Akos (AJ) Posted January 20, 2012 Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 AJ is one of the five signatures on the GT-H certifcate that you receive from Shelby when you register your GT-H. . For example I didn't know that. Good to know. Thanks Harald! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HARALD KELLEY Posted January 21, 2012 Report Share Posted January 21, 2012 For example I didn't know that. Good to know. Thanks Harald! Can't let you forget. Now we will need to start a similar thread in the GT-H section for you to fill in all the cool blanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akos (AJ) Posted January 21, 2012 Report Share Posted January 21, 2012 Can't let you forget. Now we will need to start a similar thread in the GT-H section for you to fill in all the cool blanks. Start the topic, ask away. Let's see what I can actually answer... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tpow96 Posted January 21, 2012 Report Share Posted January 21, 2012 OK AJ, here is some more... Your explanation of not using the SGT-H hood for the SGT also explains not using the front fascia as well. So that led to the decision with Ford to use the Mustang GT/CS parts through the GT Upfitters Package. My question: was that decision also part of using the GT/CS side scoop rather than the CS6 part? I can imagine it was easier to have Ford do it, or perhaps even mandatory as part of using the GT/CS as a base. Something like, order X number of black & white base GT/CS cars designated for SGT conversions. Personally, I slightly prefer the look minus the side scoop. Until someone ever figures out how to make them functional like 1966. -Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akos (AJ) Posted January 21, 2012 Report Share Posted January 21, 2012 OK AJ, here is some more... Your explanation of not using the SGT-H hood for the SGT also explains not using the front fascia as well. So that led to the decision with Ford to use the Mustang GT/CS parts through the GT Upfitters Package. My question: was that decision also part of using the GT/CS side scoop rather than the CS6 part? I can imagine it was easier to have Ford do it, or perhaps even mandatory as part of using the GT/CS as a base. Something like, order X number of black & white base GT/CS cars designated for SGT conversions. Personally, I slightly prefer the look minus the side scoop like the SGT-H. Until someone ever figures out how to make them functional like 1966. -Tom Since the SGT was a pre-title vehicle, it made the most sense to use as many off-the-shelf parts from Ford as possible. From a serviceability standpoint mainly. AJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
07SGT Posted January 22, 2012 Report Share Posted January 22, 2012 why was the GT-H allowed to be produced with the deep draw hood, and not require front end testing, but the SGT would have required testing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akos (AJ) Posted January 22, 2012 Report Share Posted January 22, 2012 why was the GT-H allowed to be produced with the deep draw hood, and not require front end testing, but the SGT would have required testing? The GT-H was a so called post-title car. Hertz bought the cars from Ford and then sent them to Shelby for conversion. Same thing as taking a GT500 and get the SuperSnake conversion on it. The SGT was sold through Ford dealers, therefore all the mods were made to it before the actual sale. Hence it's called a pre-title vehicle. The federal crash rules are different for pre-title cars than for post-title mods, you have to crash test everything safety related that is modified. The hood plays a huge role in passenger safety. When we did the KR, we had to re-crash a certain number of hoods and cars to be able to replace the aluminum hood with the carbon fiber one. AJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MyBlueHeaven Posted January 22, 2012 Report Share Posted January 22, 2012 When we did the KR, we had to re-crash a certain number of hoods and cars to be able to replace the aluminum hood with the carbon fiber one. AJ Ouch, that had to be painful to watch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tpow96 Posted January 22, 2012 Report Share Posted January 22, 2012 AJ, I have a question that has probably been answered before on TS, but I can't find it. Why the difference in HP ratings between the SGT-H (325) and SGT (319)? Who determined each? Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
07SGT Posted January 22, 2012 Report Share Posted January 22, 2012 Excellent question. Is there any difference in the CAI or the tune? If not, do we have 325? or does the SGT-H have 319? Are either correct and do we possibly have more? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akos (AJ) Posted January 22, 2012 Report Share Posted January 22, 2012 AJ, I have a question that has probably been answered before on TS, but I can't find it. Why the difference in HP ratings between the SGT-H (325) and SGT (319)? Who determined each? Tom The SGT had to be certified (pre-title car) hence the 319HP comes from the fed's dyno. The GT-H (post-title car) was dyno-ed at Ford in Michigan and it didn't have to be a certified number. So the truth is somewhere between and around those numbers. And on top of that California cars got a slightly different tune that was a couple HP less than the 49 state tune... Actually your true HP depends on where you live, altitude, humidity etc... all those contribute to how much power you have. If you really want to know how many ponies you have under the hood, just throw it on the dyno... and then let us all know so we can start bench-racing :D AJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruces Posted January 22, 2012 Report Share Posted January 22, 2012 AJ great to see you on here again, you and Amy hepled me alot with the problems on SGT 113 Mar 07 nice info fun to read, what are you up too now?? Again keep up the great info Bruce Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blown Away Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 why was the GT-H allowed to be produced with the deep draw hood, and not require front end testing, but the SGT would have required testing? The GT-H was a so called post-title car. Hertz bought the cars from Ford and then sent them to Shelby for conversion. Same thing as taking a GT500 and get the SuperSnake conversion on it. The SGT was sold through Ford dealers, therefore all the mods were made to it before the actual sale. Hence it's called a pre-title vehicle. The federal crash rules are different for pre-title cars than for post-title mods, you have to crash test everything safety related that is modified. The hood plays a huge role in passenger safety. When we did the KR, we had to re-crash a certain number of hoods and cars to be able to replace the aluminum hood with the carbon fiber one. AJ Thanks for the info AJ. Out of curiosity my SGT came with the GT-H hood from Shelby during the conversion. The dealer told me they ordered it that way and I have copies of the order form from Shelby. Do you have any idea how many were ordered by dealers like that and how it was possible pre-title? Thanks for all your valuable info. Dan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akos (AJ) Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 AJ great to see you on here again, you and Amy hepled me alot with the problems on SGT 113 Mar 07 nice info fun to read, what are you up too now?? Again keep up the great info Bruce Hey Bruce, hope all is well with you and 113... I'm at Fisker right now while still trying to start my own company... I'm learning the #1 rule of entrepreneurship the hard way: it's all about cash-flow... AJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akos (AJ) Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 Thanks for the info AJ. Out of curiosity my SGT came with the GT-H hood from Shelby during the conversion. The dealer told me they ordered it that way and I have copies of the order form from Shelby. Do you have any idea how many were ordered by dealers like that and how it was possible pre-title? Thanks for all your valuable info. Dan I'm not sure how many dealers have done the same, yours might be the only one. They must have ordered the hood separately and sell it on the car as a "dealer installed option". I'm not familiar with the legal implications of doing so before selling the vehicle but that's the same way you get brand new cars with aftermarket wheels or accessories directly from the dealer... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruces Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 Hey Bruce, hope all is well with you and 113... I'm at Fisker right now while still trying to start my own company... I'm learning the #1 rule of entrepreneurship the hard way: it's all about cash-flow... AJ Sounds like you are doing well still own 113 sleeping next to my 87 GLHS and my 69 and 67 GT 350. I like your ride I am currently looking for 06 GTH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2+2 Posted January 23, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 More questions for you A.J. I know you said Amy talked to Carroll several times a day on the phone, but how many times a month would you estimate that Mr.Shelby came to the Plant and shop floor during the 07' and 08' builds? Did the cars already have 3:55 gears when delivered or were they installed at the Shelby plant? Was it the whole rear unit or just a gear swap. Did you get in on any of the discussions about avoiding the gas guzzler tax and was that a hot debate? When and how during the build was the cs number decided for each car, and what step of the build were the dash plaque ect. installed? Was the line set up the same for the run of 08's or did you make any improvements for efficiency Anything done different to the automatics?. Did the two man team install the stripes and do the tune also? Was the tune as simple as a download or did they do a test of any kind per tune?. Thanks again . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IASHELBYGT Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 I'm not sure how many dealers have done the same, yours might be the only one. They must have ordered the hood separately and sell it on the car as a "dealer installed option". I'm not familiar with the legal implications of doing so before selling the vehicle but that's the same way you get brand new cars with aftermarket wheels or accessories directly from the dealer... I actually have one with the Hertz/CS6 hood that was ordered while at Shelby along with the gauge pod cluster, lower grill and driving lights. I remember talking to John Walker about this. I think it was considered a "mod shop" item. I had to provide SAI with a copy of the bill of sale before the add ons were done. My dealer was a good guy and mocked one up. So when my car was dleivered to the dealership it had all the options installed that way. SAI shipped my take off hood to me later. Here is a picture from the day it was delivered. Maybe AJ can tell us what some of the winshield numbers mean? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akos (AJ) Posted January 24, 2012 Report Share Posted January 24, 2012 The 4 digit number written on the windshield is the shipment number. We created a system where the cars were pooled based on their geographical destination. 6 cars went on most enclosed carriers (sometimes 8) so we pooled the cars going into one of our zones into a truckload. Each truckload was numbered and the cars got their truckload number written on their windshield when they arrived to Shelby. Then each build team knew what cars to pull from the lot for conversion. The cars belonging to the same truckload got built almost at the same time, so they can be picked up and delivered to their respective dealers. This is also the reason why after the first 100 or so cars the CSM numbers didn't follow the ordering sequence but actually the build sequence. There were a few exceptions where people wanted a specific CSM #. In short, your car was truckload 2125. "IA" meant "In Assembly". Probably got pulled from the assembly line for some reason and put back on the lot for some time, before completion. Ususally we did that for logistics reasons shuffling cars around to complete truckloads. AJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akos (AJ) Posted January 24, 2012 Report Share Posted January 24, 2012 More questions for you A.J. I know you said Amy talked to Carroll several times a day on the phone, but how many times a month would you estimate that Mr.Shelby came to the Plant and shop floor during the 07' and 08' builds? Did the cars already have 3:55 gears when delivered or were they installed at the Shelby plant? Was it the whole rear unit or just a gear swap. Did you get in on any of the discussions about avoiding the gas guzzler tax and was that a hot debate? When and how during the build was the cs number decided for each car, and what step of the build were the dash plaque ect. installed? Was the line set up the same for the run of 08's or did you make any improvements for efficiency Anything done different to the automatics?. Did the two man team install the stripes and do the tune also? Was the tune as simple as a download or did they do a test of any kind per tune?. Thanks again . . Carroll would show up at random times, depending on his schedule. Sometimes he spent even an entire week with us. The whole rear axle was swapped at Shelby. We had to do it that way for future warranty reasons and also to minimize assembly time. We tried to minimize the gas guzzler tax and I did manage the emissions certification on our side. We had a specific test schedule that determined the emissions and MPG ratings of the vehicles. CSM number was mainly based on build order. Physically when the car came into the main assembly area, the VIN # was scanned with a barcode reader and the CSM # was assigned. We had a printing station right there that would print the monroney label with the CSM and the VIN. The dash plaque and the engine plate with the Monroney were usually installed at the beginning of the build process, when the build team had still clean hands. No changes in the line between '07s and '08s. We were already ultra efficient by that time. No Hurst shifter, obviously for the automatics. And different tune. Tune was downloaded on the assembly line with flash tools that had multiple flashes on them. Striping was done at a different location before build. AJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SGT0225 Posted January 24, 2012 Report Share Posted January 24, 2012 Carroll would show up at random times, depending on his schedule. Sometimes he spent even an entire week with us. The whole rear axle was swapped at Shelby. We had to do it that way for future warranty reasons and also to minimize assembly time. We tried to minimize the gas guzzler tax and I did manage the emissions certification on our side. We had a specific test schedule that determined the emissions and MPG ratings of the vehicles. CSM number was mainly based on build order. Physically when the car came into the main assembly area, the VIN # was scanned with a barcode reader and the CSM # was assigned. We had a printing station right there that would print the monroney label with the CSM and the VIN. The dash plaque and the engine plate with the Monroney were usually installed at the beginning of the build process, when the build team had still clean hands. No changes in the line between '07s and '08s. We were already ultra efficient by that time. No Hurst shifter, obviously for the automatics. And different tune. Tune was downloaded on the assembly line with flash tools that had multiple flashes on them. Striping was done at a different location before build. AJ I heard the terms "Pre-PDI" and "PDI Station" Do you know what that stands for? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2+2 Posted January 24, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 24, 2012 You said the automatics have a different tune. Is it just shift point changes or something more? Do you remember around the time when the SGT was first being introduced and marketed. I seen on television a display they had set-up at the Barrett-Jackson show with two Shelby GT's side by side that were tied down to a dyno or something. It appeared that you could race them head to head, as they had timers set up. One was a manual and one was an automatic.They even showed a couple of celebrities racing each other. Did Shelby set that display up or did Ford? . Do you know what happened to those two hard driven cars? Did the automatic win most of the time? In general did you have much pressure on you to get those many promotional cars built? Thanks again for your time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akos (AJ) Posted January 24, 2012 Report Share Posted January 24, 2012 I heard the terms "Pre-PDI" and "PDI Station" Do you know what that stands for? PDI stands for Pre Delivery Inspection. We did one at Shelby before sending the cars out, and then the dealer did one before delivering the car to the customer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akos (AJ) Posted January 24, 2012 Report Share Posted January 24, 2012 You said the automatics have a different tune. Is it just shift point changes or something more? Do you remember around the time when the SGT was first being introduced and marketed. I seen on television a display they had set-up at the Barrett-Jackson show with two Shelby GT's side by side that were tied down to a dyno or something. It appeared that you could race them head to head, as they had timers set up. One was a manual and one was an automatic.They even showed a couple of celebrities racing each other. Did Shelby set that display up or did Ford? . Do you know what happened to those two hard driven cars? Did the automatic win most of the time? In general did you have much pressure on you to get those many promotional cars built? Thanks again for your time. It was a coordinated marketing effort with the display. Jim Owens was our marketing guru by the time replacing Joe Jacuzzi. He came from Ford and had the whole thing set up ahead of time. The cars were used at Shelby and at Ford for promotional purposes. I honestly don't remember which cars were specifically set up on stage, we had 6 cars total showing at different shows and events. There wasn't special pressure, we were under the gun starting the summer of '06. Setting up the line, getting the cars built, build them right and to get them to the first customers was question of survival for the company. The team put in 110% effort, especially the guys on the assembly line. You should have seen how well they responded to the adversities, the unexpected problems and they came up with a lot of ingenioes solutions that later were incorporated into the processes. And at a certain point, around February-March of '07 all started clicking like clockwork. AJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
07SGT0547 Posted January 24, 2012 Report Share Posted January 24, 2012 Was the rear end swap just for the automatic cars (assuming they came from AAI with the 3.31 gears)... As my FORD window sticker shows the 3.55 gears and limited slip axle included as part of the 54U GT Upfitters Package... Great Info! And glad, finally, that someone from the early days is able to "talk" about how our cars were designed and assembled... THANKS! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akos (AJ) Posted January 24, 2012 Report Share Posted January 24, 2012 Yes, you are correct. Sometimes my memory is choppy... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertlane Posted January 24, 2012 Report Share Posted January 24, 2012 I believe Shelby owns the GT350 and GT500 names, and Ford owns the Cobra name and logo. You are correct on the engine. I don't think that 7700 cars were a stop gap. These cars had a very important role in keeping the doors open at Shelby and letting the company grow to what it is today. Without the GT there wouldn't be Shelby today. So there would be no KR, SuperSnake, GTS, GT350 etc...and probably the GT500 would be an SVT Cobra once again.... Akos - it's so good to see that you are posting here and bringing a lot of history to the forefront for all to enjoy. I remember when both Chris and myself started at Shelby and I communited (somewhat) from Dearborn during the KR build and how exciting of a time that was! ! ! I have some photos of you that I'll have to post up. Correct, Shelby owns the GT350, GT500, KR and SuperSnake trademarks. Ford owns Cobra. Other marks are shared. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akos (AJ) Posted January 25, 2012 Report Share Posted January 25, 2012 Akos - it's so good to see that you are posting here and bringing a lot of history to the forefront for all to enjoy. I remember when both Chris and myself started at Shelby and I communited (somewhat) from Dearborn during the KR build and how exciting of a time that was! ! ! I have some photos of you that I'll have to post up. Correct, Shelby owns the GT350, GT500, KR and SuperSnake trademarks. Ford owns Cobra. Other marks are shared. Robert, Cool, would love to see the pics! I was too busy building cars to take pictures or video. If you could email me the originals, that would be fantastic! Thanks in advance, AJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruces Posted January 25, 2012 Report Share Posted January 25, 2012 I remember when these cars were new Shelby Atuos posted alot of build photos,I printed most or all will look for them in my barn office when weater gets warmer, Motor trend had alot of GTH pictures. I remenber talking with AJ and Amy both were fun to deal with AJ it is so interesting following your comments Bruce Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IASHELBYGT Posted January 25, 2012 Report Share Posted January 25, 2012 PDI stands for Pre Delivery Inspection. We did one at Shelby before sending the cars out, and then the dealer did one before delivering the car to the customer. When I got my car I asked my dealer to save all the paperwork with the car. He found a PDI sheet, basically a checklist that was signed by John Walker, who was Director of sales at the time. It had a footprint on it and was pretty beat up, but a cool item to have, IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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