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STRUT TOWER


1sgt

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I wonder why Ford Racing offered a STB for the 2013/14 GT500? and then why it is already discontinued??

 

They didn't offer it for a '13-'14 that I know of.

 

They initially offered it for a 2010 and it was included in the FR-3 Handling Pack (which is where I got mine). Then when the '11 came out it wasn't offered for the '11 FR-3 HP because FoMoCo said the '11+ didn't need them due to the ridged front clip they incorporated. And that continues into '12, '13 & '14.

 

Now they don't offer it for a 2010. My personal belief is because it's a single year model and there's just not enough demand for them to spend the money on mfg.

 

 

Phill

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^^^^Phill - Remember this? You have been around the Super Snake world for a while.............

 

 

 

Yeah, I do remember it. Wasn't that the one submitted by "Chicane", or whatever the guys name is that was murdered?

 

I think there was another one they declined too. I'm no mechanical engineer but I could tell it would flex under load (the curved tube is NOWHERE near as strong as a straight tube).

 

 

Phill

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Question: Besides looking pretty cool, does the STB really do anything on the later Mustangs? I've been talking to a couple suspension people about ways to stiffen up the car and the general consensus seems to be that they will be happy to sell you a STB but the part doesn't do anything.

I have seen pictures of a strut bar on a 2007 GT500 after a weekend of track driving and you could see where the bar was discolored from flexing. So I would say they do something.

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They didn't offer it for a '13-'14 that I know of.

 

They initially offered it for a 2010 and it was included in the FR-3 Handling Pack (which is where I got mine). Then when the '11 came out it wasn't offered for the '11 FR-3 HP because FoMoCo said the '11+ didn't need them due to the ridged front clip they incorporated. And that continues into '12, '13 & '14.

 

Now they don't offer it for a 2010. My personal belief is because it's a single year model and there's just not enough demand for them to spend the money on mfg.

 

 

Phill

 

 

This is the one I was refering to..........

 

http://www.fordracingpartsdirect.com/2010_2014_SHELBY_GT500_MUSTANG_STRUT_TOWER_BRACE_p/m-20201-msvtc.htm

 

 

 

R

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Yeah, I do remember it. Wasn't that the one submitted by "Chicane", or whatever the guys name is that was murdered?

 

I think there was another one they declined too. I'm no mechanical engineer but I could tell it would flex under load (the curved tube is NOWHERE near as strong as a straight tube).

 

 

Phill

 

 

Yes, Chicane. I didn't know about a murder.

 

 

R

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Yes, Chicane. I didn't know about a murder.

 

 

R

 

Yeah, it was sad, Joe Gosinski was his name, a great guy. I don't know if they ever got the guy('s) that did it. I spoke with him for hours about this very STB among other things, he treated me as if I was his only customer in the world. A great loss for sure.

 

I picked up one of these STB's a while ago, gorgeous piece......

 

Mine doesn't clear the KB intake bellows and am worried about eventially rubbing a hole in it w/o spacing.

 

Do you still have your's or was your car the test mule?

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Yeah, it was sad, Joe Gosinski was his name, a great guy. I don't know if they ever got the guy('s) that did it. I spoke with him for hours about this very STB among other things, he treated me as if I was his only customer in the world. A great loss for sure.

 

I picked up one of these STB's a while ago, gorgeous piece......

 

Mine doesn't clear the KB intake bellows and am worried about eventially rubbing a hole in it w/o spacing.

 

Do you still have your's or was your car the test mule?

 

 

That is not my car, I just grabbed the pictures for my picture archive for future Super Snake discussion.

 

I had one of the original STB's as shown in my picture above, the flat version, one Satin Black and one Polished. I had them engraved locally and started posting pictures on the TS Super Snake forum, next thing I knew Shelby had signed onto that STB manuf. and had the same engraving as mine?? Then gussets were added to the production version in the bottom areas where there are bends, so I spent more $$$ and bought a "correct" one from Shelby and that is what I have installed and pictured.

 

 

 

R

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That is not my car, I just grabbed the pictures for my picture archive for future Super Snake discussion.

 

I had one of the original STB's as shown in my picture above, the flat version, one Satin Black and one Polished. I had them engraved locally and started posting pictures on the TS Super Snake forum, next thing I knew Shelby had signed onto that STB manuf. and had the same engraving as mine?? Then gussets were added to the production version in the bottom areas where there are bends, so I spent more $$$ and bought a "correct" one from Shelby and that is what I have installed and pictured.

R

 

That was going to be my next of the above questions.

 

I believe the "flat stock" one they went with was manufatures by a T/S member (but I forget who). It actually looks pretty impressive with the polished KB. The reason I pick-up the carbon fiber Chicane STB was because I wanted to bring in a little C/F to the engine bay to match the rockers/splitter, etc and that Chicane piece is a work of art. Hope I'll be able to use it!

 

 

I'm guessing you aren't getting any royalties for being kind enough to "suggest" the engraving style huh? Lol.

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Yep, that's the 2010 version I wrote of.

 

Ford Racing Performance Products (FRPP) never listed it for 10-12 (or '13-'14), just for the 2010. The 2010-2014 listing is all Ford Racing Parts Direct (aka Autocars Speedshop Direct) who is not Ford Racing.

 

They *fit* GT500's up through 12 but am not sure if they fit the 5.8L w/TVS. I know they fit the 5.4L w/Whipple 2.9L though. But according to Ford Motor Company (FoMoCo), they're not *needed* on '11+up (but apparently are on 2010 and earlier).

 

 

Phill

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That was going to be my next of the above questions.

 

I believe the "flat stock" one they went with was manufatures by a T/S member (but I forget who). It actually looks pretty impressive with the polished KB. The reason I pick-up the carbon fiber Chicane STB was because I wanted to bring in a little C/F to the engine bay to match the rockers/splitter, etc and that Chicane piece is a work of art. Hope I'll be able to use it!

 

 

I'm guessing you aren't getting any royalties for being kind enough to "suggest" the engraving style huh? Lol.

 

No royalties.............

 

Yes, it was a Super Snake owner on the 2007-2012 forum who designed and presented his sample(s) to Shelby and is/was building the flat STB. Some owners have chosen the version without engraving and painted the STB body color with the Super Snake stripes to carry the theme into the engine compartment, pretty cool.........

 

 

R

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No royalties.............

 

Yes, it was a Super Snake owner on the 2007-2012 forum who designed and presented his sample(s) to Shelby and is/was building the flat STB. Some owners have chosen the version without engraving and painted the STB body color with the Super Snake stripes to carry the theme into the engine compartment, pretty cool.........

 

 

R

 

It's still available isn't it (the flat STB I mean)?

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That's OK if not needed but it would look good. I do like the SHELBY one . One less MOD :banghead:

 

Since the 2013 Boss LS comes with a STB from the factory I would guess that if a later Mustang platform is pressed into corners, Ford/Ford Racing tests indicated that a STB was needed for maximum rigidity. When comparing the weight of a delete Boss LS and a GT500, the 500 is going to press/stress harder with it's extra pounds when forced into a turn. I would think that a STB would not be "needed", but it sure would help when handling is toward the top of an owners list of priorities. If it fits or could be made to fit without major mods, this certainly wouldn't hurt performance.

 

Of course the upper engine area is different between the Boss LS and the GT500. It is pretty cool that the Boss LS upper is notched for the factory STB...........

 

2013-ford-mustang-boss-302-laguna-seca-5

 

 

 

R

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Do we have a picture of one ??

 

 

If you are asking about the STB that Shelby offered, it is shown in the picture I added on the first page of this thread, the STB with "Super Snake" engraved on the area above the KB.

 

Here is another view of it................

 

This is a "Before" and "After" with billet caps added on the strut tower fasteners to clean the engine compartment up a little bit.

 

Before.............

 

00211_zps11092e64.jpg

 

After.............

 

0113_zps34253730.jpg

 

 

^^^I know the strut tower caps shown above are "bling" only, but even the addition of them requires some research, many caps are too tall and will hit the bottom of the Super Snake hood, some do not have enough thread to also include the use and thickness of a STB, etc. etc. <<<and most of all, I was not interested in grinding on the Eibach strut stud in the middle to shorten it for most billet strut tower cap sets..................It took some engineering and research to get that bling on those strut tower fasteners. it just looks more clean when the hood is open at a car show, that is all.

 

 

 

 

R

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Since the 2013 Boss LS comes with a STB from the factory I would guess that if a later Mustang platform is pressed into corners, Ford/Ford Racing tests indicated that a STB was needed for maximum rigidity. When comparing the weight of a delete Boss LS and a GT500, the 500 is going to press/stress harder with it's extra pounds when forced into a turn. R

 

Ya know, that's a REAL good point.

 

On the one hand, Ford is telling us the 2011+ GT500 doesn't need a STB and at the same time, they put a STB on a *lighter* Boss LS.

 

They speaketh out of both sides of their face!

 

 

Phill

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That looks great so yes or no ???? One hand they say yes on the other hand say no ?? OK I just called SHELBY and they said that there STRUT TOWER well work on 5.8 stock .

 

 

Ok, so it will clear the oem S/C on the 2013/14, but not the KB 3.6LC on the 5.8? If so, that makes sense.

 

You do not have the upgrade 3.6LC on your 2014 Super Snake, right?

 

The brace that I have installed on my car is listed in the link below. Scroll down to the Super Snake unique parts, it is called/labeled Strut Tower Brace, Engine. It is shown for 2007-2009, but this "may" be the same brace for 2010-up?

 

http://www.shelbystore.com/Shelby-Unique-Parts-s/125.htm

 

Here is a link from Shelby Perf. Parts that shows the options for this bar. In this case they call it a "Engine Strut Bar". Comparing part numbers it is the same one listed in the Super Snake Unique Parts List linked above.

 

http://www.shelbystore.com/product-p/z13-s7sb-20201-a.htm

 

 

 

 

R

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I guess I was looking at it differently.............

 

With the current suspension in place and the car sitting on the ground with the suspension fully loaded (or it could be on a drive-on 4-post lift), if I were to unbolt all attachment points of the k-member and add spacers, I would have no choice but to lift the body to do so. Without any other alteration to anything, the body is going to sit higher the amount of the spacer thickness? At that point I have a choice in lowering the body back to its original level, either add weight to the front so that the existing coil springs compress enough to lower the car back to its original "no spacer level", adjust the length of the strut through an adj. coilover set-up, or buy shorter coil springs to reduce the height by the amount added by the spacer(s).

 

 

Maybe I am looking at this wrong. I know the cradle can drop all the way to the ground, but we have suspension components in play also, which support the body and connect between the two, k-member and body.

 

 

If a person were to lower the cradle/k-member which would also lower the rack and the control LCA inner attachment points, how does that affect the ball joints which are still going to be at the original spindle level and the tie rod ends which are also at the original spindle level?

 

 

This discussion has gotten way away from the STB that was originally asked about..........but this is all related to gaining space for installing a STB over a 3.6LC.

 

 

 

R

You aren't raising the car body similar to a body lift kit on a 4 x 4 pick-up truck, where the spacers are between the body and frame. The pick-up truck suspension is totally located on the frame, where as on these cars it is both located on the K member frame and strut tower of the uni-body of the car. You are spacing the K-member lower, but you are also lowering the lower mounting points of the front suspension closer to the ground. The car will sit at the same exact ride height with or without this modification. The front suspension geometry will change for the worse, by lowering the front roll center. The reason the car will sit at the same exact ride height is the weight of the car doesn't change. If you do this mod, the springs are being asked to support the same amount of weight, so they will not compress or lengthen to change the ride height of the car. The top mounting point of the spring is the strut tower, which is part of the uni-body of the car, it doesn't move in relationship to the K-member when you space the K member lower. The ride height will be determined by the springs you use and how much they will compress for the weight they are carrying. Not the K-members mounting location or the lower pivot points of the suspension.

 

Lowering the K-member is a poor idea and will result in poor suspension geometry that will have to be corrected with a taller ball joint.

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