Tearing it up at Summit Point

[sgt1020]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6BCp-NBhSHY

[roblectric]

Looks like a blast!

[Kevin Patten]

Great video - nice sound track too !

[Helge Ruchelski]

THAT IS AN AWESOME VIDEO!!

[Cobramach1]

Awesome video but I do have some questions:

 

How many cameras did you have on your car?

What was that cable between the passenger and you?

What top speeds were you able to obtain?

 

Looks like a ton of fun but I'm scared to do it. Not because of hurting car but because I might enjoy it too much and won't be able to stop. I had to stop drag racing so I could afford to buy a house! The automotive sports get costly. With drag racing I wanted to go faster and faster. With road racing I'd want the same, but it would be additions of lots of other parts to make the car handle really well. One of these days I'm sure I'll give it a go.

[mywickedshelby]

the wire was the communication connection between the driver (Brandon) and the passenger (Instructor).......so you can talk back and forth and actually hear each over the clatter of racing...

Edited June 18, 2013 by mywickedshelby

[sgt1020]

Awesome video but I do have some questions:

 

How many cameras did you have on your car?

What was that cable between the passenger and you?

What top speeds were you able to obtain?

 

Looks like a ton of fun but I'm scared to do it. Not because of hurting car but because I might enjoy it too much and won't be able to stop. I had to stop drag racing so I could afford to buy a house! The automotive sports get costly. With drag racing I wanted to go faster and faster. With road racing I'd want the same, but it would be additions of lots of other parts to make the car handle really well. One of these days I'm sure I'll give it a go.

 

I had two GoPro's running. One session I had it mounted on the Harness bar for the in car shot, and then ran one on the front windshield and one on the rear window.

 

As Mike mentioned, the cable was a microphone connector so that my instructor and I could communicate easily. I have to say, I really lucked out with my instructor, Bob Miller. He raced professionally for 15 years with his own race team, owns a 997 GT3 Cup Car and really knows his stuff. He raced with some legendary guys such as Derek Bell.

 

On the main straight, I was able to hit 140 before I had to start braking into turn 1.

 

And yes, it is addicting. I'm already completely hooked on it. Heading up to Watkins Glen July 26th-28th for three days of track with PCA. Tony Scalies and Jeff Lacombe will be there. And then again Labor Day weekend. Already went through a brand new set of Hawk HPS brake pads at Summit Point alone. Putting the HP+ pads on the car for the next event.

[mywickedshelby]

have a blast at Watkins Glen........but you better bring long pants....Im thinking the PCA wont allow the shorts!

[sgt1020]

have a blast at Watkins Glen........but you better bring long pants....Im thinking the PCA wont allow the shorts!

 

 

Already have a racing suit on the way

[IASHELBYGT]

Great video! I didn't need the music, I wanted to hear the car more, LOL

[tpow96]

Since this is the SGT forum, I figure I'd add some comments about how our cars did on Wed. in

the dry. There were three SGTs in our run group, with Bob Z's race car taking sessions with

guest drivers. Mixed in we're a bunch of GT500s and a few other higher power cars. After speaking

to Brandon and the others, our experience was similar: we were passing everyone else, but

no one was passing us. In the front long straight portion, they would pull ahead for a while, but as

soon as braking or curves we involved, we'd get on their tails and eventually they would get tired

of that and let us pass. The balance and lighter weight of our cars really makes a difference on

the track, making it easier to push our cars harder despite the 100-200+ HP deficits. What you

see in the video is not just selective cuts, but it was consistent with my memory. You can follow

Brandon's sharper line through the course compared to cars in front of him and note where his

instructor points out the differences.

 

Now, I don't want to get GT500 owners reading this all bent out of shape and start venting that it

is mostly about the drivers not the cars. Because that is precisely my point. We came prepared to

hammer the cars hard on the track because that is exactly what it does so well. So, my fellow SGT

owners, don't be afraid to flog your cars at your nearest track event because it can really strut its

stuff.

 

-Tom

 

 

[tpow96]

And yes, it is addicting. I'm already completely hooked on it. Heading up to Watkins Glen July 26th-28th for three days of track with PCA. Tony Scalies and Jeff Lacombe will be there. And then again Labor Day weekend. Already went through a brand new set of Hawk HPS brake pads at Summit Point alone. Putting the HP+ pads on the car for the next event.

 

 

Yes, definitely HP+ pads. Dusty and noisy, but well worth it at the event.

 

-Tom

 

[AndyGJ]

Nice Video!!

 

Love the comments about the SGT. I had a great time with mine at the track back in January, but with mine being a convertible, I was a little bit more timid with it than I would have been had I had solid sheet metal above my head. I almost bought a GoPro camera to take with me, and now I really regret not having it. (I'm sure Santa will bring one for me next year!)

 

Great job Brandon! Let us know how you do at the Glen.

 

Andy.

[SVT NAJA]

Great video! Thanks for sharing...

[sgt1020]

Since this is the SGT forum, I figure I'd add some comments about how our cars did on Wed. in

the dry. There were three SGTs in our run group, with Bob Z's race car taking sessions with

guest drivers. Mixed in we're a bunch of GT500s and a few other higher power cars. After speaking

to Brandon and the others, our experience was similar: we were passing everyone else, but

no one was passing us. In the front long straight portion, they would pull ahead for a while, but as

soon as braking or curves we involved, we'd get on their tails and eventually they would get tired

of that and let us pass. The balance and lighter weight of our cars really makes a difference on

the track, making it easier to push our cars harder despite the 100-200+ HP deficits. What you

see in the video is not just selective cuts, but it was consistent with my memory. You can follow

Brandon's sharper line through the course compared to cars in front of him and note where his

instructor points out the differences.

 

Now, I don't want to get GT500 owners reading this all bent out of shape and start venting that it

is mostly about the drivers not the cars. Because that is precisely my point. We came prepared to

hammer the cars hard on the track because that is exactly what it does so well. So, my fellow SGT

owners, don't be afraid to flog your cars at your nearest track event because it can really strut its

stuff.

 

-Tom

 

 

This hits the nail on the head Tom!

 

You can see how I was tailing that black 2013 GT500 for a few laps before he finally let me pass. On the straight he'd start to pull away (not as quickly as you'd think). He even told me he was going to let me pass him but he figured he'd try to get away from me in the straight considering he has 660+HP under the hood. But as soon as we started braking into turn 1, I'd be right up behind him again being that I could start braking later than he could. Our cars weigh a good 600 lbs less than the GT500's. I could have passed him a few times but we were not allowed to pass unless the driver gave us the signal to pass them, so I had to patiently wait.

 

Gary Patterson told me the SGT's were always a blast to drive and they usually would be passing GT500's all day long in the corners.

 

Looking forward to Watkins Glen next month! Will be sure to put another video together.

Edited June 19, 2013 by sgt1020

[Kevin Patten]

Sounds like you're ready to gut that SGT , throw in a cage and come play with the big boys come on in - the waters fine.

Edited June 19, 2013 by Albino500

[sgt1020]

Sounds like you're ready to gut that SGT , throw in a cage and come play with the big boys come on in - the waters fine.

 

 

It's very tempting! Just like you and Bob Zinzell did!

 

I'm a little too sentimentally attached to my car to do that , but my father and I are debating getting a used 2012 Boss 302 to track. Eventually we can gut that and throw in a roll cage.

Edited June 19, 2013 by sgt1020

[Kevin Patten]

I understand completely . I have a friend that I raced with in SCCA 10 years ago and he called me and wants me to find another white SGT to build for him . He wants to come out and play. Bob sounds like he's got another on the hook so I have to keep up with putting more WHITE SGTs on the track than BLACK SGTs. As a white SGT owner I know you understand that white is the fastest color !

Edited June 19, 2013 by Albino500

[sgt1020]

I understand completely . I have a friend that I raced with in SCCA 10 years ago and he called me and wants me to find another white SGT to build for him . He wants to come out and play. Bob sounds like he's got another on the hook so I have to keep up with putting more WHITE SGTs on the track than BLACK SGTs. As a white SGT owner I know you understand that white is the fastest color !

 

 

They call it "Performance White" for a reason!

 

My dad is toying with the idea of the Boss. I want to buy another SGT and gut it. And no worries guys, it would be an SGT that had a harder life than most garage queens (higher mileage and some stone chips)

Edited June 19, 2013 by sgt1020

[ViperNC]

Cool video and it is always great to have an experienced instructor in the car showing you the way. Best way to get faster in my opinion. Speaking from the GT500 crowd, its hard to say how much of an advantage/disadvantage the GT500 vs. SGT would have on a track seeing as how there were many drivers of different skill levels driving the different cars and most likely no two cars had the same upgrades to suspension, brakes, etc. Curious if anyone with extensive track experience drove both cars with equal modifications that day and could make some objective conclusions? I'm still getting my car built up to take on the track starting with suspension and driveline, but would consider the day a total failure if I was getting eaten up by cars with 100-200 HP deficit. I do believe it is plausible for an experienced track driver in a highly modified SGT to easily defeat an novice in a stock or close to stock GT500. In fact... more than plausible. That should be expected. Having significant time on the track in many types of cars I can speak from experience that it is not always the guy with the most HP who can turn the fastest laps. In most cases, you have to slow down to go fast. Could be most of the GT500 crowd that day did not have your skill or a car with equal set up.

Edited June 19, 2013 by ViperNC

[2+2]

Since this is the SGT forum, I figure I'd add some comments about how our cars did on Wed. in the dry. There were three SGTs in our run group, with Bob Z's race car taking sessions with guest drivers. Mixed in we're a bunch of GT500s and a few other higher power cars. After speaking to Brandon and the others, our experience was similar: we were passing everyone else, but no one was passing us. In the front long straight portion, they would pull ahead for a while, but as soon as braking or curves we involved, we'd get on their tails and eventually they would get tired of that and let us pass. The balance and lighter weight of our cars really makes a difference on the track, making it easier to push our cars harder despite the 100-200+ HP deficits. What you see in the video is not just selective cuts, but it was consistent with my memory. You can follow Brandon's sharper line through the course compared to cars in front of him and note where his instructor points out the differences. Now, I don't want to get GT500 owners reading this all bent out of shape and start venting that it is mostly about the drivers not the cars. Because that is precisely my point. We came prepared to hammer the cars hard on the track because that is exactly what it does so well. So, my fellow SGT owners, don't be afraid to flog your cars at your nearest track event because it can really strut its stuff. -Tom

 

That is the whole reason Carroll Shelby liked the 289 cu.in. so much. Last fall I watched a SGT run the thrid fastest time up against a bunch of new Boss 302's and GT500's. Very cool to see that little ole 4.6 hang in there. Now the drag races were a different story..

 

A question for you after saying to not be afraid to run our STG's hard. How hard do you think it is on the engine. Will the stock 4.6 hold up? I was able to do a spirted pace lap with mine and was able to really push it on a straight , and had to wonder how long and much it could take . I think I will autocross mine first.

[Cobramach1]

Thanks for the answers to the questions. I'm a GT500 owner but it was really cool to see your Shelby GT flying by all the GT500's. They are a well balanced car. I've driven my friend's '11 5.0 GT and I would bet money that his car could be driven faster on track than my GT500 even though there's a 100hp difference. I might get my car on the track this year yet and like you am thinking about a Boss 302 at some point. After driving the GT I just think the Boss 302 would be the ultimate track car from a factory offering standpoint and likely the best starting platform one could buy at this time. The upcoming GT350 in the new stang may be the next best thing though too. We'll see. Keep having fun and thanks for posting the video for all to enjoy.

[sgt1020]

That is the whole reason Carroll Shelby liked the 289 cu.in. so much. Last fall I watched a SGT run the thrid fastest time up against a bunch of new Boss 302's and GT500's. Very cool to see that little ole 4.6 hang in there. Now the drag races were a different story..

 

A question for you after saying to not be afraid to run our STG's hard. How hard do you think it is on the engine. Will the stock 4.6 hold up? I was able to do a spirted pace lap with mine and was able to really push it on a straight , and had to wonder how long and much it could take . I think I will autocross mine first.

 

 

The stock 4.6 will hold up perfectly fine. These cars were built tough knowing many owners would track them. As long as you're not pushing 500+rwhp on a stock bottom end, you're fine. My car put down 375rwhp (440ish at the crank) and has a red line of 7,250rpm. I don't take the car anywhere near the 7K mark as 1. The car makes it's peak power from 4K-5.8K and 2. I do not have forged internals. Pushing the car hard all day at the track with the power I have and taking it to 7K in every gear, I'm bound to throw a rod or blow through my bottom end.

 

As Carroll said, it's not a flower and any high performance driving is putting the car through immense pressure, heat and stress. Nothing lasts forever and eventually things will need to be replaced or repaired, but at the end of the day, as long as you know how to drive the car properly, it will run fine. Just make sure you're running 5w-30 weight oil in the car as the 5w-20 weight Ford calls for becomes too viscous under extreme heat when tracking the car. It's like lubricating the motor with water. I run Amsoil Signature Series. Also make sure you're running racing brake fluid DOT4, ATE Super Blue is good stuff.

 

Another word of advice: My buddy blew his transmission at Watkins Glen last year. With the elevation change at the track, the fluid in the tranny was swashing around and not providing enough lubrication, hence it overheated and blew up. Stock, our cars hold 3 quarts of tranny fluid. They have capacity to hold up to 4 quarts. The guy who rebuilt his trans specializes in Tremec transmissions and said the best stuff on earth for these trannys is GM Syncromesh fluid (Only good thing GM makes I guess :tease: ) and to run 4 quarts of it so that you never starve the tranny for fluid running the car hard. I'm running 4 quarts of the GM Syncromesh fluid.

Edited June 19, 2013 by sgt1020

[ilmor]

I miss that track. Had a lot of good racin times there in "the old days"!

 

 

[mywickedshelby]

great stuff Brandon, have a blast at Watkins Glen.

[sheppd01]

Great video…

 

I was hoping to see my car in there. It was my first time ever on a track and I remember a white SGT catching and passing me once and only once. As soon as I settled down I was lapping people until the car became heat soaked. It freaked me out a little. I thought I had hurt the engine. I was in the middle of passing the black 2014 GT500 during the third race and the instructor said “Ok give it a little gas”. My response was “Its floored” and my heart sank.

I loved it. If I could afford it I would do it every weekend.

Edited June 19, 2013 by sheppd01

[tpow96]

 

 

The stock 4.6 will hold up perfectly fine. These cars were built tough knowing many owners would track them. As long as you're not pushing 500+rwhp on a stock bottom end, you're fine. My car put down 375rwhp (440ish at the crank) and has a red line of 7,250rpm. I don't take the car anywhere near the 7K mark as 1. The car makes it's peak power from 4K-5.8K and 2. I do not have forged internals. Pushing the car hard all day at the track with the power I have and taking it to 7K in every gear, I'm bound to throw a rod or blow through my bottom end.

 

As Carroll said, it's not a flower and any high performance driving is putting the car through immense pressure, heat and stress. Nothing lasts forever and eventually things will need to be replaced or repaired, but at the end of the day, as long as you know how to drive the car properly, it will run fine. Just make sure you're running 5w-30 weight oil in the car as the 5w-20 weight Ford calls for becomes too viscous under extreme heat when tracking the car. It's like lubricating the motor with water. I run Amsoil Signature Series. Also make sure you're running racing brake fluid DOT4, ATE Super Blue is good stuff.

 

Another word of advice: My buddy blew his transmission at Watkins Glen last year. With the elevation change at the track, the fluid in the tranny was swashing around and not providing enough lubrication, hence it overheated and blew up. Stock, our cars hold 3 quarts of tranny fluid. They have capacity to hold up to 4 quarts. The guy who rebuilt his trans specializes in Tremec transmissions and said the best stuff on earth for these trannys is GM Syncromesh fluid (Only good thing GM makes I guess :tease: ) and to run 4 quarts of it so that you never starve the tranny for fluid running the car hard. I'm running 4 quarts of the GM Syncromesh fluid.

 

 

+100

 

There is a reason the Miller Challenge series and the Spec Mustangs classes that are cropping up

are using the NA 4.6L as a base engine. It's tough. Trannys may be another issue, but that is a great

tip about the fluid Brandon. The Tremec 6-speed swap is certainly something I will look at in the

future (plus it comes with a legal scatter shield).

 

Talking to Bob Z. team at Summit Point, they loved what kind of race car you could make out of a

stock 4.6L 3V longblock.

 

-Tom

[ViperNC]

As soon as I settled down I was lapping people until the car became heat soaked. It freaked me out a little. I thought I had hurt the engine. I was in the middle of passing the black 2014 GT500 during the third race and the instructor said “Ok give it a little gas”. My response was “Its floored” and my heart sank.

 

I've been reading up on that heat soak issue. You really have to build up the cooling infrastructure of the car to keep the supercharger cool. The last thing these cars need is more horsepower for track days. They need suspension, brake and cooling upgrades.

[tpow96]

Great video…

 

I was hoping to see my car in there. It was my first time ever on a track and I remember a white SGT catching and passing me once and only once. As soon as I settled down I was lapping people until the car became heat soaked. It freaked me out a little. I thought I had hurt the engine. I was in the middle of passing the black 2014 GT500 during the third race and the instructor said “Ok give it a little gas”. My response was “Its floored” and my heart sank.

I loved it. If I could afford it I would do it every weekend.

 

 

Hey nice win at the show... It's nice to see my vote counted. I'll have to figure out a way to check out all the

other cars I voted on. Best part of your car is that it is an example of race on weekdays, show on weekends.

(It doesn't have to be one or the other guys.)

 

As for GT500s, my previous post was not to put them down. And yes, driving skill is a big factor. Mostly I was trying

to build up those SGT owners who are thinking of bringing their cars to such events. Because as compared to a

drag strip, the track offers opportunities to lessen the HP advantage a GT500 has over the NA SGT if driven

hard, correctly, and with a few choice mods.

 

-Tom

 

[Kevin Patten]

 

Mostly I was trying to build up those SGT owners who are thinking of bringing their cars to such events. Because the track offers opportunities to lessen the HP advantage a GT500 has over the NA SGT if driven hard, correctly, and with a few choice mods.

 

-Tom

 

All good stuff but I can't agree with the 4 quarts of oil in the trans - too much fluid causes more problems than not having enough . The 4.6 -3V is a reliable powerhouse ( though a better oil pan like the SPP 8 quart or an Accusump system is cheap insurance during long sweeping turns ) and the close ratio 6 speed transmission makes for an awesome package in the S197 chassis . JMO