Shelbys and Ford Dealers = ???

[crispy23c]

Welcome, cobra8u.cc Nice to see you joined the fold!

I practice what you do as well. The only difference is that I won't pay over msrp, I'm just going to wait.

I was first on the list at my local dealer-*cough,*cough BONNELL FORD, WINCHESTER, MASSACHUSETTS *cough, *cough-in fact they started the list on my behalf--for about a year. No contract, msrp. After many reassurances from that dealer for MSRP, he switched his tune, and states that "he believes this car will be very limited production"...and "70 people on his list"....and I told him that the plan is for 7-10k/year for 2 years, and that don't take me off the list, but I won't pay over msrp. So, we'll have to wait and see.

 

All I know is that if I am forced to wait...after already waiting a year.. I will purchase my Shelby elsewhere (at sticker or below), and make sure the owner, who I am familiar with, knows this. And then I will inform him that he has lost all future business from me for purchases & service, and all future purchases from my friends, business associates, and family.

So, when you explain that you won't take the car there for service, make sure that either the GM or the owner knows this. They can then fry in their own fires...which they built.

And Five Oh B, I understand your position, I hope that you understand mine. They should have been good for their word.

[owenkelley]

I have to agree with Joe G. If you don't wnat to pay over MSRP sit back and wait, but when a car has this much preproduction interest it may be tough to find one at MSRP or less for a long time. You could also wait a couple years and buy a used one because I am sure these cars are going to depreciate for several years before they start coming back up. I would be willing to bet that there are going to be a bunch of low mileage used ones out there in about 5 years, and I think there will be some good buys. For me, I want a brand new one and I want to keep it for as long as I can drive, so if I have to pay over MSRP that doesn't bother me because I figure $5000 divided by forty years isn't that big of a deal. If I didn't want an '07 so bad I'd just wait for an '08, but you know the invoice is going to be higher in '08, so even if you do buy it for MSRP you might only be saving $3000 by waiting a year if the invoice goes up a couple thousand dollars, and assuming you can buy one for MSRP. We might be facing the same situation a year from now if they come out with a GT500KR with 600 horsepower! Maybe there will be a bunch of '07 GT500's for sale cheap at that time! The sad thing is, since we still don't know for sure how much these cars are going to cost, I may not be able to afford one even if I could buy it at invoice!

[gt5001]

Take a deep breath. Then go back and look at what's happened with the Ford GT. Or, even the Thunderbird.

Yeah, the GT500 is a less expensive car, but dealers who do with the GT500 as they did with the Ford GT will see the same result. If not MSRP, darn close. Check Ebay for GT bids/prices right now.

 

If Ford builds 10,000 to 12,000 cars over two years, that will be plenty. This car isn't a Shelby, like the 60s model Mustangs or the Cobras. It's an SVT product with the letters SHELBY on the decklid.

[crispy23c]

Absolutely agree. And, if I had to wait 5 years to buy this car, I would just can it & save for a Ford GT....or something else.

[orange whip 04]

How and when do Dealerships know what there allocations will be ? And why is that some dealers say they have allocation numbers but other dealers dont get any information ??? Why are not these allocation numbers given to all dealers at the same time ? or for that matter, pricing and ordering information?? Confused here :blink:

[mrsuds]

How and when do Dealerships know what there allocations will be ? And why is that some dealers say they have allocation numbers but other dealers dont get any information ??? Why are not these allocation numbers given to all dealers at the same time ? or for that matter, pricing and ordering information?? Confused here :blink:

 

 

There was a memo circulated on the web regarding allocation. It made mention that SVT dealers would get a certain amount if they meet certain criteria. I still think everyone is still in the dark as to exactly what Ford is thinking.

 

If I can find that memo, I'll post a link..

[KingCobra]

I think dealer allocation has been held off while they try to decide whether or not to open the GT500 to non-SVT dealerships. I talked to a regular Ford dealership sales manager in my area, and he told me that he hoped to be hearing confirmation on that within the next week or so???

 

 

KingCobra.

[07 Shelby Cobra]

I think dealer allocation has been held off while they try to decide whether or not to open the GT500 to non-SVT dealerships. I talked to a regular Ford dealership sales manager in my area, and he told me that he hoped to be hearing confirmation on that within the next week or so???

KingCobra.

 

 

 

My SVT Guy in Toronto says that there are NO plans for disbandment of SVT Dealers in Canada.

This year anyhow.

Certification requirements would take too long and there isn't a demand at this time from Regular Ford Dealers.

[KingCobra]

We'll see shortly, not that it matters to me, I have no hesitation about my getting one at MSRP for '07.

 

Does anyone think that opening up the GT500s to regular Ford dealerships would bring any negative repercussions down the road???

 

 

KingCobra.

[Five Oh B]

I don't think that the informed customer would have any problems or repersussions long term from buying a GT500 from a non-SVT dealership. You already know what you want, and can inform the dealer of what you're after, even if their sales staff has no clue what the car is due to lack of training.

 

The non-informed customer would likely get fleeced by a non-SVT dealership, though. Those non-SVT dealers that get GT500's will likely get just 1 - maybe 2 - GT500's, so they'll be looking to pounce on the opportunity to sell their 1 GT500 for big bucks. Conversely, an SVT dealership will get many more GT500's and is less likely to mark them up as high as they will have more GT500's to make some dough on.

 

If you are the kind of customer that appreciates or expects a dealership that knows the product, then look for an SVT dealer to do business with. If you have questions, concerns, etc. about the product, you'll definitely want to seek out an SVT dealer to buy your GT500 from. Especially if you'll be needing service work done there in the future for the car. And especially if you're looking to build a long term relationship with that dealer for other car/truck purchases in the future.

 

If you are the kind of customer who has no loyalty to a dealership, and is just looking for the cheapest deal on a new GT500, then it doesn't really matter where you shop. Just shotgun your interest in the GT500 to as many dealers as you can by calling, e-mailing, faxing, or visiting in person.

[lawdude]

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QUOTE(Five Oh B @ Feb 4 2006, 03:22 PM) 3345[/snapback]

 

If you are the kind of customer who has no loyalty to a dealership

 

 

Haha, loyalty plus an extra $10K will get you a Shelby at some dealerships.

[Five Oh B]

B)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Five Oh B @ Feb 4 2006, 03:22 PM) 3345[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->

 

If you are the kind of customer who has no loyalty to a dealership

Haha, loyalty plus an extra $10K will get you a Shelby at some dealerships.

 

 

Yep, and that would include our dealership.

 

70 customers wanted a Shelby here, but we only get 3-5 of them. More than half of those customers are good loyal customers, so how to decide which get the cars???? No matter how we chose, some customers were gonna get their feelings hurt (or become irate). At $10K, 55 customers dropped out, leaving 15 still in for a Shelby - still too many considering we only get 3-5 of them. So, we went through the list of 15 and picked our best customers. None of those guys are complaining about the price, or even bringing it up. The price was clearly stated before we took their deposits. Since taking their deposits, each of them has personally told me how excited they are to know that they'll be getting a Shelby. Actually getting a car is way more important to these guys than a markup over sticker.

 

So, you are correct, loyalty and $10K do get you a Shelby. Loyalty alone means you get no Shelby here when there are so many other guys willing to outbid you.

 

Hey, by the way, I want a Shelby, too. I've bought four new cars from our dealership in the last 6 years so I'm a loyal customer, too. However, us employees have to wait until customers get their cars and there's an extra car available. Guess that means I'll be waiting indefinitely for a Shelby, so I'm in the same boat as most of you.

[lawdude]

Just having a little fun with you Five Oh B. Nothing personal. Some of your info I actually find quite helpful and appreciate those posts.

 

Like I said in other posts, I'll have a new car before January of next year (when my 4 year/60,000 warranty runs out on my Infiniti). If my local Ford dealer wants over MSRP, I'll get one of the other cars I was researching before the Shelby appeared on my radar, viz. BMW M3 (no local dealer) or Corvette (local service department).

 

Oh, and my next Ford SUV (I'm on my third) will come from another dealer.

[crispy23c]

Just having a little fun with you Five Oh B. Nothing personal. Some of your info I actually find quite helpful and appreciate those posts.

 

Like I said in other posts, I'll have a new car before January of next year (when my 4 year/60,000 warranty runs out on my Infiniti). If my local Ford dealer wants over MSRP, I'll get one of the other cars I was researching before the Shelby appeared on my radar, viz. BMW M3 (no local dealer) or Corvette (local service department).

 

Oh, and my next Ford SUV (I'm on my third) will come from another dealer.

 

 

....and that's how FoMoCo ends up losing sales to the competition...

[Five Oh B]

Just having a little fun with you Five Oh B. Nothing personal. Some of your info I actually find quite helpful and appreciate those posts.

 

 

Lawdude, I knew you were kiddin' around - it's all good fun here. Even though many of you don't like the fact that dealers are asking over MSRP, and we're included in that group (at least for now), I still am an enthusiast first and foremost and want to share info with you all to help lessen your anxiety over the GT500.

 

 

....and that's how FoMoCo ends up losing sales to the competition...

 

 

That's a rather myopic view as it isn't just FoMoCo. Remember when Mazda dealers were gouging for the then-new Miata 15 years ago, or when the Chrysler dealers did it when the PT Loser was first introduced, or how about those Chevy dealers stickin' it to customers for the early Z06's (and doing it again with the C6 Z06's), and remember the early '90's when Dodge dealers were selling Vipers for $100K (almost double MSRP). Even Honda dealers took advantage of the huge demand for Odyssey minivans a few years ago when they finally became the best minivan out there.

 

It's not a Ford-thing. It's not even a domestic automaker thing. It's an industry thing. Whenever the latest-greatest automobile is released there are plenty of dealers trying to capitalize on an opportunity to make an extra buck or two.

[KingCobra]

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QUOTE(Five Oh B @ Feb 7 2006, 08:35 AM) 3554[/snapback]

Lawdude, I knew you were kiddin' around - it's all good fun here. Even though many of you don't like the fact that dealers are asking over MSRP, and we're included in that group (at least for now), I still am an enthusiast first and foremost and want to share info with you all to help lessen your anxiety over the GT500.

That's a rather myopic view as it isn't just FoMoCo. Remember when Mazda dealers were gouging for the then-new Miata 15 years ago, or when the Chrysler dealers did it when the PT Loser was first introduced, or how about those Chevy dealers stickin' it to customers for the early Z06's (and doing it again with the C6 Z06's), and remember the early '90's when Dodge dealers were selling Vipers for $100K (almost double MSRP). Even Honda dealers took advantage of the huge demand for Odyssey minivans a few years ago when they finally became the best minivan out there.

 

It's not a Ford-thing. It's not even a domestic automaker thing. It's an industry thing. Whenever the latest-greatest automobile is released there are plenty of dealers trying to capitalize on an opportunity to make an extra buck or two.

 

 

 

Thare it is........

 

Straight up as always.

 

Hard to argue the logic.

 

 

KingCobra.

[owenkelley]

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QUOTE(Five Oh B @ Feb 7 2006, 09:35 AM) 3554[/snapback]

Lawdude, I knew you were kiddin' around - it's all good fun here. Even though many of you don't like the fact that dealers are asking over MSRP, and we're included in that group (at least for now), I still am an enthusiast first and foremost and want to share info with you all to help lessen your anxiety over the GT500.

That's a rather myopic view as it isn't just FoMoCo. Remember when Mazda dealers were gouging for the then-new Miata 15 years ago, or when the Chrysler dealers did it when the PT Loser was first introduced, or how about those Chevy dealers stickin' it to customers for the early Z06's (and doing it again with the C6 Z06's), and remember the early '90's when Dodge dealers were selling Vipers for $100K (almost double MSRP). Even Honda dealers took advantage of the huge demand for Odyssey minivans a few years ago when they finally became the best minivan out there.

 

It's not a Ford-thing. It's not even a domestic automaker thing. It's an industry thing. Whenever the latest-greatest automobile is released there are plenty of dealers trying to capitalize on an opportunity to make an extra buck or two.

 

 

EXACTLY! - Couldn't have said it better myself, although I have tried!

[crispy23c]

Yes, Five Oh B, you are correct, all dealers have done this at times. It doesn't mean that some not will go elsewhere.

I'm just really frustrated with my dealer right now. Can I afford ADMU? Yup. Will I do it? Nope. The crux of my frustration lies with the dealer's word. In my case, he broke it, so I'm a little miffed. Had he made no promises, I would have been better with it. But, I still have an ace in the hole that I am thinking about going to. No, it's not Uncle HTT, either...

So, in short, please do not think my flames are directed at you in any way, I'm just grappling with reality... B)

 

Edit: changed MSRP to ADMU...

[KingCobra]

I got your back crispy.....

 

What did your dealer tell you initially???

 

And what's the secret handshake deal you got going???

 

We'll know when the time is right..........just curious.

 

 

KingCobra.

[Five Oh B]

So, in short, please do not think my flames are directed at you in any way, I'm just grappling with reality... B)

 

 

I don't feel that anyone is flaming me. I understand that everyone is frustrated with dealers in general. Trust me, I've been involved with all the specialty Mustang websites over the last few years BEFORE the model in question was available to order and the anxiety I see here is the same as it's been before.... i.e. www.IMBOC.com for the 2001 Mustang Bullitt GT, www.BlueOvalNews.com for the 2000 Mustang Spring Feature GT, www.Mach1Registry.com for the 2003-4 Mach 1's, etc. It's always the same things: bad dealers, good dealers, price gouging, changes from concept to production, real hp, final pricing, misinformation from dealers, etc. Yep, it's always the same old thing. There are a couple of you on this website that have gone through this with me before on these other models, so I'm sure it's deja vu for those of you.

[KingCobra]

I've no dought that this is, as you say, the same ol-same ol.

 

As long as dealers don't go telling customers like crispy things that they can't or won't back up later.

 

If I owned a dealership, like any other business, I'd sell on service and maximize my profits to what ever the market would bear for that particular product at that particular time.

 

But if I had shot myself in the foot by offering a customer a deal that I later found out I could have done better on, I'd sell on service and honour my word.

 

I've no dought your doing a good job Five O, and should be offered a GT500 at cost for your efforts!!!

 

I'll talk to your boss..............I have alot of pull you know!!!!!!!

 

KingCobra.

[kaylan1521]

HA! Finally!

 

I kept thinking where have I seen this Five O name before. IMBOC! Of course, it's Brian with the disgruntled 100 000 mile fix my tranny for free customer.

[Joe G]

100% right about dealers with new models. I've seen it so many times in my family that it's almost a joke. Examples: Dad fighting with local dealer when Chrysler Concord came out, and few years later when he wanted a Explorer (height of the SUV craze); me fighting with a dealer who I had already bought 2 new cars from previously (same salesman too!) when I wanted a Silverado in 1999 (he lost the sale and my business forever when he changed the deal AS I WAS SIGNING THE CONTRACT - he had changed the price without telling me on the contract, luckily I re-read it before I signed it!! :angry: ), and last year when we bought our first mini-van - the forementioned Honda Odyssey (I actually bought from a dealer 1.5 hrs away in a small town who didn't try to screw me).

 

Lessons learned - I reward good service & penalize shortsighted dealers who don't reward me for multiple sales &/or long time vehicle service. Funny thing is - I still get periodic calls from the Sales Mgr (about every year there's a new one who must go through a list of "lost customers") at the Chevy dealership who screwed me on the Silverado. I politely remind them to read the notes on what happened 7 years ago, and to not call me until they have new ownership who saw/knew about the fraud that happened with the contract.

 

There's too much competition out there to put up with poor business practices. Darwin usually wins, even in the dealership world!

[KingCobra]

Well, at least we can see you learned to let it go.

 

Good on ya Joe!!!

 

 

KingCobra.

[Joe G]

Well, at least we can see you learned to let it go.

 

Good on ya Joe!!!

KingCobra.

 

 

Hahaha, thanks KingCobra! Now that I re-read my post, I DO sound a bit PO'd don't I? No worries, I'll take some of mrsuds "vitamins" and should be better soon.

[KingCobra]

Didn't you hear................

 

We've just carted him off in the padded wagon.

 

Don't even try the "pretty pink pills" he's pushing now.

 

 

KingCobra.

[DutchGT500]

Didn't you hear................

 

We've just carted him off in the padded wagon.

 

Don't even try the "pretty pink pills" he's pushing now.

KingCobra.

 

 

Every morning I take a triangular pink one. :rolleyes: A,B,C,D,K,Calcium,Magnesium,Zink,Aluminum,Cast Iron,Carbon Fibre and much more is in those pills these days.

[crispy23c]

I got your back crispy.....

 

What did your dealer tell you initially???

 

And what's the secret handshake deal you got going???

 

We'll know when the time is right..........just curious.

KingCobra.

 

I corrected my post. He promised me MSRP, "no problem", "no need to sign paperwork or leave a deposit for a car that doesn't even exist. When it comes time to order, I'll give you a call. You come in, fill in the paperwork for MSRP, and you have the first order through our dealership". "We did it this way with the T-Bird, a very hot car at the time, with no mark-up. Same thing. Me: "No chance of you getting bumped down the line?" Him: "The only way that could possibly happen is if the owner himself wants one. Then you would be number 2. Other than that, no." Form there on in, for the last year, I would touch base with him periodically (every 6 or so weeks), and every time he re-assured me that they had a board up with all potential buyer's names, and I was #1 on the list for a convertible. Until a couple of weeks ago. Then he changed his tune. Nice.

I can't directly comment on any side deals I've got going.....but I have a few resources that I have been working on in parallel to this deal--for the last 3-4 months-- as "insurance". 2 of the 4 have tanked....so I'm not too optimistic. Unless Ford announces 10k per year, I think that it's unlikely that I will get one anytime soon. So, in the meantime......I wait...

 

Every morning I take a triangular pink one. :rolleyes: A,B,C,D,K,Calcium,Magnesium,Zink,Aluminum,Cast Iron,Carbon Fibre and much more is in those pills these days.

 

Remember: Aluminum and Carbon Fiber are an essential part of any diet! Builds strong teeth & bones!!! :P

[Five Oh B]

HA! Finally!

 

I kept thinking where have I seen this Five O name before. IMBOC! Of course, it's Brian with the disgruntled 100 000 mile fix my tranny for free customer.

 

 

That is soooooo funny that you remember that incident. Guy buys a used 2001 Bullitt from us that had over 90,000 miles on it and buys no extended warranty of any kind. Almost 10,000 miles later (at a little over 100,000 miles) he complains publicly at the Bullitt website (www.IMBOC.com) that Ford sucks and our dealer sucks because he can't get his tranny fixed for free! Of course, he didn't tell anyone how many miles were on the car, so they all agree with him. Then I posted the miles and circumstance and everybody flamed him big time.

 

On a side note, a friend of mine bought that Bullitt brand new from me in 2001. Traded it in for a new 2004 Mach 1 - his 4th Mustang. That Bullitt was solid, regularly maintained, best products in it, and VERY well cared for, so I was amazed when the second owner had any problems at all.

 

crispy23c, if I haven't already told you this, I'm sorry that you got the shaft from your dealer. You have a very legitimate beef with that dealer. All the more reason for everyone else to get a deal or agreement in writing to prevent a repeat of crispy23c's situation.

[lawdude]

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QUOTE(Five Oh B @ Feb 8 2006, 02:21 PM) 3633[/snapback]

 

crispy23c, if I haven't already told you this, I'm sorry that you got the shaft from your dealer. You have a very legitimate beef with that dealer. All the more reason for everyone else to get a deal or agreement in writing to prevent a repeat of crispy23c's situation.

 

 

Writing by itself won't do it. There must also be consideration - either cash or maybe take the owner's ugly daughter out on a date.