svt13 Posted August 4, 2012 Report Share Posted August 4, 2012 Then you and the other 1 in 100 will kindly stay the hell away from ME on the road, please. Clearly, many aspects of the car are built to a particular price point rather than having the content determine the price. In MOST respects, Ford has managed this complicated series of compromises very well. But ESPECIALLY when it comes to something as critical as braking, I wish Ford had dug deeper - or even raised the sticker accordingly. In the same vein, it's a shame for ANY $70K car to NOT have a premium interior trim option that would've offered no-compromise door panels and so forth. How much do Shelby owners generally spend on aftermarket doodads to improve upon (or at least change) what Ford has done, when Ford could have had all that extra money for its own coffers at a net component cost of less than $200. It's one of the many ways the same old arcane, insular and inbred culture within and unique to Detroit car making continues to prevail. As well as Ford has done to maximize the ROI of virtually every investment it's made, it remains blind to the value upon brand perception eliminating any potential perceived shortcomings (like cheap or inconsistent component quality can have). How much more would it have cost to make GT500 a car that's not just a better performer than ZL1, but indisputably better in every way - down to the seat stitching? As long as Detroit allows these fissures to exist, it will continue to give people excuses to buy elsewhere - like Hyundai, whose phenomenal ascendancy from obscure maker of Korean crap to one of the world's fastest growing and most profitable car makers. It's not because Hyundai's cars are any better or more reliable, it's because Hyundai (and Kia) packs every car with as much value as they can possibly hold. And make no mistake, 9 times in 10, a person would rather buy $12K worth of car for $10 than receive $28K of car after paying $30. There's simply no excuse why at least GT500 doesn't have a well-made all-leather interior. As for the brakes, I do believe the nature of the live axle setup has left Ford out in the cold in terms of what Brembo is willing to support. So, rather than mixing and matching or going with a lesser-known vendor for the fronts that could provide brakes for the rear too (like Baer or Wilwood), Ford either casts the calipers itself or contracts them to a bulk supplier. That's my biggest niggle. I'd LOVE to have Brembos on all 4 corners, but that's just not going to happen. I also don't want to start mixing and matching. So that now leaves me with pretty much the Shelby Extreme brakes if I want equivalent fronts and top-tier rear braking to go with them - a hefty bump of about $6,500.00 to pull-off - even BEFORE installation. Because brakes aren't just a dress-up part that can be popped-in or stuck-on, this is precisely the kind of feature option Ford would've done wonders among its enthusiast base to consider. But even then, a bespoke solution for only 4,000 cars/year is damned expensive. And from an antagonist's perspective, it's just one of the many ways Ford leaves GT500 exposed to potshots by naysayers who then take the ball and run by (falsely) claiming it's only about going fast in a straight line and nothing more. I hate the thought of replacing perfectly terrific 6-piston Brembos up front JUST to get decent brakes in the rear, but it's something I MAY need to prepare myself to do. And if I do, it will be with the Baer Shelby Extremes. I just haven't seen enough unequivocal data about the new Wilwood sets Shelby carries to look upon them without reservation. This guy is 100% correct and I been saying this for at least the last year and been getting shat on for saying it. If the zl1 can have 10x more tech in it and still be like 8k cheaper than the shelby, then either this car should have cost way less, maybe a 2k price increase between model years. Or if they are going to charge this much then improve the interior. Make it different from the v6 and gt. There are so many cheaper brands that have 100x better interior quality. But again this is as he said american auto making trying to squeeze every penny of profit out of us. I too was about to buy the zl1 but I hate the interior of it. Again if ford couldn't have put 4 piston rear then go up to carbon ceramic rotors. I would pay an extra 1000 for those maybe even 2. Plus if they really want to essentially throw the FGT engine in this car then lets have TRUE FORGED MANLEY RODS NOT POWDER FORGED ONES THAT BREAK AFTER 800RWHP!!!!!. I would have paid an extra 500 for those too. There are so many things ford could have done with this car to not only steal sales from possible GM buyers but from every auto maker INCLUDING the after market. We all spend thousands and thousands of dollars making this car what it should have come like from the beginning. Its completely ridiculous how american auto makers operate. This is my first american car and I understand why people who buy nissan, audi, mercedes, bmw, porsche etc look down upon american made cars. The way they paid such attention to detail on the engine is the way they should have done it with the entire car. Eat a little bit of their profit and really produce an outstanding car. Or charge accordingly but still produce an outstanding car. If this car had everything I am planning to put on it from the factory, I gladly would have paid another 5-10 thousand dollars because I know that no after market part will be better than OEM. If you going to sell a 70k car then the quality better follow accordingly. Not quality here and there and then we half ass the rest. Whew I went on a rant there sorry lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
662HP631TQ Posted August 4, 2012 Report Share Posted August 4, 2012 This guy is 100% correct and I been saying this for at least the last year and been getting shat on for saying it. If the zl1 can have 10x more tech in it and still be like 8k cheaper than the shelby, then either this car should have cost way less, maybe a 2k price increase between model years. Or if they are going to charge this much then improve the interior. Make it different from the v6 and gt. There are so many cheaper brands that have 100x better interior quality. But again this is as he said american auto making trying to squeeze every penny of profit out of us. I too was about to buy the zl1 but I hate the interior of it. Again if ford couldn't have put 4 piston rear then go up to carbon ceramic rotors. I would pay an extra 1000 for those maybe even 2. Plus if they really want to essentially throw the FGT engine in this car then lets have TRUE FORGED MANLEY RODS NOT POWDER FORGED ONES THAT BREAK AFTER 800RWHP!!!!!. I would have paid an extra 500 for those too. There are so many things ford could have done with this car to not only steal sales from possible GM buyers but from every auto maker INCLUDING the after market. We all spend thousands and thousands of dollars making this car what it should have come like from the beginning. Its completely ridiculous how american auto makers operate. This is my first american car and I understand why people who buy nissan, audi, mercedes, bmw, porsche etc look down upon american made cars. The way they paid such attention to detail on the engine is the way they should have done it with the entire car. Eat a little bit of their profit and really produce an outstanding car. Or charge accordingly but still produce an outstanding car. If this car had everything I am planning to put on it from the factory, I gladly would have paid another 5-10 thousand dollars because I know that no after market part will be better than OEM. If you going to sell a 70k car then the quality better follow accordingly. Not quality here and there and then we half ass the rest. Whew I went on a rant there sorry lol. I am done with you two and this topic lol ! It is hilarious at this point, a fool and his money are soon parted. You should have bought the ZL1 or a Mustang GT, you would have got more bang for your buck. I understand what you want, but it is silly. Sorry I have to tell you that. If this is how you feel, you had better be tracking the hell out of your car! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
svt13 Posted August 4, 2012 Report Share Posted August 4, 2012 I am done with you two and this topic lol ! It is hilarious at this point, a fool and his money are soon parted. You should have bought the ZL1 or a Mustang GT, you would have got more bang for your buck. I understand what you want, but it is silly. Sorry I have to tell you that. If this is how you feel, you had better be tracking the hell out of your car! Don't you see? The only way to solve this problem is get a GTR because its worth every penny and under 100k lol. Clearly there is no solution under 90k. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Harman Posted August 5, 2012 Report Share Posted August 5, 2012 Just paint the calipers black or have them powder coated and stamp brembo on them! :happy feet: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
662HP631TQ Posted August 5, 2012 Report Share Posted August 5, 2012 Don't you see? The only way to solve this problem is get a GTR because its worth every penny and under 100k lol. Clearly there is no solution under 90k. BINGO!!!! Something we agree on... But Sadly NO CONVERTIBLE. And since I have decided to have my mid life crises at 31, I think it just wasn't in the books. I would have LOVED a GT-R, but they don't want to market to guys who want a Convertible and are trying to have their Mid Life crisis a little earlier in life!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
svt13 Posted August 5, 2012 Report Share Posted August 5, 2012 BINGO!!!! Something we agree on... But Sadly NO CONVERTIBLE. And since I have decided to have my mid life crises at 31, I think it just wasn't in the books. I would have LOVED a GT-R, but they don't want to market to guys who want a Convertible and are trying to have their Mid Life crisis a little earlier in life!! A 10 second stock convertible would be a tad dangerous lol. When I have my mid life crisis I will get one. It will be my next car for sure. I would really like to keep the shelby though and not have to sell it to afford the GTR at that time though. I want to do a lot of engine and suspension mods to it when the warranty runs out. Tune, intake, TB, manley rods, pulley, and perhaps a griggs set up. Or maybe twin turbos with griggs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneTrickPony Posted August 5, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 5, 2012 My apologies if I canme off as rude, it wasn't my intention. I didn't call you a "bitch" I used it as a term, similar to "griping" I'll tell you one thing, I don't support brands. I am not a Ford guy at heart. I own a 2005 Malibu LTZ (Only because I bought it SUPER CHEAP), 1979 Ford F-150 4X4 Long Bed completely restored in mint condition, 2004 Ford Focus SVT (Also aquired SUPER CHEAP) and a 2011 Toyota Highlander Limited 4x4 for the wife and Family. I sold my Dodge Caliber SRT-4 when I was able to buy something nicer and less electrically problematic. I do fine financially if that is what you are asking. If you are asking where my alegiances lie in automobiles, I have none. I can't do that. I buy things that get me excited and the Shelby did just that. It excited me enough to not nitpick it. It just amazes me how the 1% of owners nitpick at. I guess I can understand, but I can't sympathize, my apologies Sir. Apologies accepted. I too am like you you, I buy things that excit me and I'm not brand specific. I not complaining about the performance of the brakes just the looks. I couldn't imagine my new Raptor with Fox triple valved shocks up front and stock Ford up graded shocks in the rear either. I'm just very peticular about the looks as well as the performance of a vehicle, that's all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedWhite&Blown Posted August 6, 2012 Report Share Posted August 6, 2012 This guy is 100% correct and I been saying this for at least the last year and been getting shat on for saying it. If the zl1 can have 10x more tech in it and still be like 8k cheaper than the shelby, then either this car should have cost way less, maybe a 2k price increase between model years. Or if they are going to charge this much then improve the interior. Make it different from the v6 and gt. There are so many cheaper brands that have 100x better interior quality. But again this is as he said american auto making trying to squeeze every penny of profit out of us. I too was about to buy the zl1 but I hate the interior of it. Again if ford couldn't have put 4 piston rear then go up to carbon ceramic rotors. I would pay an extra 1000 for those maybe even 2. Plus if they really want to essentially throw the FGT engine in this car then lets have TRUE FORGED MANLEY RODS NOT POWDER FORGED ONES THAT BREAK AFTER 800RWHP!!!!!. I would have paid an extra 500 for those too. There are so many things ford could have done with this car to not only steal sales from possible GM buyers but from every auto maker INCLUDING the after market. We all spend thousands and thousands of dollars making this car what it should have come like from the beginning. Its completely ridiculous how american auto makers operate. This is my first american car and I understand why people who buy nissan, audi, mercedes, bmw, porsche etc look down upon american made cars. The way they paid such attention to detail on the engine is the way they should have done it with the entire car. Eat a little bit of their profit and really produce an outstanding car. Or charge accordingly but still produce an outstanding car. If this car had everything I am planning to put on it from the factory, I gladly would have paid another 5-10 thousand dollars because I know that no after market part will be better than OEM. If you going to sell a 70k car then the quality better follow accordingly. Not quality here and there and then we half ass the rest. Whew I went on a rant there sorry lol. There is never a stopping point though. I am not interested in paying 5 to 10 thousand more so you (or anyone else) can get the "improvements" on your list. Everybody has a different list. The interior is FAR superior to the ZL1 but some still want more. Some people don't like the "looks" of the brakes, some don't like the grill, some don't like the shifter, and on and on and on. The only real consensus from all of the car mags is that for the money, it is very difficult if not impossible to touch the performance and looks of the car for the money spent. Change what's important to you but don't expect Ford or anybody else to have everything you want or everything that anybody else wants in a package. Buy it and keep it stock or buy it and mod it or don't buy it but it's crazy to think Ford should cater to our lists from the factory - as I said - there would be no stopping point. I think they did just fine and I can't wait till mine gets here!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
svt13 Posted August 6, 2012 Report Share Posted August 6, 2012 There is never a stopping point though. I am not interested in paying 5 to 10 thousand more so you (or anyone else) can get the "improvements" on your list. Everybody has a different list. The interior is FAR superior to the ZL1 but some still want more. Some people don't like the "looks" of the brakes, some don't like the grill, some don't like the shifter, and on and on and on. The only real consensus from all of the car mags is that for the money, it is very difficult if not impossible to touch the performance and looks of the car for the money spent. Change what's important to you but don't expect Ford or anybody else to have everything you want or everything that anybody else wants in a package. Buy it and keep it stock or buy it and mod it or don't buy it but it's crazy to think Ford should cater to our lists from the factory - as I said - there would be no stopping point. I think they did just fine and I can't wait till mine gets here!! This is why me and 662 agree on the GTR being the best lol. Though even with that there is so much I would replace with carbon fiber. Ford could have padded the doors instead of making them hard plastic on the shelby. They could have fixed the shifter since the zl1 and zr1 don't have a bad shifter with the same transmission. Could have improved the rear brakes for looks and did proper internals like on the FGT. 3 setting shocks instead of 2. IRS. Or at least TA/Watts link combo. The grill is fine. It grew on me. Though on stripe delete cars then it makes me gag when I look at it. I don't know. I just wish they put more tech in it if they are going to charge so much for it. I would be happy there. I mean anything else you would have to charge over 100k. Since you can't have luxurious interior, exterior, performance for under 100k. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedWhite&Blown Posted August 6, 2012 Report Share Posted August 6, 2012 This is why me and 662 agree on the GTR being the best lol. Though even with that there is so much I would replace with carbon fiber. Ford could have padded the doors instead of making them hard plastic on the shelby. They could have fixed the shifter since the zl1 and zr1 don't have a bad shifter with the same transmission. Could have improved the rear brakes for looks and did proper internals like on the FGT. 3 setting shocks instead of 2. IRS. Or at least TA/Watts link combo. The grill is fine. It grew on me. Though on stripe delete cars then it makes me gag when I look at it. I don't know. I just wish they put more tech in it if they are going to charge so much for it. I would be happy there. I mean anything else you would have to charge over 100k. Since you can't have luxurious interior, exterior, performance for under 100k. So do you and 662 own GTR's since they're the best? If not, why not?? I mean the internet and forums are made for people to go on threads and comment, good or bad, and there's nothing wrong with that - wear yourself out. I just don't want to have to pay for your list when I buy my car. I do not give a rip about carbon fiber or that the rear calipers don't match the fronts and I like the interior - it's a Mustang - not a Lexus and I for one am very happy Ford spent their money where they did. But, I also don't mean to be the forum police - want all you want and even post on everything it doesn't have. Enjoy the internet! (But even it could be better - and it's free! ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
svt13 Posted August 6, 2012 Report Share Posted August 6, 2012 So do you and 662 own GTR's since they're the best? If not, why not?? I mean the internet and forums are made for people to go on threads and comment, good or bad, and there's nothing wrong with that - wear yourself out. I just don't want to have to pay for your list when I buy my car. I do not give a rip about carbon fiber or that the rear calipers don't match the fronts and I like the interior - it's a Mustang - not a Lexus and I for one am very happy Ford spent their money where they did. But, I also don't mean to be the forum police - want all you want and even post on everything it doesn't have. Enjoy the internet! (But even it could be better - and it's free! ) I know there is no end to it. I wish I owned a GTR lol. I just said its going to be the next car in my last post. I guess I just want the mustang to be more than what it is since it has so much potential. Oh well guess there is no end to the madness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
662HP631TQ Posted August 6, 2012 Report Share Posted August 6, 2012 So do you and 662 own GTR's since they're the best? If not, why not?? I mean the internet and forums are made for people to go on threads and comment, good or bad, and there's nothing wrong with that - wear yourself out. I just don't want to have to pay for your list when I buy my car. I do not give a rip about carbon fiber or that the rear calipers don't match the fronts and I like the interior - it's a Mustang - not a Lexus and I for one am very happy Ford spent their money where they did. But, I also don't mean to be the forum police - want all you want and even post on everything it doesn't have. Enjoy the internet! (But even it could be better - and it's free! ) I made it very clear the reason I don't own a GT-R; they don't offer it in a convertible. It really is that simple. Many can argue all day up and down how convertible is not an ideal track car...Agreed! It is simply what I want. I have a passion for the convertibles. I'd like to have my mid-life crisis early in life so I want my convertible. I have absolutely NO complaints about the 2013 GT500. I love it. They did what they could. It seems easy to throw around numbers and statistics and how easy it would have been to replace this with that. I am no economics guy, but I think those things aren't quite as easy as many may think. Just a thought. Again and back on topic, The brakes are fine. aside from aestheitcs, I think they do their job, although I admit, I haven't tracked my car, so if that is something those that are complaing have done, then there may be some merit to it or if they got in an accident on the street directly correlating to the back brakes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
svt13 Posted August 6, 2012 Report Share Posted August 6, 2012 I drove in some pretty bad rain yesterday. Brakes felt just as good in the wet compared with the dry. The car stopped with confidence. Can't speak for them on a track either though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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