building building buddies-I have been shopping for new heads for the SGT. Does anyone have any suggestions for a nice set without breaking the bank? Looking for the most bang for the buck. Doesn't seem to be a whole lot of choices in 3v that I have found (Ford Racing, Livernois) I'm thinking I'm going for the old school, naturally aspirated muscle car route. Looking at heads, cams, better CAI, long tube headers, KR mufflers and tune (maybe underdrive pulleys). Possibly new Ford racing intake also. I been looking around myself and with a great set of heads you then need a good intake manifold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
springer Posted February 1, 2010 Report Share Posted February 1, 2010 I been looking around myself and with a great set of heads you then need a good intake manifold. Hello Racer, I was attempting to do the same thing you are, but by the time it was all said and done - cams, headers, heads, tuner etc, I would have spent around $5500 to $6000 for all these mods - to include parts and labor. For not much more, you can have the Whipple installed and have substantially more power. Every mod shop I talked with said that if I wanted to spend that kind of money, I should do the blower. I opted for the SAI GT/SC Whipple kit. You might want to look at the Edelbrock or Prochargers also, which cost a couple thousand less than the Whipple and have significant HP gains too. I think in the long term, if you go the route you are going, you'll wish you had just gone with a supercharger. You can't beat it for the most "bang for the buck." I'm an old school guy myself, and prefer the old school ways, but blowers are where it's at now. Good luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GT500-07 Posted February 1, 2010 Report Share Posted February 1, 2010 I been looking around myself and with a great set of heads you then need a good intake manifold. look in to the new FR intake Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kahmann Posted February 2, 2010 Report Share Posted February 2, 2010 I'm thinking I'm going for the old school, naturally aspirated muscle car route. Looking at heads, cams, better CAI, long tube headers, KR mufflers and tune (maybe underdrive pulleys). Possibly new Ford racing intake also. Some quick opinions on what you're looking at: Heads - FRPP is the best bang for the buck Cams - Comp stage 2 XFI VSR's (plus springs, retainers, and cam phaser limiters) Better CAI - Waste of $ Long tubes - Kooks (plus JetHot coating) KR mufflers - Good choice IMO Tune - Completely necessary with heads, cams, and/or long tubes UD pulleys - Install is tricky and can cause damage to crank if done improperly. With added labor cost, these aren't worth the $ IMO. FRPP intake - No data is available yet, but it's a nice looking piece. Good luck. Ken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RACERX009 Posted February 3, 2010 Report Share Posted February 3, 2010 Trust me guy's, I tell myself the same thing everyday but my thick skull has to play it out till it's satisfied. I like being the underdog and then coming out ahead and having no idea how it happened. Back in my 20's when all my friends were dumping chevy's in there dodges or pontiac's, I took my 78 trans am had a 455 with ram 4 heads built with 12:1 compression and of course roller rockers and ported intake matching heads. Along with an 850 dominator carb and the motor had so much torque that it ripped out the motor mount. So the speed shop that tuned it for me chained down. That motor cost me a little over 6,000.00. It had a muncie 4 spd but that blew after a couple of hard launches so I went automatic with no drag suspension and 390 gears and poor fuel system. I ran it once in english town with street tires and was able to do 12.99 and thats with vapor lock. I was happy cause it shut alot of the chevy guys up!! They knew if I had there fuel system and slicks they would have been crushed not beat crushed. My one buddy with the pontiac and chevy engine was also juicing his motor and had the works and he was the first to come up to me. Since with all the stuff he had that I didn't just motor he ran in the 11's. Oh, I couldn't afford a new rearend since the speed shop looked over my car and found that, I broke the passenger side axle tube loose so he welded it. You can't get that kind torque out of chevy. It's nice to be the fastest on the block or pulling up to a light and know the other is crapping cause he knows your to fast. I'm happy with the way my car is going actually looking to upgrade the steering wheel and seats any engine up grade will be spent wisely the intake first then maybe the heads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShadowLands Posted February 5, 2010 Report Share Posted February 5, 2010 Some quick opinions on what you're looking at: Heads - FRPP is the best bang for the buck Cams - Comp stage 2 XFI VSR's (plus springs, retainers, and cam phaser limiters) Better CAI - Waste of $ Long tubes - Kooks (plus JetHot coating) KR mufflers - Good choice IMO Tune - Completely necessary with heads, cams, and/or long tubes UD pulleys - Install is tricky and can cause damage to crank if done improperly. With added labor cost, these aren't worth the $ IMO. FRPP intake - No data is available yet, but it's a nice looking piece. Good luck. Ken Heads: FRPP may be the best bang for the buck but I'd rather have Fox Lake do the heads and KNOW I had quality components instead of proction line pieces. Tolerances are so much better on the Fox Lake stuff. Cams: Comp 127300 CAI: C&L Long Tubes: American Racing!!!!!! None better. KR Mufflers: yeah, whatever. I'm rather fond of my Zoomers. Tune: absolutely and make sure you get someone who knows what they're doing! UD Pulleys: Good gains and a great idea. Intake: C&L Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tpow96 Posted February 5, 2010 Report Share Posted February 5, 2010 Ken and S.D.: Based on your recommended mods (with a stock shortblock and NA), what power levels would you expect at the crank and/or wheels? Is an upgrade to the fuel system needed as well? -Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andrewnagle1964 Posted February 5, 2010 Report Share Posted February 5, 2010 Heads: FRPP may be the best bang for the buck but I'd rather have Fox Lake do the heads and KNOW I had quality components instead of proction line pieces. Tolerances are so much better on the Fox Lake stuff. Cams: Comp 127300 CAI: C&L Long Tubes: American Racing!!!!!! None better. KR Mufflers: yeah, whatever. I'm rather fond of my Zoomers. Tune: absolutely and make sure you get someone who knows what they're doing! UD Pulleys: Good gains and a great idea. Intake: C&L This Fox Lake ?? Thanks Andrew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShadowLands Posted February 6, 2010 Report Share Posted February 6, 2010 Ken and S.D.: Based on your recommended mods (with a stock shortblock and NA), what power levels would you expect at the crank and/or wheels? Is an upgrade to the fuel system needed as well? -Tom On the conservative side.....375-380 at the tires. With a good tuner and good cylinder heads I'd say 400 to the tire. This Fox Lake ?? Thanks Andrew Yup....that Fox Lake. Be sure and tell Ron that I sent you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
07SGT0546 Posted February 6, 2010 Report Share Posted February 6, 2010 Check this out. And is there anybody that has tried this, or something similar? And if so, how close to reality are these numbers. 451 HP on a heads and cam swap is pretty amazing, even for Livernois. Parts cost for this is under $5K http://www.musclemustangfastfords.com/tech/mmfp_0812_livernois_motorsports_cylinder_head_upgrade/index.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andrewnagle1964 Posted February 6, 2010 Report Share Posted February 6, 2010 On the conservative side.....375-380 at the tires. With a good tuner and good cylinder heads I'd say 400 to the tire. Yup....that Fox Lake. Be sure and tell Ron that I sent you. Thanks, I am about a year out from doing anything but am gathering info on where to go. I appreciate it Thanks Andrew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shelbydream1 Posted March 16, 2010 Author Report Share Posted March 16, 2010 Does anyone know the intake/exhaust numbers on the stock heads? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kahmann Posted March 16, 2010 Report Share Posted March 16, 2010 Ken and S.D.: Based on your recommended mods (with a stock shortblock and NA), what power levels would you expect at the crank and/or wheels? Is an upgrade to the fuel system needed as well? -Tom 400rwhp easy. With those cams, shortys, IMRC delete plates, and UD pulleys, my SGT put down 351rwhp. At that power level, a fuel system upgrade isn't completely necessary IMO, but if you ever put a blower atop that setup, you'll definitely need twin pumps and bigger injectors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShadowLands Posted March 17, 2010 Report Share Posted March 17, 2010 Check this out. And is there anybody that has tried this, or something similar? And if so, how close to reality are these numbers. 451 HP on a heads and cam swap is pretty amazing, even for Livernois. Parts cost for this is under $5K http://www.musclemustangfastfords.com/tech/mmfp_0812_livernois_motorsports_cylinder_head_upgrade/index.html Keep in mind that is on an engine dyno with no accessories attached to the engine. That is about as raw as you can get. Once you start tacking on the power steering pump, alternator, water pump, and a/c you'll see more realistic numbers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
springer Posted March 18, 2010 Report Share Posted March 18, 2010 150 more rear wheel hp from a stock Mustang GT - that is streetable with pump gas, with cams, heads, headers and a tune. So I'm game, where and when? Sounds like a childhood dream come true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kahmann Posted March 18, 2010 Report Share Posted March 18, 2010 ^Things sure have changed from the days of yesteryear. Well that's what they tell me anyway. Everything I know about the 60's and 70's was learned by watching "That 70's Show" and "The Wonder Years"! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
springer Posted March 18, 2010 Report Share Posted March 18, 2010 Keep in mind that is on an engine dyno with no accessories attached to the engine. That is about as raw as you can get. Once you start tacking on the power steering pump, alternator, water pump, and a/c you'll see more realistic numbers. There are many amazing claims being made here. And are, just that, - amazing. It's a lot of smoke and mirrors. The principles of cranking out high HP engines hasn't changed at all from the noted Wonder Years, or days gone past. A lot of salesmanship, hype and magic, just like the old days. The difference now is the engines that come from the factory are very, very efficient, more so than the Wonder Years. Almost doubling the horsepower, with heads, cams and a few add on's should be looked at with a "wink and a nod" before you open up your wallet for disappointment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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