The Complicated Calculus - Selling Your Car For The GT500

[50 Deep]

After my 4 hours of fun at the GT500 Track tour I was planning to put pen to paper, or finger to keyboard, about the technical aspects of the GT500. After reading a few of the magazine reviews about the car I realized there are others with far more automotive experience that can accomplish that task better. The essential question we are all asking ourselves is will you sell you current Ford to obtain one? Having owned a GT350, GT350R, and Whippled Terminator I want to present to you my thoughts on the matter. These are my angles, and many things are left to consider. Please share your thoughts when you finish reading this, as it may help others.

 

The GT500 is many things. One thing I can confidently say that it wont be, is a disappointment. There is a concert of systems working in harmony to make that car exquisite to drive. Anyone that currently owns a GT350 will have that same special feeling and shit eating grin when you get inside of it. On track the CFTP manages weight, body roll, turn in, grip, throttle application, shifts and everything else without you thinking about it. On the drag strip it makes launching a simple process without you thinking about it. Set a lap record without breaking a sweat then go enjoy a nice charcuterie board in between sessions.... Remember that thought until later...

 

When you think about combat effectiveness, or picking the right tool for the job, the A7 from Tremec makes complete and total sense. With contenders like the Hellcat and ZL1 LE there would be too much margin for error with a manual if your ultimate goal is to demolish everything else currently on the street. Not only to demolish, but to give customers of all skill levels the ability to harness the power on tap no matter what performance situation they enter into. I spoke with a Tremec engineer at the event and quickly mentioned the epitome of manually shifting automatic transmissions, the Porsche PDK. It was made clear that much effort was put into benchmarking against that transmission, and making this one even better. They did it, although experience with the transmission on the street in traffic is an unknown. If anyone here has been in a high horsepower manual car you know with great power, comes great responsibility. Power management out of an apex or off the line is a constant battle, and often costs you time. I did not think the automatic transmission would be rewarding, but it definitely was. The Whippled Terminator I had was an absolute beast, but really took a skilled driver to extract the most from. The car was either roasting the tires or roasting the tires anytime I put that foot to the floor. I do not foresee that being the case here, and that is a benefit for everyone driving it. The A7 is not only a win for the car, but a win for all of us that want to see the GT500 on the top of the food chain.

 

 

HOWEVER, there are many factors about performance car ownership that many never discuss. The ability to fit your kids and wife inside for a trip to cars and coffee. The point of diminishing returns with modifications. Dreading a trip because being caught in traffic will give your left knee atrophy. Tossing the keys to your wife so she can take the car to work and not be in fear of stalling out on the driveway into the office. New enthusiasts that would be too timid to push the car because a stick shift is intimidating. Enthusiasts with a little more mileage on their bodies and cant manage a stick shift anymore. This level of accessibility and versatility makes the GT500 a big win, but will also bring many more buyers into the pool.
 

As I took the 600 mile drive back home from Vegas I didn’t feel as though I was missing anything in my GT350R. Several other vehicles pulled out cameras and the driver of a Dodge truck chased me down to get a closer look. Downshifts with a quick rev match to pass big rigs was satisfying at my core. The looks, rarity, and balance of the GT350R made me happy with the woman I married. Knowing that when GT500 production gets fully underway there will be plenty of them in production and at dealerships. Aside from the CFTP, exclusivity and ADM wont be the name of the game for long.

 

My brief time in the GT500 was amazing. What stuck in my mind the most was my feeling of detachment while on track. That previous thought about exquisite management of all the systems, it also was what made me feel a little disconnected from the whole experience. Kind of like when your wife tells you to lay back and let her do all the work. Undoubtedly fun, but I still want to put in a little work.....sometimes. It’s my only criticism, but its not the GT500’s fault. My brain and testosterone filled need to feel like I am the one controlling the car is what holds me back. That will be the basic question you need to ask yourself before you make the move. Are you ready to fundamentally change your mind about what performance driving is like without a manual. Those that are ready will not be disappointed. Those that are not ready, still wont be disappointed, but you may want to keep 6 gears nearby for that occasional fix.
 

 

This closing statement is not made to knock any other variant of Mustang on the road, or to seem elitist about the GT350R. It just happens to be the top dog Mustang at the moment. Anyone who has switched from the GT350 to the R knows the cars are different, and even modifications to a GT350 wont necessarily get you there without some financial investment. The limited production, factory aero, and magazine reviews make the R a car of obsession and desire. It’s performance is renowned and envied by other car enthusiasts across the board. If you have a GT350R because you enjoy analog driving input from a manual I do not think selling your current car for the GT500 is the best move. The 500 is amazing, but not such a different feeling than what you have. The control and linear power application built into the GT500 because of the A7 still makes it feel similar to what the GT350R does with the manual. Words do not quite describe the satisfaction of when you heel-toe downshift into the apex, but also wont be enough to wash away the feeling of getting passed by a GT500 right after you hit the straightaway. Getting a slightly used base GT500 to mod how you want would be my advice for R owners. Buying both would be ideal if you got it like that, or if you are mentally ready to let the third pedal go.

 

 

If you have a GT350 or other built Mustang though......This GT500 is hella hella fast like VTEC duuu, and you probably wont beat it. Try to build your own and it will likely cost you more with little to be gained in resale. The GT500 is hungry, and equipped with a proper driver and sticky tire it will eat most cars at any event. I can almost guarantee if you best the GT500 in any arena with equal tire compound you probably beat the driver, and not the car. If you did beat the car, chances are you had to give up so much utility in every other arena that the GT500 still wins at being more versatile. Built or bought. Driver skill or the car. Perhaps none of it matters if you are winning. If you own any other variant of performance Mustang short of the R and have the financial ability to afford a GT500, I would be selling my baseball card collection, cancelling the built motor, selling all my spare parts, and calling MSRP dealerships until my fingers bled. First startup and WOT pull will leave you with no regrets.

 

[1 Alibi 2]

Not interested. The 2015 + Mustang body style does nothing for me, so putting all kinds of tech / performance upgrades on it doesn't change the basic issue. From what little I've read, it sounds like a hell of a car, & I'm sure that all that buy one won't be disappointed.............( by the way, good pics & text )

[William Rodgers]

Nice post!!!  I just can’t get over a $80-100K car having that interior, they could’ve at least added stitching on the dash and doors.  Also they need to get over black wheels.

 

I thought about selling my Shelby GT/SC to get one, but in the end I’m getting some mods done instead, new stripes, interior, watts link, brakes, etc.  As much as I love this car I cant confidently say at this price it would be my car of choice.  I’ll enjoy what I have a few more years and see what happens.

[ChicagoChris]

Nice article and pics. Have to agree the $80-$100 sticker is a real deterrent for me. 

I really like my 07SGT for a number of reasons and will not sell it anytime soon.  

[SoCalSGT]

The sticker price is one thing, then don't forget the ADM. Nice car, but it really needs a gear shift, not a dial...just sayin'......

[BIKEBOY]

Nice write up. 😃
As was mentioned above, the new body style does not get my attention either. No matter what wheels or how many huge spoilers and side skirts they can dream up. It’s simply not a Mustang anymore IMO. 
 

That does not for one second take anything away from how much of a beast it will be. Just not for me.  

Nice pics too BTW. 👍
 

Edit- Oh, and I also had a ‘16 plain Jane Track Pack. Had it three years and drove it only 2300 miles. With that car, I had a total of five, and virtually never drove it. Sold it because of. Probably never appreciated it the way it was designed. I didn’t exactly “mall crawl” with it, but I could never get over the tuner look of it and it had to go. 😐

 

Edited November 1, 2019 by BIKEBOY

[Cali_KR]

GREAT write up and pix!

I still want ONE of EACH....lol

[William Rodgers]

Just want to add I MUCH prefer the black top over the stripes, for what ever reason I am not a fan of the stripes on this car.  I can not stand stripes that do not wrap around the ends that might be part of it, the little gap between the sticker and end of the hood looks awful.  

 

Orange with black Top looks Fantastic!!!

 

[Mongoose]

22 hours ago, SoCalSGT said:

The sticker price is one thing, then don't forget the ADM. Nice car, but it really needs a gear shift, not a dial...just sayin'......

+1

[sheppd01]

There is no chance I would trade in my KR for anything including the new GT500.  
I have never liked the front of these cars however I do own a 2017. 
Black wheels are boring but I could live with them if they are carbon fiber. 
There are way cooler and more practical cars at that price range.  

With that said I like the automatic and the HP numbers and there is a 95% chance I will buy one when the ADMs go away.  😬

[Mongoose]

“Kudos” go to 50 Deep for a great article and excellent pics on the 2020 GT500.  The GT500 sounds like one hell of a car, especially for all those guys that would love to track it.   Personally, I not a fan of black wheels, but I will say they look tough on that Orange one and it gives it some accent.  I love the style of my 08 Shelby GT, but I also really like the style of this new 2020 GT500 because it looks aggressive,tough,and also sleek and streamlined.  I understand the large openings in and around the grille are needed for the huge amount of air for cooling that high-horse engine, so it will take a little time to get used to that look.  The car is definitally a winner and a real power-horse, but I really feel after you add some of the performance options, and painted stripes, etc. it’s getting towards around $100K.  Then you have to add on those ADMs the Dealers are charging and now your in a different category of performance cars that are being offered, just saying.   I know from everything that was said about this new tranny that it’s the best and fastest shifting out there, but me, personally would still prefer a manual as long as my legs will hold out.  I just get more enjoyment from a manual, and I really don’t care about being the fastest, just want to keep the smile on my face when I’m pulling some gears, it’s really just that simple.   J.M.O.

 

[Helge Ruchelski]

That was a fantastic write up on an incredible car.

This makes me want one even more!

[Hawkeye O'Saben]

On 11/2/2019 at 11:45 AM, carnut12 said:

Orange with black Top looks Fantastic!!!

 

Would look even better with a Navy Blue top.  Da BEARS!!

[mach 1 1970]

Had a 09 KR. Recently sold my 350R. Picked up my 2020 GT500 and don’t miss it . . The nobody home under 3600 rpm I surely don’t miss on the street. But as a track car it’s amazing for sure.. The power and the outstanding DCT trans makes the GT500 the best performance Ford I’ve owned. That includes the 05 Ford GT I owned back in 2009 . So after calling over 100’s of dealerships over the past 4 months I finally found a base model for MSRP.  Got it 7/11 and it’s really beyond my wildest dreams. Past GT 500’s are so crude compared to this new one. Maybe the next one will have AWD to bring the Shelby to its peak performance in the future. For now I’ll enjoy the hard work that Ford Performance put in this car. I also enjoyed your pictures Especially the Rapid Red. Yep that’s the color I have without stripes. 

Edited July 15, 2020 by mach 1 1970

[Mongoose]

1 hour ago, mach 1 1970 said:

Had a 09 KR. Recently sold my 350R. Picked up my 2020 GT500 and don’t miss it one bit. The nobody home under 3600 rpm I surely don’t miss. The power and the outstanding DCT trans makes this the best performance Ford I’ve owned. That includes the 05 Ford GT I owned back in 2009 . So after calling over 100’s of dealerships over the past 4 months I finally found a base model for MSRP. Yep $76K . Got it 7/11 and it’s really beyond my wildest dreams. Past GT 500’s are so crude compared to this new one. Maybe the next one will have AWD to bring the Shelby to its peak performance in the future. For now I’ll enjoy the hard work that Ford Performance put in this car. I also enjoyed your pictures Especially the Rapid Red. Yep that’s the color I have without stripes. 

Your 2020 GT500 really pops in “Rapid Red” and for sure is one hell of car, there’s no doubting that.  Ford really did it’s homework on this one and really didn’t leave anything out, but for me and some others it would of been totally awesome to have the option of a manual for those of us who want to “Roll” that way.    The option of a manual shifter would of just increased our absolute fun factor, and in my book that’s more important to some of us die-hards then strictly being the fastest.  I want to drive a car with the 3rd pedal for as long as I’m able to do it to my satisfaction, just saying!     Hey mach, congrats on your purchase and finding your new “Big Boy’s Toy”  at a very good price and none of those damn ADMS.     

[50 Deep]

3 hours ago, mach 1 1970 said:

Had a 09 KR. Recently sold my 350R. Picked up my 2020 GT500 and don’t miss it one bit. The nobody home under 3600 rpm I surely don’t miss. The power and the outstanding DCT trans makes this the best performance Ford I’ve owned. That includes the 05 Ford GT I owned back in 2009 . So after calling over 100’s of dealerships over the past 4 months I finally found a base model for MSRP. Yep $76K . Got it 7/11 and it’s really beyond my wildest dreams. Past GT 500’s are so crude compared to this new one. Maybe the next one will have AWD to bring the Shelby to its peak performance in the future. For now I’ll enjoy the hard work that Ford Performance put in this car. I also enjoyed your pictures Especially the Rapid Red. Yep that’s the color I have without stripes. 

Congratulations on the car brother. These were pretty hard to find, but glad to see you scored one. Should you ever decide to have a set of wheels built for it I have some enticements for you. 🙂

https://photos.app.goo.gl/qBHDLwf5bI6kFYRK2

Cheers!

[John Canfield]

I hadn't rad the original post when it first went up, but having driven a 500 myself it all rings true. But, what stood out for me was the statements about the the 350R. Having some seat time on one of those as well, I'll still say that the 350R is proably the best balanced and fun car I've ever driven, but the 500 in a completely different experience. In a good way.

[mach 1 1970]

15 hours ago, Mongoose said:

Your 2020 GT500 really pops in “Rapid Red” and for sure is one hell of car, there’s no doubting that.  Ford really did it’s homework on this one and really didn’t leave anything out, but for me and some others it would of been totally awesome to have the option of a manual for those of us who want to “Roll” that way.    The option of a manual shifter would of just increased our absolute fun factor, and in my book that’s more important to some of us die-hards then strictly being the fastest.  I want to drive a car with the 3rd pedal for as long as I’m able to do it to my satisfaction, just saying!     Hey mach, congrats on your purchase and finding your new “Big Boy’s Toy”  at a very good price and none of those damn ADMS.     

Yeah Mongoose if Ford offered  a stick I might have looked for one. But maybe in the future they might. I certainly see your point and I’m sure others do also. But for now it’s one of the best auto trans I’ve ever driven. Much quicker then the ZF in the jaguar F Type R . Not sure about the Porsche trans because I’ve never owned one. You got to drive this car the way it’s set up. I’m not dissing the 350R at all ...but on the street the low end grunt is something you have to get used to. On the track it’s a big success and that’s where it shines the most. It was a very hard decision to sell the 350R for the GT500. But it’s the best of both worlds the race track , drag strip and street. That’s what Ford wanted and they got it big time.

Edited July 15, 2020 by mach 1 1970

[mach 1 1970]

1 hour ago, falcongtho3 said:

I hadn't rad the original post when it first went up, but having driven a 500 myself it all rings true. But, what stood out for me was the statements about the the 350R. Having some seat time on one of those as well, I'll still say that the 350R is proably the best balanced and fun car I've ever driven, but the 500 in a completely different experience. In a good way.

I haven’t driven the GT500 carbon track pack ($18K option ) but according to some professional race drivers it’s right up there with the 350R. As a matter of fact I’m surprised Ford didn’t label it a R model. It’s the same set up but with 235hp more kick in the pants. I also like the exposed clear coat carbon fiber wheels. 

Edited July 15, 2020 by mach 1 1970

[mach 1 1970]

16 hours ago, 50 Deep said:

Congratulations on the car brother. These were pretty hard to find, but glad to see you scored one. Should you ever decide to have a set of wheels built for it I have some enticements for you. 🙂

https://photos.app.goo.gl/qBHDLwf5bI6kFYRK2

Cheers!

Thanks and please read the PM I sent you about your GT500. 

[Mongoose]

8 hours ago, falcongtho3 said:

I hadn't rad the original post when it first went up, but having driven a 500 myself it all rings true. But, what stood out for me was the statements about the the 350R. Having some seat time on one of those as well, I'll still say that the 350R is proably the best balanced and fun car I've ever driven, but the 500 in a completely different experience. In a good way.

Hey Falcon, that’s cool too!   That’s what “opinions” are for to voice your’s!

[mach 1 1970]

On 11/1/2019 at 5:09 PM, BIKEBOY said:

Nice write up. 😃
As was mentioned above, the new body style does not get my attention either. No matter what wheels or how many huge spoilers and side skirts they can dream up. It’s simply not a Mustang anymore IMO. 
 

That does not for one second take anything away from how much of a beast it will be. Just not for me.  

Nice pics too BTW. 👍
 

Edit- Oh, and I also had a ‘16 plain Jane Track Pack. Had it three years and drove it only 2300 miles. With that car, I had a total of five, and virtually never drove it. Sold it because of. Probably never appreciated it the way it was designed. I didn’t exactly “mall crawl” with it, but I could never get over the tuner look of it and it had to go. 😐

 

As they say if you can’t say anything nice about a Ford Mustang just don’t say anything . I also don’t think Ford Performance dreams these parts up. They are there for a purpose. Many hours on the track and wind tunnel. These are not tuner cars. That spoiler is right off a Mustang GT4 and is proven on the race track. If you aren’t going to track it then buy the base and no large spoiler. Problem solved. You even get a oil catch can for heavy track use. How many manufacturers provide that item ? 

Edited July 16, 2020 by mach 1 1970

[Mongoose]

7 hours ago, mach 1 1970 said:

As they say if you can’t say anything nice about a Ford Mustang just don’t say anything . I also don’t think Ford Performance dreams these parts up. They are there for a purpose. Many hours on the track and wind tunnel. These are not turner cars. That spoiler is right off a Mustang GT4 and is proven on the race track. If you aren’t going to track it then buy the base and no large spoiler. Problem solved .

Basically there’s a Mustang for every occasion and a Ford Spoiler made to fit that exact car.  From tracking it , draging it , or all-out  street carving and racing there’s a spoiler made for you.   Thanks for providing a very nice display of the available spoilers.   

[shelbycrz]

Keep trying to find a dealer to sell me one at MSRP no luck!

looking at one of the Shelby GT S now

any thoughts?

[shelbycrz]

Or anyone know a dealer that will sell at MSRP?

[mhr1961]

10 hours ago, shelbycrz said:

Keep trying to find a dealer to sell me one at MSRP no luck!

looking at one of the Shelby GT S now

any thoughts?

The really isn’t some complicated  "calculus" to Buying a new Shelby GT 500. There are plenty currently available and plenty being sold without ADM’s. I just checked a couple of websites yesterday and there  are 126 available within 500 miles of Dallas, TX. 4 of them were even available at $3000 below MSRP.  Several dozen were available at MSRP and the remainder had an ADM of $2k to $20k. The ADM is of course is wishful thinking in today’s market. It is a buyers’ market right now. They are not that rare and Ford is cranking them out daily now. The only ones not so readily  available are certain models that have the CFTP options because some parts are delayed due to the corona virus.. . Do some internet searches on CarGurus, Autotrader, True Car, and Ford.com to search dealer inventory and then make some calls or send some email inquiries. . Or try an auto broker, give them your requirements, and if you have the money  then you can likely have one dropped off in your driveway within 48 to 72 hours at MSRP or less. Happy Hunting.

 

Edited July 17, 2020 by mhr1961

[mhr1961]

On 7/15/2020 at 8:13 AM, mach 1 1970 said:

I haven’t driven the GT500 carbon track pack ($18K option ) but according to some professional race drivers it’s right up there with the 350R. As a matter of fact I’m surprised Ford didn’t label it a R model. It’s the same set up but with 235hp more kick in the pants. I also like the exposed clear coat carbon fiber wheels. 

Ford didn’t call it an R model because that would have been stupid from a marketing standpoint. There is no reason to have  2 cars with similar designations within your own brand that would give a customer the perception that they compete against each other. It’s called cannibalization. The GT350 was purpose built to be a track car that is street able. The GT350R was designed to be a serious track weapon and could also be streetable if one chose to do so. The GT500 was designed to be a boulevard cruiser with drag strip capability right out of the box and then they also offered it with a CFTP upgrade for people who wanted to take it to the track.

The GT350 andGT500 do not have the same “set up”. The GT500 has stiffer spring rates. The GT500 has a 16 to 1 steering ratio and the GT350 has  16.5 to 1 steering ratio. The weight distribution on the GT500 is  56/44 as compared to the more balanced GT350 which is 54/46. Those differences right there necessitate a different feedback/control loop and mode settings for the MagneRide suspension as well. The GT500 is about 125 to 150 pounds heavier on the nose due to the supercharger and coolers, therefor you cannot have the same “set up” otherwise the GT500 would “plow” when going in to turns and it also would not efficiently transfer weight to the rear wheels when under hard acceleration. The GT500 also has wider front fenders and a wider front track and wider rear track than the GT350. The GT350 also has a tighter turning radius by about 4 feet.... so, the “set up” isn’t anywhere near the same.

[mach 1 1970]

10 hours ago, shelbycrz said:

Or anyone know a dealer that will sell at MSRP?

Chattanooga tenn has a white 2020 Shelby  GT500 for sale at MSRP. Check it out and good luck. Cars.com is a wild goose chase . Most cars have a ADM and the site doesn’t list those mark ups. Email dealers all day long and the reply’s will be ADM and the car isn’t here yet. Dealers are only getting one or two at the most.The reviews of these cars is simply amazing. Check out some YouTube especially Randy Pobst and Andy Pilgrim track reviews on both trim levels. 

Edited July 17, 2020 by mach 1 1970

[svttim]

Drove the car last week. Its is extreemly fast and unlike others her, I like the looks. But driving it on track left me a bit empty. You sit in the seat and steer. I just felt somewhat unattached. I wil not replace the R with a 500. Maybe someday as a daily but I love the balance of the R on track and the third pedal even though the shifting in the GT500 is much quicker

[mach 1 1970]

Sure is nice having a ignore list on TS . Mr know it all claims he can buy GT500’s at below msrp all day long. If anyone has been truly looking to buy it’s not the case.