car dude Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 When it becomes even more of a ghost town, they will wonder where and why we left. Even us long timers are disappearing. No company can continue on feelings of entitlement. With the economic situation in this country worsening I am having to tighten my budget.So when I buy performance parts for my Shelby I go to Shelby performance as do a lot of people on this site but here's the rub I can get performance parts cheaper from other vendors but i choose the stay loyal to Shelby. The same goes with this site i have options of several Shelby and car fourms to become a member. but I have meet several members here and believe it or not we do have more to our life then car's and Shelby's that is why the non automotive off topic fourm was created so guys that become friends have a place to BS. I really do not think its about money I think this fourm embarrasses the people that own the site. So its OK to keep posting if you pay for it but otherwise please just go away. I just hope they realize there actions taken here is reflective of the whole Shelby Corporationt. The owners of this site have a right to do as they see fit. As a participant of this fourm and as a customer I will have to go were I feel welcome and spend my money with people that appreciates its customers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry T Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 I can see both sides of the arguement. From SA's perspective it makes sense. It keeps the free and open section of the site focused on the vehicles and allows paying TS members to have their section to discuss off-topic items. Many people choose to not become paying members because, essentially, everything about TS is open to them for free (they just don't get the member kit goodies). Also, from Rich's statement, the whole site isn't becoming pay-to-play; so let's try not to catastraphize the situation. This does bring up a good point though, Tracy and the rest of the TS leadership are concerned about what the Team wants, so please do contact your State and Regional Directors with input on things. That is why the Directors are ther;, Shelby wants feedback from it's Team members. +1 ... change happens and I am choosing to embrace it as I appreciatte the value in my Team Shelby membership. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmcmotorworks Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 (edited) New thread under Team Shelby Forum may be of interest. Edited September 28, 2015 by cmcmotorworks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Z-man Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 So I’ve been ‘lurking’ on this thread, reading the comments and trying to make up my mind if this really is a good thing or not. I can see that TS is trying to do something to ‘add value’ for its paying members, and make that membership a little more exclusive. But the other side of that coin is that is also makes the website more separatist and builds a wall between the now ‘entitled’ paying class and the ”common man”. I agree with SA trying to build value (there is a separate thread, actually more than one, just on what members would like to see in the membership package…which is their question to us asking what we value) but there must be a way to do that without making people feel alienated.This morning I read a post from a friend who said that due to this upcoming change, he would find another place on the web to spend his time. This prompted me to search around a little more, and I found on another very popular TS thread, that just happens to be in the section that will no longer be public, there are numerous other folks who are saying their goodbyes to TS. Some are even making plans to meet on other web-sites or different social media platforms.I know it was not TS’s intention to drive people away, but that is the reality of what is happening. Some may say it’s only a few, but we all know that for one person who speaks up, there are many others who feel the same way but won’t say anything. Some may also say that if it’s so important for them to be ‘included’ , all they need to do is pay the membership fee, and life goes on….but that’s not the point. Paying membership should be voluntary, not required so that members can continue to participate in the threads/discussions that some of them have for years. Furthermore, membership should stand alone as being something that brings so many benefits and value, that everyone would want to join, not feel compelled to join in order to feel included.….So I’ve made up my mind, and while I am not opposed to change, this is not a good thing.Z-man Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichS Posted September 28, 2015 Author Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 New thread under Team Shelby Forum may be of interest. Ok everyone, take a look. In this example, someone was warned about his actions in the forums and how we wouldn't stand for any "club within a club" nonsense, especially in the publicly-accessible areas. So, in response to my warning, he went silent for a few days then started right back up with stuff like "spelling CARS backwards", posting pictures of logos, etc. I meant what I said when I told everyone that this wouldn't be tolerated. Let me say that again for clarity. I actually meant what I said, this will not be tolerated. So, when we get together to discuss how to improve the visitor experience, particularly since our analytics show us how much international viewership we're getting now that Mustang is a world car, it's clear what we to make the public areas a nonsense-free zone. We want those hundreds of thousands of anonymous viewers to actually find the relevant information they're seeking when they come here, as silly and illogical as that sounds to a few of you. We also have other goals in mind as I stated at the top of this thread and this action is in line with those as well. There is a place for this non-Shelby-related banter but it's not in full view of the public. We're NOT eliminating it, we're just moving it. If you're looking to place blame, look no further than this one individual and a few others like him who prompted the conversation in the first place. It actually will not be tolerated, as promised. We understand that some feathers will be ruffled. It's impossible to please all of the people all of the time. If you choose to go elsewhere that's your decision and we respect that. We'll always be here if you choose to return and no hard feelings, truly. We just have to look out for the best interests of and how we relate to hundreds of thousands of visitors now. To quote the late great Leonard Nimoy, "The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the one." That's precisely what we're doing. It's only logical. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shelbymotorsports Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 (edited) I urge everyone to please take a deep breath and read what RichS has written. I would also like to remind everyone of the following: The NTT thread is NOT being taken away, its just being moved to the premium membership area. Except for the one person who has been causing a disturbance on TS for the last month or two the NTT thread results in more reported thread complaints than any other area on TS. Why should SAI spend additional resources on people who do not contribute to the Shelby community but instead disrupt this site. For those that claim this move will cause members to leave TS, you are not taking into account potential members who never joined TS because of what they saw happening here. For example we all saw how the "shout box" was hijacked a week or two ago by certain members acting like 12 year olds. Do you really think any new visitors to TS that week said hey this is the place for me? For those that claim this is a money grab by SAI or that you will never pay for a club membership then how about thinking of it this way. The money you save at SPP by using your TS discount could easily offset your TS membership. There are some other reasons that this change is being made which can not be discussed outside the company but instead of claiming the sky is falling and calling SAI names how about giving it a chance. If SAI has indeed made an error by implementing this change then there's no reason it couldn't be changed back. Let calm heads prevail as it benefits everyone. Case in point, someone made a suggestion of a two tiered membership for folks that don't care about club swag but would like to access premium areas of TS. Now that is constructive and certainly something that I could get behind. Steve Edited September 28, 2015 by shelbymotorsports Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
car dude Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 So I’ve been ‘lurking’ on this thread, reading the comments and trying to make up my mind if this really is a good thing or not. I can see that TS is trying to do something to ‘add value’ for its paying members, and make that membership a little more exclusive. But the other side of that coin is that is also makes the website more separatist and builds a wall between the now ‘entitled’ paying class and the ”common man”. I agree with SA trying to build value (there is a separate thread, actually more than one, just on what members would like to see in the membership package…which is their question to us asking what we value) but there must be a way to do that without making people feel alienated. This morning I read a post from a friend who said that due to this upcoming change, he would find another place on the web to spend his time. This prompted me to search around a little more, and I found on another very popular TS thread, that just happens to be in the section that will no longer be public, there are numerous other folks who are saying their goodbyes to TS. Some are even making plans to meet on other web-sites or different social media platforms. I know it was not TS’s intention to drive people away, but that is the reality of what is happening. Some may say it’s only a few, but we all know that for one person who speaks up, there are many others who feel the same way but won’t say anything. Some may also say that if it’s so important for them to be ‘included’ , all they need to do is pay the membership fee, and life goes on….but that’s not the point. Paying membership should be voluntary, not required so that members can continue to participate in the threads/discussions that some of them have for years. Furthermore, membership should stand alone as being something that brings so many benefits and value, that everyone would want to join, not feel compelled to join in order to feel included. ….So I’ve made up my mind, and while I am not opposed to change, this is not a good thing. Z-man[/quThanks Z-man very well said Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mywickedshelby Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 Short sighted........unfortunately.....that is the company motto of Shelby American these days....... way to go Rich......driving more people away from the site............great job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cobra99 Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 A forum is only as strong as it members. I support a forum because of the content and not just to get special access. A two tier system in my opinion will only hurt and drive new memberships away. Mods should have the power to take out the trash and hiding it isn't the answer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mywickedshelby Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 the inertia of circling the drain leads to bad decisions.....this is just ANOTHER one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grsybtch Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 Short sighted........unfortunately.....that is the company motto of Shelby American these days....... way to go Rich......driving more people away from the site............great job. He's too busy chasing cncmotorworks around the forum and threatining him with his awesome power to pay attention to your comments Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Hawkins Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 He's too busy chasing cncmotorworks around the forum and threatining him with his awesome power to pay attention to your comments yeah, granted, CMC has been "poking the bear" lately but I think RichS has turned it into a personal vendetta......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
car dude Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 I urge everyone to please take a deep breath and read what RichS has written. I would also like to remind everyone of the following: The NTT thread is NOT being taken away, its just being moved to the premium membership area. Except for the one person who has been causing a disturbance on TS for the last month or two the NTT thread results in more reported thread complaints than any other area on TS. Why should SAI spend additional resources on people who do not contribute to the Shelby community but instead disrupt this site. For those that claim this move will cause members to leave TS, you are not taking into account potential members who never joined TS because of what they saw happening here. For example we all saw how the "shout box" was hijacked a week or two ago by certain members acting like 12 year olds. Do you really think any new visitors to TS that week said hey this is the place for me? For those that claim this is a money grab by SAI or that you will never pay for a club membership then how about thinking of it this way. The money you save at SPP by using your TS discount could easily offset your TS membership.There are some other reasons that this change is being made which can not be discussed outside the company but instead of claiming the sky is falling and calling SAI names how about giving it a chance. If SAI has indeed made an error by implementing this change then there's no reason it couldn't be changed back. Let calm heads prevail as it benefits everyone. Case in point, someone made a suggestion of a two tiered membership for folks that don't care about club swag but would like to access premium areas of TS. Now that is constructive and certainly something that I could get behind. Steve Instead of making it a paid for section how about making access to that section based off your post count. You could either pay and have access or if you don't or CAN'T pay you could still gain access by contributing to the site as a whole and that would be by posting new threds and replying to all ready established fourms.thanks its just a idea Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmcmotorworks Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 Okay, here goes. I hope I don't get in trouble. I kind of agree and understand Rich's intent to create a more exclusive access to the NTT thread and not have it available to the occasional passerby. So a good solution to this would be to create a two level Team Shelby membership program. Let's say a $15.00 White level membership which allows access to the restricted parts of TS. This is great for the ones who don't want or need all the swag. Then a $50.00 Blue level membership which would include all the normal swag items. I agree with Rich in that there should be some investment, even if small, for the mainstays on TS that contribute regularly and have for many years. I think this could be a good thing. There. I know I'm on thin ice with some of the TS members, so I hope I don't get in more trouble ! I urge everyone to please take a deep breath and read what RichS has written. I would also like to remind everyone of the following: The NTT thread is NOT being taken away, its just being moved to the premium membership area. Except for the one person who has been causing a disturbance on TS for the last month or two the NTT thread results in more reported thread complaints than any other area on TS. Why should SAI spend additional resources on people who do not contribute to the Shelby community but instead disrupt this site. For those that claim this move will cause members to leave TS, you are not taking into account potential members who never joined TS because of what they saw happening here. For example we all saw how the "shout box" was hijacked a week or two ago by certain members acting like 12 year olds. Do you really think any new visitors to TS that week said hey this is the place for me? For those that claim this is a money grab by SAI or that you will never pay for a club membership then how about thinking of it this way. The money you save at SPP by using your TS discount could easily offset your TS membership. There are some other reasons that this change is being made which can not be discussed outside the company but instead of claiming the sky is falling and calling SAI names how about giving it a chance. If SAI has indeed made an error by implementing this change then there's no reason it couldn't be changed back. Let calm heads prevail as it benefits everyone. Case in point, someone made a suggestion of a two tiered membership for folks that don't care about club swag but would like to access premium areas of TS. Now that is constructive and certainly something that I could get behind. Steve Hmmm. It looks like it was me. Maybe I'm not that bad of a guy after all ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmcmotorworks Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 My guess is the Team Shelby website costs a substantial amount to maintain and operate. Many here most likely pay substantially larger sums of money for an hour or two of entertainment, gambling, movies, and even television now. Even at $50.00 per year it is a tremendous value for the time spent intellectually, humorously, and forging lifelong friendships. Consider this, if the entire site were "pay to play", at a lower level membership fee it would be more exclusive and there might be less trolls ! Hmmmm. Another ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Hawkins Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 Hmmm. It looks like it was me. Maybe I'm not that bad of a guy after all ! YEAH....you are........................................................ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twobjshelbys Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 (edited) Instead of making it a paid for section how about making access to that section based off your post count. You could either pay and have access or if you don't or CAN'T pay you could still gain access by contributing to the site as a whole and that would be by posting new threds and replying to all ready established fourms.thanks its just a idea One person is really responsible for this. He's been given probation and continues to exhibit the same behaviours. Now he is a paid member (and I am not any longer) so I can see cutting him some slack, but if you want to blame someone, don't blame RichS. He's just doing his job. I had the experience of moderating an old "Notes file" in the old days of DEC VAX [They were really the first "forums", organized identically to a no sub-forum version. Len Kawell left DEC and went on to create Lotus Notes. VAX NOTES was also inspired by Plato Notes.]. I had a similar disruptive person and, eventually based on feedback from others, had a chat with his manager. It turned out that his forum behaviour was not his only disruptive and he was gone from the company shortly thereafter. Edited September 28, 2015 by twobjshelbys Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmcmotorworks Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 One person is really responsible for this. He's been given probation and continues to exhibit the same behaviours. Now he is a paid member (and I am not any longer) so I can see cutting him some slack, but if you want to blame someone, don't blame RichS. He's just doing his job. I had the experience of moderating an old "Notes file" in the old days of DEC VAX [They were really the first "forums", organized identically to a no sub-forum version. Len Kawell left DEC and went on to create Lotus Notes. VAX NOTES was also inspired by Plato Notes.]. I had a similar disruptive person and, eventually based on feedback from others, had a chat with his manager. It turned out that his forum behaviour was not his only disruptive and he was gone from the company shortly thereafter. Sorry, one last parting shot ! You sure remind me of Frank Burns ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheppd01 Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 Why would you want to hide this stuff. It's all very entertaining. ? I could really care less either way. Do what you got to do SA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grsybtch Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 Sorry, one last parting shot ! You sure remind me of Frank Burns ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grsybtch Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 I've gotta say........I've been more entertained today then I've been in a loooooong time If Rich S and company truly believes that a bunch of guys talking about their day to day (that anyone was free to join by the way) Is more damaging to this forum then a bunch of guys screaming at each other and calling names over what their KR is worth or what makes a "real" Shelby Then they and their Company are Waaaay beyond saving Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
08 snake Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 I've gotta say........I've been more entertained today then I've been in a loooooong time If Rich S and company truly believes that a bunch of guys talking about their day to day (that anyone was free to join by the way) Is more damaging to this forum then a bunch of guys screaming at each other and calling names over what their KR is worth or what makes a "real" Shelby Then they and their Company are Waaaay beyond saving i agree 1000% Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mywickedshelby Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 (edited) this is all quite a shame.............too bad loyal customers are being made the scape goat....... Edited September 28, 2015 by mywickedshelby Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheppd01 Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 If Rich S and company truly believes that a bunch of guys talking about their day to day (that anyone was free to join by the way) Is more damaging to this forum then a bunch of guys screaming at each other and calling names over what their KR is worth or what makes a "real" Shelby Agree. The KR prices and you don't own a real Shebly nonsense should be addressed before removing these harmless threads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ilmor Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 I urge everyone to please take a deep breath and read what RichS has written. I would also like to remind everyone of the following: The NTT thread is NOT being taken away, its just being moved to the premium membership area. Except for the one person who has been causing a disturbance on TS for the last month or two the NTT thread results in more reported thread complaints than any other area on TS. Why should SAI spend additional resources on people who do not contribute to the Shelby community but instead disrupt this site. For those that claim this move will cause members to leave TS, you are not taking into account potential members who never joined TS because of what they saw happening here. For example we all saw how the "shout box" was hijacked a week or two ago by certain members acting like 12 year olds. Do you really think any new visitors to TS that week said hey this is the place for me? For those that claim this is a money grab by SAI or that you will never pay for a club membership then how about thinking of it this way. The money you save at SPP by using your TS discount could easily offset your TS membership. There are some other reasons that this change is being made which can not be discussed outside the company but instead of claiming the sky is falling and calling SAI names how about giving it a chance. If SAI has indeed made an error by implementing this change then there's no reason it couldn't be changed back. Let calm heads prevail as it benefits everyone. Case in point, someone made a suggestion of a two tiered membership for folks that don't care about club swag but would like to access premium areas of TS. Now that is constructive and certainly something that I could get behind. Steve Question - if what is being is posted on the non-automotive forums is so bad that it is driving away potential members, then doesn't it therefore follow that once the potential members become members and are then exposed to the terrible things being said on the non-automotive forums that they will still be upset and then not renew their membership? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
car dude Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 Question - if what is being is posted on the non-automotive forums is so bad that it is driving away potential members, then doesn't it therefore follow that once the potential members become members and are then exposed to the terrible things being said on the non-automotive forums that they will still be upset and then not renew their membership? Damm Ilmor your going to give people a headache if you use logic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ilmor Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 Damm Ilmor your going to give people a headache if you use logic Live long and prosper! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ilmor Posted September 28, 2015 Report Share Posted September 28, 2015 Guys, after much consideration and based upon more recent decisions and changes such as these at Team Shelby I have decided to check out other online venues. You will find me either at the Mustang Club of America or the other major Shelby club & forum (which is more east coast event oriented). I'm will be under the same screen name there. Had fun here during the past 8 years but more and more that's been dwindling so I feel that its time to see what's on the other side. Hopefully things will indeed improve as the TS management intends. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
QuadCam Posted September 29, 2015 Report Share Posted September 29, 2015 (edited) The Death Toll rises... There is no finer person than ilmor - truly sad SAI - way to go... I already miss you Bob! Please PM me your email addr Edited September 29, 2015 by QuadCam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
svtkeith Posted September 29, 2015 Report Share Posted September 29, 2015 I've gotta say........I've been more entertained today then I've been in a loooooong time If Rich S and company truly believes that a bunch of guys talking about their day to day (that anyone was free to join by the way) Is more damaging to this forum then a bunch of guys screaming at each other and calling names over what their KR is worth or what makes a "real" Shelby Then they and their Company are Waaaay beyond saving Well said SteveOh!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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