GT500-07 Posted November 16, 2008 Report Share Posted November 16, 2008 Even as Detroit's Big Three teeter on collapse, United Auto Workers President Ron Gettelfinger said Saturday that the problem is not the union's contract with the automakers and that getting the automakers back on their feet means figuring out a way to turn around the slumping economy. "The focus has to be on the economy as a whole as opposed to a UAW contract," Gettelfinger told reporters on a conference call, noting the labor costs now make up 8 percent to 10 percent of the cost of a vehicle. http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/081115/auto_bailou...ttelfinger.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ilmor Posted November 16, 2008 Report Share Posted November 16, 2008 I'm sure that the auto makers would argue otherwise. I think the point is, every percentage helps. As Obama has said, everyone needs to give up something to make all this work out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Hawkins Posted November 16, 2008 Report Share Posted November 16, 2008 I'm sure that the auto makers would argue otherwise. I think the point is, every percentage helps. As Obama has said, everyone needs to give up something to make all this work out. +1000 I already gave a lot up to do my part......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffIsHereToo Posted November 16, 2008 Report Share Posted November 16, 2008 If everyone went out and traded in their old car for a new American one between now and December everything would be solved! Simple as that! So go buy that new car you've been wanting! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUFDRAFT Posted November 16, 2008 Report Share Posted November 16, 2008 If everyone went out and traded in their old car for a new American one between now and December everything would be solved! Simple as that! So go buy that new car you've been wanting! I'm not tradin' MY car! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ilmor Posted November 16, 2008 Report Share Posted November 16, 2008 If everyone went out and traded in their old car for a new American one between now and December everything would be solved! Simple as that! So go buy that new car you've been wanting! I need a bailout so I can go buy a another new Ford!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shel-b001 Posted November 16, 2008 Report Share Posted November 16, 2008 I'm not tradin' MY car! Good Keep it buy another one (2010) 5.0 Aluminum Block S/C :happy feet: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cali_KR Posted November 16, 2008 Report Share Posted November 16, 2008 I'm sure that the auto makers would argue otherwise. I think the point is, every percentage helps. As Obama has said, everyone needs to give up something to make all this work out. Give up something...BS...until the CEO's lose their "Golden Parachutes" especially guys like that clown that had that 3 week gig for Wamu (I think was that was it), that made 10's of Millions..for 3 weeks...are you kidding me...I'm not giving up any of mine... Or better yet, bust all of those unions....hey if you don't like the job, take your striking ass and move it on down the road...or run your own business like me, and have to actually deal with the day to day stress..instead of going home, plopping down in front of the TV and then falling into a deep sleep...rant over Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUFDRAFT Posted November 16, 2008 Report Share Posted November 16, 2008 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ilmor Posted November 16, 2008 Report Share Posted November 16, 2008 Give up something...BS...until the CEO's lose their "Golden Parachutes" especially guys like that clown that had that 3 week gig for Wamu (I think was that was it), that made 10's of Millions..for 3 weeks...are you kidding me...I'm not giving up any of mine... Or better yet, bust all of those unions....hey if you don't like the job, take your striking ass and move it on down the road...or run your own business like me, and have to actually deal with the day to day stress..instead of going home, plopping down in front of the TV and then falling into a deep sleep...rant over I agree with you 100% about the CEO's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FormerGmc Posted November 17, 2008 Report Share Posted November 17, 2008 If everyone went out and traded in their old car for a new American one between now and December everything would be solved! Simple as that! So go buy that new car you've been wanting! Somehow, I don't think it's that simple! I will be buying a couple of new cars soon. Acura or Honda. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SVTpower Posted November 17, 2008 Report Share Posted November 17, 2008 Give up something...BS...until the CEO's lose their "Golden Parachutes" especially guys like that clown that had that 3 week gig for Wamu (I think was that was it), that made 10's of Millions..for 3 weeks...are you kidding me...I'm not giving up any of mine... Or better yet, bust all of those unions....hey if you don't like the job, take your striking ass and move it on down the road...or run your own business like me, and have to actually deal with the day to day stress..instead of going home, plopping down in front of the TV and then falling into a deep sleep...rant over FINALLY !! someone on my level........thru all this bs auto talk and troubles, no one including the media sees that unions ruined this country.....not sure of the u.s. but the a-holes here keep demanding their 3% per year for the next 3 years..........HELLO union dummies, wake up and smell the coffee.....times are tough, do you really need $28 per hour to put on lug nuts..........take a friggin pay cut and save your jobs!!! Unions suck period !! there, I'm done, I feel better now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Hawkins Posted November 17, 2008 Report Share Posted November 17, 2008 Give up something...BS...until the CEO's lose their "Golden Parachutes" especially guys like that clown that had that 3 week gig for Wamu (I think was that was it), that made 10's of Millions..for 3 weeks...are you kidding me...I'm not giving up any of mine... Or better yet, bust all of those unions....hey if you don't like the job, take your striking ass and move it on down the road...or run your own business like me, and have to actually deal with the day to day stress..instead of going home, plopping down in front of the TV and then falling into a deep sleep...rant over FINALLY !! someone on my level........thru all this bs auto talk and troubles, no one including the media sees that unions ruined this country.....not sure of the u.s. but the a-holes here keep demanding their 3% per year for the next 3 years..........HELLO union dummies, wake up and smell the coffee.....times are tough, do you really need $28 per hour to put on lug nuts..........take a friggin pay cut and save your jobs!!! Unions suck period !!there, I'm done, I feel better now +1,000,000,000,000 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LuisA Posted November 17, 2008 Report Share Posted November 17, 2008 Obama said, redistribution of wealth......problem with this is, that sooner or later, after starting a social program like that, there is no more wealth to be distributed....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boss Doctor Posted November 17, 2008 Report Share Posted November 17, 2008 If everyone went out and traded in their old car for a new American one between now and December everything would be solved! Simple as that! So go buy that new car you've been wanting! I did my part by crack'n up my car and buying a new Ford in September. It's up to you guys! :happy feet: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stormeaston Posted November 17, 2008 Report Share Posted November 17, 2008 FINALLY !! someone on my level........thru all this bs auto talk and troubles, no one including the media sees that unions ruined this country.....not sure of the u.s. but the a-holes here keep demanding their 3% per year for the next 3 years..........HELLO union dummies, wake up and smell the coffee.....times are tough, do you really need $28 per hour to put on lug nuts..........take a friggin pay cut and save your jobs!!! Unions suck period !!there, I'm done, I feel better now How come Toyota isn't in trouble........................could it be because they don't have unions? Hmmmmmmmmm! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SVTpower Posted November 17, 2008 Report Share Posted November 17, 2008 How come Toyota isn't in trouble........................could it be because they don't have unions? Hmmmmmmmmm! ..........and our Honda plant in Alliston too...........no Unions !!! They're doing just fine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2007GT Posted November 17, 2008 Report Share Posted November 17, 2008 Obama said, redistribution of wealth......problem with this is, that sooner or later, after starting a social program like that, there is no more wealth to be distributed....... "Tax the rich...feed the poor... till there are no...rich no more" - Alvin Lee and 10 Years After Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STILLEN Posted November 17, 2008 Report Share Posted November 17, 2008 Let them all file for Chapter 13 - reorganize, an opportunity to get rid of the unions. Upper management can all take pay cuts. IF they are able to pull through of all of this and turn around and show fantastic profits, only THEN do they get some pay back. No bonuses for upper management unless the company is making good profits (pay for performance). Dump the pension plans in favor of 401K's (make the employees responsibile for their OWN retirement) - maybe with a small matching portion. NO government bailout Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FormerGmc Posted November 17, 2008 Report Share Posted November 17, 2008 ^^^^^ Yep! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
svtkeith Posted November 17, 2008 Report Share Posted November 17, 2008 How come Toyota isn't in trouble........................could it be because they don't have unions? Hmmmmmmmmm! Hmmmmmmmm.....Could it be that Toyota just makes GREAT cars. Oh.....And HONDA also makes great cars....Hmmmmmmm...Could it be that simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stormeaston Posted November 17, 2008 Report Share Posted November 17, 2008 ..........and our Honda plant in Alliston too...........no Unions !!! They're doing just fine Seems to be a trend here! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2007GT Posted November 17, 2008 Report Share Posted November 17, 2008 Hmmmmmmmm.....Could it be that Toyota just makes GREAT cars. Oh.....And HONDA also makes great cars....Hmmmmmmm...Could it be that simple. In terms of actual initial quality, dependability etc. Toyota and Honda are really no better than Ford or GM. They have no unions to deal with and they are BOTH extremely well managed companies, Toyota in particular. Neither company makes cars as cool as the big three. I would much rather have a Flex than a Honda Odessey. I would much rather have an F-150 than a Toyota Tundra. Neither company makes a car that turns me on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
svtkeith Posted November 17, 2008 Report Share Posted November 17, 2008 In terms of actual initial quality, dependability etc. Toyota and Honda are really no better than Ford or GM. They have no unions to deal with and they are BOTH extremely well managed companies, Toyota in particular. Neither company makes cars as cool as the big three. I would much rather have a Flex than a Honda Odessey. I would much rather have an F-150 than a Toyota Tundra. Neither company makes a car that turns me on. F-150 vs Toyota Tundra brand new...Not much diff. Fast forward to 200,000 miles then compare....Don't fool yourself.... the Toyota and Honda will Outlast any of the big 3 hands down. I don't like it but it's a fact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUFDRAFT Posted November 17, 2008 Report Share Posted November 17, 2008 Based on what? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Hawkins Posted November 17, 2008 Report Share Posted November 17, 2008 F-150 vs Toyota Tundra brand new...Not much diff. Fast forward to 200,000 miles then compare....Don't fool yourself.... the Toyota and Honda will Outlast any of the big 3 hands down. I don't like it but it's a fact. There are many American made Vehicles on Ebay that have well over 200,000 Miles and still has the Original Engines that have NOT been rebuilt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunedindon#5481 Posted November 17, 2008 Report Share Posted November 17, 2008 Since when do Ford and Chevy have to prove the reliablility of thier trucks. They have been the standard for many, many years and Toyota and Honda have a long way to go before there can be any comparisons. The F150 has been one of the best selling and most abused/used/loved vehicle for, what 25, 30 years. Toyota and Honda build great vehicles but don't go bad mouthing Ford or Chevy on thier trucks. There are millions of Fords and Chevys on the road and Toyota has a lot of selling to do to even be on the same planet as them. Just because the Big 3 have miserable management at the top does not mean they haven't built some good products. They employ lots of good people throughout thier businesses that have nothing to do with the piss poor managment and the greed that has lead to their problems. In the end it is us, you and me, that drive the way Ford and GM have been making vehicles. When gas is down we all want our big, powerful pickups and mammoth SUVs to tow our toys, haul our families and keep us safe. They provide them and when things get tough we all go hey where is the forward thinking. Well they couldn't make any profit selling forward thinking because we wern't buying that. Why do you think that Toyota made the Tundra the jumbo that it is? You think it's because that's what the management at Toyota wanted or maybe it's because that's what they thought we wanted to buy. Look at the lineup Toyota has, almost all of their cars, very boring by the way, have grown in size and weight and luxury, same with Honda. It's all because that's what we wanted and bought. Give them a break, they give us what we want and we always slap them when times get tough. Don Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2007GT Posted November 18, 2008 Report Share Posted November 18, 2008 F-150 vs Toyota Tundra brand new...Not much diff. Fast forward to 200,000 miles then compare....Don't fool yourself.... the Toyota and Honda will Outlast any of the big 3 hands down. I don't like it but it's a fact. That's a perception, not a fact. My Cherokee work vehicle has 180,000 on it and still has nearly the same compression it did when it was new. I drove it straight through to Dallas from Orlando last year averaging 80-90 MPH and it never even flinched. You can barely hear it running. There are millions of high mileage American cars and trucks out there. Pretty much any car will last if you keep the oil clean. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ilmor Posted November 18, 2008 Report Share Posted November 18, 2008 Hmmmmmmmm.....Could it be that Toyota just makes GREAT cars. Oh.....And HONDA also makes great cars....Hmmmmmmm...Could it be that simple. Or...could it be that they can afford higher quality engineering and manufacturing because they don't have to pay out so much money to the UAW? Does everyone realize that it's not just the union salaries that are too high, but also the amount they have to pay in pensions is also very high...plus, even if a UAW employee is laid off, they still have to pay him...plus, if salaries go up, then the pensions increase also??? It's a HUGE drain on cash flow, and reduction in gross profit, which of course affects dollars which can be spent on research, quality engineering and manufacturing. Also, the Big 3 have to negotiate w/ the UAW in order to keep plants open which may not be profitable anymore, and sell cars at a loss. Having said all that, the CEO's and upper level managers should not be taking such big bonuses and parachutes either!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STILLEN Posted November 18, 2008 Report Share Posted November 18, 2008 Or...could it be that they can afford higher quality engineering and manufacturing because they don't have to pay out so much money to the UAW? Does everyone realize that it's not just the union salaries that are too high, but also the amount they have to pay in pensions is also very high...plus, even if a UAW employee is laid off, they still have to pay him...plus, if salaries go up, then the pensions increase also??? It's a HUGE drain on cash flow, and reduction in gross profit, which of course affects dollars which can be spent on research, quality engineering and manufacturing. Also, the Big 3 have to negotiate w/ the UAW in order to keep plants open which may not be profitable anymore, and sell cars at a loss. Having said all that, the CEO's and upper level managers should not be taking such big bonuses and parachutes either!!! Like I said - Chapter-13 - DUMP the unions, replace the pension plans with 401K's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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