How much over msrp will you be paying?

[CT Pats Fan]

Good for you cknight...that'll be a story you can tell in 20 years, like the legends of finding a '56 vette in a barn for $500.

[442forever(noolds)]

Not quite the same thing CT,but I get the point.

I know I will be carrying some extra weight here for awhile. I am lucky enough to be #2 on a list where they're getting 3. I wont know what I will do until the call comes that it's in.

Do I feel bad about not saying anything until the last minute? Not one little bit. It may cost me a grand, but I have the final decision.

 

You are stoked cknight!

Hey, maybe you know my uncle? Uncle Jack.His friends call him JD!

He stays ove r quit a bite...'hic....

10k over would make me very happy. I would do a back flip.Unsuccesfully with injury.

[jrichard]

I thought the following might be interesting or helpful to those who are pondering the ADM issue and how much they should be willing to pay over MSRP.

 

I have my name in with a number of dealers. I've now received two calls from dealers who previously would not quote me ADM. One was fishing for what I'd be willing to pay and the other one said he has an allocation of 4 vehicles and will accept $10k over MSRP. I declined (as I did with a deal for $5k over MSRP a couple of weeks ago).

 

My point: on a bell curve showing pricing, ADM of $20k will be far far far into the tail of the distribution. After talking with quite a few dealers, $10k seems to be the sweet spot (e.g. probably around the median ADM...actually, the median is likely a bit less than that). Finding ADM = $10k just isn't that hard.

 

So for those of you thinking that dealers in your area will be able to collude to keep pricing at MSRP + $20k, the good news is it won't happen. Market forces are strong, and, from what I can tell, the market is saying MSRP + $10k or so. If you're in for less than that, then congratulations...I think you're getting a good deal if you want the car soon.

 

Don't get caught in the hype of $20-$30k ADM...it just isn't happening very often. Take a deep breath and get the best deal you can get or wait a while for things to calm down.

[CT Pats Fan]

jrichard - Thanks!!!

 

It's good to hear some clear thinking amidst the chaos that has developed around this car.

[cknight]

 

You are stoked cknight!

Hey, maybe you know my uncle? Uncle Jack.His friends call him JD!

He stays ove r quit a bite...'hic....

 

 

I don't get the "stoked" commit.

 

As for the "hic" maby so. Most of the U.S. thinks us folk's from TN are hics and as far as I am concerned they can keep thinkng that. I just don't understand why the rest you you yanks keep moving here. By the way, the dealer I am buying the car from is another good ole boy hic also. He's not looking at the money he can make on this car but the money he can make over the next 20 years from me and my family selling me more cars. He sold me a lawn mower twenty years ago and we hae been doing business ever since.

 

Don't get me wrong. I feel very lucky I am getting a car at MSRP, I had a chance early on to get one at 15K over and passed. I talked to a guy I know about this whole MSRP+ thing and he told me to wait, the price will come down. He has a large car collection, around 30, with 6 vipers, 3 or 4 prowlers, a cobra, a new ford gt and several other cars. When I ask him if I should pay over MSRP he said wait, they started out getting 100K over MSRP on the GT's and he just bought one for MSRP. I ask him what the investment value was in his opinion. He said, "if you want to make money, there are alot of other you can invest in that will earn you a much better return". All these cars people are willing to pay over MSRP will not be worth over MSRP for 20 years. Look at the GT, when they first came out the sold for 5K over, you can pick those same cars up now for 20k on the used lot. Good things will come for those willing to wait, wait and see.

[yenrod]

I have finally found a dealer that I could oredr everything the way I wanted. They originally said 20K over, I have talked down to 15K, and I'm going to push for 10K. The dealer I bought my '05 F-150 said they have a tungensten blue with silver stripes MSRP 46.069 selling for 55,069, I declined it today. Not the color I wanted.

[shelby to the bone]

Thanks 5.4 shelby. I did get your story earlier and had forgotten about it. Valid points, and a gamble to be weighed.

Thanks shelby to the bone. I am torn on thinking the 08 will be a better car for less money as opposed to having a first run sure thing with the big monetary hit.

 

[BadTony]

hopefully Zee-ro ADM

[1970boss302]

If the dealer I have had my deposit at and promised MSRP craps out

 

I will take that money and buy a 1970's model Mustang ( have a 1970 Boss 302)

 

a time when people still had morals and values and were not ruled by greed $$$$$

[shelby to the bone]

I thought the following might be interesting or helpful to those who are pondering the ADM issue and how much they should be willing to pay over MSRP.

 

I have my name in with a number of dealers. I've now received two calls from dealers who previously would not quote me ADM. One was fishing for what I'd be willing to pay and the other one said he has an allocation of 4 vehicles and will accept $10k over MSRP. I declined (as I did with a deal for $5k over MSRP a couple of weeks ago).

 

My point: on a bell curve showing pricing, ADM of $20k will be far far far into the tail of the distribution. After talking with quite a few dealers, $10k seems to be the sweet spot (e.g. probably around the median ADM...actually, the median is likely a bit less than that). Finding ADM = $10k just isn't that hard.

 

So for those of you thinking that dealers in your area will be able to collude to keep pricing at MSRP + $20k, the good news is it won't happen. Market forces are strong, and, from what I can tell, the market is saying MSRP + $10k or so. If you're in for less than that, then congratulations...I think you're getting a good deal if you want the car soon.

 

Don't get caught in the hype of $20-$30k ADM...it just isn't happening very often. Take a deep breath and get the best deal you can get or wait a while for things to calm down.

 

 

 

I think you and I have had this conversation before, but, here is where I stand.

 

I started with a dealer in Summer 2003. I was referred there because they had never charged ADM on any car before, even the Tbirds. I met the guy, told him that was important to me and got put first on his list. I kept freq contact with the guy and made sure he knew I would not pay over sticker.

 

Jan of this year, on my way home from seeing the car at the Detroit car show, he tells me his sales manager is going to do a bid system for the car. I said "no thanks". I have had 4 or 5 other MSRP deals on the line. Each one has backed down at the last minute. I found out later that the regional reps are telling them they should get 10-20k over sticker for them. Naturally, they are all seeing the dollar signs and changing their mind.

 

I refuse to pay over sticker, period. Over the history of hot cars, they all start with ADMs and all end with MSRP or less. This is usually 6-12 months later. Ford is notorious for making more cars than they say they will. In fact, they were saying early on that they "would build one for everyone that wants one". I think they will. Eventually, prices will fall. The MotorTrend article was just quoted as 3 years instead of 2. Those that are patient, will save 10k-20k. TO me, that is a lot of coin.

 

I also think that demand is way over estimated. The hype has dealer lists that are longer than they think they will be getting cars. Once people start getting cars, those lists will diminish quickly.

 

I don't have any facts or figures to support this, but, I do have history and common sense on my side. Right now the public thinks that if they don't pay the overage that they won't get one. I, personally, think that is untrue. In fact, I'm banking on it. I'm waiting until they come down. IF I, also, have to wait until 2008, I will. IT is worth 20 grand to wait a year. If I am wrong and I never get the car, it won't be the end of the World. There are a lot of cars available in the 60k (GT500 plus 15 or 20 grand) price range that will adequately fill the void.

 

As far as holding their value, not for a long time. OF course they will be better than a minivan, but, they will still depreciate as a normal car. IF you want a car that does not depreciate, buy a used 911 Turbo. I have been following them for at least 7 years. The 91-94 have not changed in that time and the 96-97 have not changed much.

 

[shelby to the bone]

 

you either pay the asking price or wait in line- if this is a shelby you want yak your head off and be glad someone got one for less than you- if you want an investment car they are easy to find but once again pricey- best to go to a dealer who knows how many shelby's he is alloted and buy into the list- being sure if he only is assured four cars that you have at least the fourth- back that with the money he wants up front and a refund agreement shoul something go wrong- I paid 20 over msrp and have a copy of the order entry with ford with my name and he has one showing a vin # and my car is next unless it is a ragtop- two rags and two coupes- large dealer good awards and communication- if you do not like the rules or the money try another car site - not an investment to me a part of history I can enjoy now and read about it later, No regrets so keep on saying I will wait because if you have not gotten in line now you will wait and the odds of getting a car slim daily- good luck yakity yaks

[442forever(noolds)]

Off topic;

cknight. The,"hic", was a failed attempt at humor regarding the after effects of a beverage of choice alway's in my home. Old no.7 sour mash jack D. I have family in the back woods south, and though I am living in the north east, I don't fall into the now 140+ year war of north/south. All my grand parents were all born in either Italy, Germany or Norway.

Stoked is a term I picked up while growing up on the beach in California. As it means happy, I figured you were with the price your getting a GT500.

 

jrichard; Nice post. It was of help. I think I'm going to try to negotiate them down when it's time to take delivery. I did tell them I was,"on the same page as them", with 15k over. I don't feel bad using similar tactics. Even if I can split the difference with them at 12.5 it will be better then 15. If they don't accept that I will probably go to plan B. Wait until next year,"I'm #2 at another dealer for 2008".

 

Don't talk back.

Just read the facts.

With a half pint of jack.

[yenrod]

darn near whatever it takes! How bout that.

[cknight]

As my son would say, "MY Bad" 442. After my post my son told me stoked was a good thing. Therefore, I am very happy and I know if this deal ends up the way its going I am going to very happy, stoked to the max. :happy feet: :happy feet: :happy feet:

[jrichard]

Shelby 5.4:

 

"Investment Car" = oxymoron

 

But, you're not buying it as an investment...so the car is worth whatever fun you get out of it. I think it's great that you're willing to step up and "just do it"...to get what you want. I want a GT500, too...but I'm not willing to step up to the ADM plate this summer. Which, of course, causes me some grief as I think about how much fun it would be to have the car this year.

 

The reality, though, is that the chance of getting a GT500 is not slim. And it's certainly not getting slimmer. I've turned down three in the past two weeks...one at $5k ADM, one at $10k ADM, and one undetermined but the dealer indicated $10k would do the trick. These were all to be ordered as I wanted them. And I'm in California!

 

The point of my posts: I'm trying to help folks get a reasonable picture of the actual supply/demand picture for this car. Information that I have indicative of this is information I share with the folks here. Bottom line: if you want the car now, negotiate the best deal you can get. Depending on the time you invest, that could be anywhere from $5k ADM to $20k ADM. $20k is on the high side. Since you're paying that amount, I'm sure you do not feel the same.

 

For others, if they are willing to wait, then they will likely get a better price later. There is nothing in the foreseeable future that will create more demand pressure than we see this summer. I know some have said that many don't know this car exits and that demand will increase (and, by definition, ADM will go up) as more people become aware of this car. Fortunately, that analysis is flawed. The publicity on this car has been incredible. It's now on the cover almost every major car magazine.

 

The folks that are willing to pay $10k-$20k ADM are well aware of this car and they'll be buying this summer. If they aren't aware, then they might have medical issues. Obviously, there are plenty of people unaware of the GT500--and those aren't the folks that "have to have" it and are willing to pay huge ADM. They are the folks way way down the demand curve...well below me, so I don't have too much to worry about how much demand pressure they create. Before the end of the game, I believe (and the facts support) that prices will start walking down the demand curve.

 

And yakity yak? Sheesh. I'm not sure, but I think that's an insult...

[LDWLK]

"Investment Car =oxymoron"

I agree with jrichard, I walked away from $10,000 adm's and have found two more at $5000 but I am willing to wait. This will only be weekend nice day car and will sit in garrage otherwise. If I dont get one for MSRP then so be it $45,000 plus gas guzzler $1300, delivery $745 and local tax's appox. $2700 = $49745.00 I can buy alot of nice Muscle cars for that kind of money that will go up in price now instead of 20 years from now...

 

Besides $10,000 over MSRP buys a whole lot of upgrade parts... Just my opinion but I'm willing to wait for a better deal as I am confident it will come. Dan java script:emoticon('', 'smid_17')

[gt500hp]

Shelby 5.4:

 

"Investment Car" = oxymoron

 

But, you're not buying it as an investment...so the car is worth whatever fun you get out of it. I think it's great that you're willing to step up and "just do it"...to get what you want. I want a GT500, too...but I'm not willing to step up to the ADM plate this summer. Which, of course, causes me some grief as I think about how much fun it would be to have the car this year.

 

The reality, though, is that the chance of getting a GT500 is not slim. And it's certainly not getting slimmer. I've turned down three in the past two weeks...one at $5k ADM, one at $10k ADM, and one undetermined but the dealer indicated $10k would do the trick. These were all to be ordered as I wanted them. And I'm in California!

 

The point of my posts: I'm trying to help folks get a reasonable picture of the actual supply/demand picture for this car. Information that I have indicative of this is information I share with the folks here. Bottom line: if you want the car now, negotiate the best deal you can get. Depending on the time you invest, that could be anywhere from $5k ADM to $20k ADM. $20k is on the high side. Since you're paying that amount, I'm sure you do not feel the same.

 

For others, if they are willing to wait, then they will likely get a better price later. There is nothing in the foreseeable future that will create more demand pressure than we see this summer. I know some have said that many don't know this car exits and that demand will increase (and, by definition, ADM will go up) as more people become aware of this car. Fortunately, that analysis is flawed. The publicity on this car has been incredible. It's now on the cover almost every major car magazine.

 

The folks that are willing to pay $10k-$20k ADM are well aware of this car and they'll be buying this summer. If they aren't aware, then they might have medical issues. Obviously, there are plenty of people unaware of the GT500--and those aren't the folks that "have to have" it and are willing to pay huge ADM. They are the folks way way down the demand curve...well below me, so I don't have too much to worry about how much demand pressure they create. Before the end of the game, I believe (and the facts support) that prices will start walking down the demand curve.

 

And yakity yak? Sheesh. I'm not sure, but I think that's an insult...

 

 

 

 

Ok...Since you've turned down the 5k ADM and are not going to buy...... how about giving out the dealers name, I'll buy it on the spot :happy feet: .

[Five Oh B]

This is my first time on this forum, but I am an Internet Coordinator in Seattle, WA. We are getting 7 Shelby Cobra's in and three of them are left. We're selling them $15,000 over the MSRP. I have not heard of anyone taking anything less.

 

 

Funny, but I'm in the Seattle area and have the same zone manager that you do. I just asked him yesterday if allocations have been released yet and they have not, so how can you possibly think you get 7 GT500's? Also, we sold all of our allocated GT500's for $10,000 over MSRP, and have 16 more guys willing to pay that if we can get additional allocations.

 

On a side note, Ford dropped the "Cobra" out of the name of the car. It is technically a Shelby GT500.

[gt500hp]

"Investment Car =oxymoron"

I agree with jrichard, I walked away from $10,000 adm's and have found two more at $5000 but I am willing to wait. This will only be weekend nice day car and will sit in garrage otherwise. If I dont get one for MSRP then so be it $45,000 plus gas guzzler $1300, delivery $745 and local tax's appox. $2700 = $49745.00 I can buy alot of nice Muscle cars for that kind of money that will go up in price now instead of 20 years from now...

 

Besides $10,000 over MSRP buys a whole lot of upgrade parts... Just my opinion but I'm willing to wait for a better deal as I am confident it will come. Dan java script:emoticon('', 'smid_17')

 

 

OK...GIVE ME THE DEALERS NAME......i WANT TO BUY!!! :bandance:

[jrichard]

Ok...Since you've turned down the 5k ADM and are not going to buy...... how about giving out the dealers name, I'll buy it on the spot :happy feet: .

 

 

I doubt the dealer still has the car...it's been +/- two weeks and I know they had other interested buyers. And I think the current realistic market price is around $10k ADM. Even if they still have it, who knows if they now think the price should be more than $5k. If they suddenly get a ton of phone calls, you can bet they'll move the price up. My first contact with the dealer was about 4 weeks ago and I was the first one on their "list."

 

I will not post the dealer name on an open forum. It's a small dealer, my contact was very friendly with me, and they would be flooded with calls. However, I'll email the dealer name and contact person/number to the first 5 emails I receive.

 

email me: supermobe@yahoo.com

 

No, it's not my regular email...I don't feel like being harrassed with constant emails asking where I've found the cars I've found...and I won't check the email after today.

 

If you're suggesting I'm not being truthful, then I guess that's on you. One question is: why would I not be truthful about this information? Especially since (a) similar experience has been shared by others, ( b ) you can find cars under $20k by calling around (and now dealers are calling me...), © I've repeatedly said the car is worth what it's worth to YOU...

 

My point, though, is that it's unfortunate to get sucked into the hype if you are willing to WAIT but are afraid you'll never get a chance to own the car if you don't step up NOW. If you're not willing to wait, then you should get the best deal you can get and move on. What you should not do is try to get others to buy into $20k ADM because it might help justify your price (...uh, just a guess that this might be what is going on here...).

[442forever(noolds)]

5 Oh b. I think that post was someone assuming a bogus identity for unknown reasons. The use of, "cobra" Tells me this person is fishing for something and using the wrong bait.

[gt500hp]

I doubt the dealer still has the car...it's been +/- two weeks and I know they had other interested buyers. And I think the current realistic market price is around $10k ADM. Even if they still have it, who knows if they now think the price should be more than $5k. If they suddenly get a ton of phone calls, you can bet they'll move the price up. My first contact with the dealer was about 4 weeks ago and I was the first one on their "list."

 

I will not post the dealer name on an open forum. It's a small dealer, my contact was very friendly with me, and they would be flooded with calls. However, I'll email the dealer name and contact person/number to the first 5 emails I receive.

 

email me: supermobe@yahoo.com

 

No, it's not my regular email...I don't feel like being harrassed with constant emails asking where I've found the cars I've found...and I won't check the email after today.

 

If you're suggesting I'm not being truthful, then I guess that's on you. One question is: why would I not be truthful about this information? Especially since (a) similar experience has been shared by others, ( b ) you can find cars under $20k by calling around (and now dealers are calling me...), © I've repeatedly said the car is worth what it's worth to YOU...

 

My point, though, is that it's unfortunate to get sucked into the hype if you are willing to WAIT but are afraid you'll never get a chance to own the car if you don't step up NOW. If you're not willing to wait, then you should get the best deal you can get and move on. What you should not do is try to get others to buy into $20k ADM because it might help justify your price (...uh, just a guess that this might be what is going on here...).

 

 

Ok.....jRichard just informed me that he gave somebody the name of the dealership on these threads today and they just made the deal for 5k over..... Who's the lucky guy! post here and let us all know!

[b]But on the otherhand maybe jRichard was just blowing smoke! [/b :wacko: ] I'm sure the dealership would like the praise for not being a greety Your turn to come clean and share the info jRichard!

[TwinTurboBoss]

.

[jrichard]

To me anything under 10k is a good deal to be guaranteed a car. 15k is getting to the gouging stage.

20-30k like a lot of dealers are trying to get is going to hurt business in the long run. I know from the ones I have spoken with that are in the 20-30k that when it comes time for next new car I will look elsewhere.

 

 

 

 

From what I understand there will be "NO" 2008 Shelby GT500. 2008 GT500 KR maybe through Shelby Auto

2009 will be a re-design for Mustang

 

 

Regarding pricing, I think you're on target in the current market...$10k is a good deal (I'd call it fair) right now...

 

Regarding no 2008 from Ford...just one via Shelby Auto...I'm wondering where you heard that information. It's contraditory to other information in the market and it also doesn't make much financial sense for any of the players.

 

GT500hp: I'll email you the email of the person that is getting the deal. If he wants to let you know details, then it's up to him. I won't post the information here. And I won't send out more information re: the dealer. I don't think it'd be fair to mess up his deal by getting a bunch of folks bidding up the price. If he wants to post here so you know I'm not "blowing smoke," that also is up to him.

[442forever(noolds)]

jrichard. I wouldn't disclose who you make deals with. If someone chooses to not believe you let them. Just means they are skeptical people.

Kudo's to you for giving someone else a deal.

I wish I was in Cali to have scored on that, however I'm glad I'm not living there anyone.

I would also like to know where this no 2008 GT500 is coming from. I also find that impossible to buy. No way it would be a one year production car.

[Broeli]

Why would you want 3 Shelbys?? These cars are not a good investment. You are actually thinking of selling a muscle car that is truley a better investment for an overpriced modern Shelby that will be made in numbers exceeding 18,000!?

I'm just curious why you are seeking out GT500's for 10k over msrp and under. A good deal at 10k over??! I hate to be harsh but it sounds like you have more money than sense.

Go ahead and keep listening to the price gouging dealers that are telling you none will be made in '08. If Ford can sell them they'll make as many as they can...that has already been stated by Ford. The only way they'd completely discontinue it after one year is if it's a total failure sales wise....

 

I bought/ordered & confirmation on 2 cars. One I paid well under MSRP the other a fair amt over msrp. I was offered a 3rd car for 8k over MSRP. I have until Monday to say whether I will take it or not.

 

I need to make a very fast decision to sell another of my beloved Muscle cars.

 

I have called nearly 200 dealers & nearly all are not even taking names any longer. The ones I could I gave my name to.

 

A lot of dealers in my area are taking very large deposits just to have your name in a pool to get a chance at one. Best offer takes it once they let it sit on showroom for a few weeks etc.

 

At 20k over I could buy as many cars as Jay Leno or Bill Gates could afford.

 

To me anything under 10k is a good deal to be guaranteed a car. 15k is getting to the gouging stage.

20-30k like a lot of dealers are trying to get is going to hurt business in the long run. I know from the ones I have spoken with that are in the 20-30k that when it comes time for next new car I will look elsewhere.

 

I may use the close ones to find options and info from them, test drive them but when it comes time to sign on dotted line I will simply tell them.... "Do you remember when I tried to buy a Shelby and you tried to GOUGE me?" Well thanks for the info but because of that you lost my business for life. Have a great day!

 

From what I understand there will be "NO" 2008 Shelby GT500. 2008 GT500 KR maybe through Shelby Auto

2009 will be a re-design for Mustang

 

[jrichard]

jrichard. I wouldn't disclose who you make deals with. If someone chooses to not believe you let them. Just means they are skeptical people.

Kudo's to you for giving someone else a deal.

I wish I was in Cali to have scored on that, however I'm glad I'm not living there anyone.

I would also like to know where this no 2008 GT500 is coming from. I also find that impossible to buy. No way it would be a one year production car.

 

 

 

Yeah, you're right. Unfortunately, I already sent him the email info. Oh well, no harm.

 

Just for the record, this particular deal was out of state. That's one of the reasons I passed on it...it would have been a headache for me to get the car. It was close, though...$5k ADM isn't bad (...looks pretty good these days...) and, even though I think prices will come off dramatically in the next 12 months, it sure was tempting just to get the car early.

[RUFDRAFT]

No dissertation here - just a thought.

 

If any of you who are planning on paying over MSRP plan on selling the car anytime soon, just remember this:

 

When you go to sell, they don't care what you paid for the car.

 

Ask the boys on the '03-'04 Mach 1 Forums.

 

Just a reminder.

 

That's all I've got to say about that.

[Orf]

That's all I've got to say about that.

 

 

Run, Forest. Run.

[RUFDRAFT]

Very good.