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Do's and Don'ts when approaching a salesman?


chivas1

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WOW, this went from helping to FUSSING!!

 

Calm down folks!

 

The BEST advice I can give (from the dealers side) Find a dealer and salesman you TRUST and support them. Its NOT all about the price! Im not saying go in and lay down. Do your homework! Then find someone that will be there AFTER the sale! Someone you WANT to buy a car from. Im not asking for pity and Im not asking you to buy a car from ME (now if you want to Im OK with it), but I do here it ALL the time from folks that say " I got screwed" or " I didnt know it was a lease". I feel for these folks! Its crazy how many will then leave me after talking so bad about the other dealer, go back to them and BUY another car. Weeks later they are mad again! If you dont like me or dont trust me I would rather you NOT buy from me! At this dealership we have 70% repeat and referral! We would be in trouble if we depended on nothing but NEW customers!

 

MM

 

Very well put! I have said the vary same thing. WHERE you buy your next car is more important that what you pay. Price is important but it's always better to buy from a quality dealer w/ a sales & service staff that you can depend on down the road.

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I just try and talk to the sales person the way I would like to be treated. If he is in "full on sales mode", chances are I will not be buying that day. Simply because we will probably not be able to establish a rapport. And that makes me uncomfortable when spending a lot of moola. I fully expect that his intent is to make a profit and my intent is to get the best possible deal without being a jerk.

 

Find out what other's are paying for similar vehicles.

Find out what you trade in is worth. Sell it private party if possible.

Check out the cost of private financing.

Shop several dealers.

Bring a spare set of keys, in case they "misplace" yours while getting it appraised. It's kinda funny when you pull out the spare set and tell them "No problem, when you find them, have them delivered to my house across town!" :P

 

 

As far as the GT500 being "limited", from the perspective of any dealer quickly getting as many as he "wants", I suppose that is true. My definition of "limited" would be less cars than buyers, and that is clearly not the case. Remember that 2010s are coming out early and will take a while to get out there.

 

If anything "limits" the the 2010 availability, it will be Ford's knowledge that dealers cannot afford to have expensive muscle cars sitting on lots unsold in a recession.

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SO I went tin last nigh to trade the Titan. Now I understand I'm going to take a big hit so I took my checkbook. My wife's icy stare and cold shoulder would have made a bath in ice cubes seem comfortable so I just wouldn;t look her in the eye.

 

At first I was not getting what I was asking on my trade. Surprise! So made the statement either I get what I am asking ($1500 more BTW) and write THEM the large check or I get online right then, pay my truck down to the trade-in value they were offering and put 0 down. They came up $1500.

 

Anyway, I looked at a 2009 FORD F250 CC 4WD gasser. Test drove it and HATED IT.

I found a 2008 F350 CC 4WD Diesel for nearly the exact same price, within $200. LOVED IT and I was sold.

They dropped my trade by $1500 because I went from new to used and would not negotiate. :doh:

I had to walked away but believe me, I did not want to.

 

This happened last night for 4 f'ing hours. It took them 2 hours just to bring the truck up.

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All,

 

I have never had a good experience with dealers. I've always been in areas near military bases and the dealers in those areas don't seem to care about repeat customers. There's too many GI's moving in every year, too many suckers to take advantage of.

 

I always did my research before I went to any dealer and when I offered a reasonable price, I would usually get laughed at or get the runaround. Don't even talk about trade! If they can't get you to buy at the price they want, they will undervalue your trade by finding problems with your vehicle that don't exist! I've been a mechanic for 17 years and I know what a legitimate problem with a vehicle is. I've experimented with trading vehicles in at several dealers and they have always deducted unreasonable amounts from the value of my vehicle for "alleged mechanical problems". I suspect, it's simply because I wasn't willing to pay MSRP for the vehicle I wanted to buy. Trading a vehicle in, isn't worth it. Sell it outright and use it toward your next purchase.

 

I purchased my 08 GT500 a year ago and it's the first time I was willing to pay MSRP (avg selling price at the time was $8K over) for a vehicle but the dealer was asking about $5-6K more than that and didn't seem to want to budge. I initially offered $3K under MSRP and they almost laughed me off the showroom floor. I continued to stop by the dealer every week to show I was still interested and my offer was serious. 5 weeks later, the car was still there and the dealer was finally willing to give up on the ADM. I agreed to pay MSRP and they agreed to sell it for that price. When they drafted the paperwork, they included some BS fees, taxes, and add on items, so I pushed back and was ready to leave. They eventually eliminated those fees (don't know how you dealer guys do that) and I purchased the car...and I love it!

 

To make a short story long...I offer the following advice:

 

- Do your research and know your vehicle's value and current average selling prices

 

- Don't trade in...your vehicle will be worth more if sold to a private party. If you must trade, negotiate the price for the new car first and know the value of your trade

 

- Do not blindly accept the value the dealer places on your trade and challenge any "mechanical problems" they claim while setting the value

 

- Don't feel pressured, be willing to walk out if you can not come to a price you feel is reasonable, it's your money...if the dealer wants a fair share, they will negotiate reasonably.

 

- As mentioned in previous posts, establish financing from an independent source before you buy

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WOW, this went from helping to FUSSING!!

 

Calm down folks!

 

The BEST advice I can give (from the dealers side) Find a dealer and salesman you TRUST and support them.

MM

 

 

True dat, I have been dealing with the same saleman for a few years... I went in and wanted an 09 but they didn't have any and you couldn't order them anymore so I ordered a 10' which was a little over budget... well he found me a new 09 with every option I wanted, brought it in from another province and still sold it to me way under msrp...

 

I almost had to arm wrestle him over the first cleaning... I wanted to do it but he didn't want to give me a dusty car... I won...

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All,

 

I have never had a good experience with dealers. I've always been in areas near military bases and the dealers in those areas don't seem to care about repeat customers. There's too many GI's moving in every year, too many suckers to take advantage of.

 

I always did my research before I went to any dealer and when I offered a reasonable price, I would usually get laughed at or get the runaround. Don't even talk about trade! If they can't get you to buy at the price they want, they will undervalue your trade by finding problems with your vehicle that don't exist! I've been a mechanic for 17 years and I know what a legitimate problem with a vehicle is. I've experimented with trading vehicles in at several dealers and they have always deducted unreasonable amounts from the value of my vehicle for "alleged mechanical problems". I suspect, it's simply because I wasn't willing to pay MSRP for the vehicle I wanted to buy. Trading a vehicle in, isn't worth it. Sell it outright and use it toward your next purchase.

 

I purchased my 08 GT500 a year ago and it's the first time I was willing to pay MSRP (avg selling price at the time was $8K over) for a vehicle but the dealer was asking about $5-6K more than that and didn't seem to want to budge. I initially offered $3K under MSRP and they almost laughed me off the showroom floor. I continued to stop by the dealer every week to show I was still interested and my offer was serious. 5 weeks later, the car was still there and the dealer was finally willing to give up on the ADM. I agreed to pay MSRP and they agreed to sell it for that price. When they drafted the paperwork, they included some BS fees, taxes, and add on items, so I pushed back and was ready to leave. They eventually eliminated those fees (don't know how you dealer guys do that) and I purchased the car...and I love it!

 

To make a short story long...I offer the following advice:

 

- Do your research and know your vehicle's value and current average selling prices

 

- Don't trade in...your vehicle will be worth more if sold to a private party. If you must trade, negotiate the price for the new car first and know the value of your trade

 

- Do not blindly accept the value the dealer places on your trade and challenge any "mechanical problems" they claim while setting the value

 

- Don't feel pressured, be willing to walk out if you can not come to a price you feel is reasonable, it's your money...if the dealer wants a fair share, they will negotiate reasonably.

 

- As mentioned in previous posts, establish financing from an independent source before you buy

 

You make some legit points. Dealers are allowed to charge Documentary fees. Our dealership has NEVER charge any fees except sales tax. Unfortunately, some stores try to make up lost prift that way. Doc fees should never be paid.

Trade-ins are another story. Please keep in mind, most people think their trade is perfect. Most vehicles are in need of hundreds of dollars in reconditioning. However, when you trade in a vehicle, the you are getting a sales tax credit for a percentage of the value. For example, if you are trading in a car in Indiana & the trade-in value is $19,000.00, the actual value is 20330.00 because you are taxed on the difference after the trade in has been deducted from the selling price. So, you have to sell your trade for at least $1330.00 more outright to match the deal you are getting from the dealer.

 

One more thought, Our dealership averages over $1,500.00 per car on reconditioning BEFORE the car goes on the lot. The end retailer always gets more money that if you just take the trade in & tax credit. But there has to be some room for the dealer to recondition & warranty the car for the next buyer. Not to mention the taxes, commissions, advertising, etc.

 

If dealers made what everyone thinks they made selling new & used cars, there wouldn't be over 4,000 stores closing. However, many of your points are exactly right. Do your homework, ask for the figures on the new car & the trade separate & be willing to walk away if the deal isn't right for you. Just make sure you are buying from a quality dealer w/ a great reputation & service department.

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However, when you trade in a vehicle, the you are getting a sales tax credit for a percentage of the value. For example, if you are trading in a car in Indiana & the trade-in value is $19,000.00, the actual value is 20330.00 because you are taxed on the difference after the trade in has been deducted from the selling price. So, you have to sell your trade for at least $1330.00 more outright to match the deal you are getting from the dealer.

 

Not true in California. Nice for the car dealers in your state that payment-in-kind is not taxed but for private sales it is. I'm sure that government subsidy against private individuals is a sign of the good service dealers offer.

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I've been on both sides of the desk too. It was easy for me to buy a new GT500 because the sales manager is one of my best friends, but I still had to pay $5000 over MSRP to buy my car, just like everybody else. That's a hard thing to do for an old car salesman! At the time they were being offered $10,000 over from a dealer 1000 miles away, but they had agreed to sell all of the cars that were being allocated to local buyers for $5000 over so they stuck to their word.

 

I too have seen people mask huge problems with their cars at trade-in time, I've seen people swear up and down that their car is not a salvage vehicle and then when they bring in the title a couple days after they bought their new car, guess what? Branded title. " Oh, I didn't know what that meant" I've seen people sign odometer statements that state the miles are accurate, then you find a sticker under the hood that shows the car was serviced at 10,000 more miles than it had on it when it was traded in to you. We sold a car to a customer that was like that, when they discovered the mileage discrepancy we were the bad guys, not the guy who traded it in to us! Some people trade cars in because they won't sell it to somebody off the street because of a problem it has, but they don't even flinch about dumping it on the "dirtbag car dealer". I know a person who traded a car in with a cracked block, didn't mention a word to the salesman. You know that car was sold to an unsuspecting customer and the dealership became the bad guy. Fortunately those cuistomers are few and far between. Most of the customers I dealt with were great and fun to work with, just as I think most salespeople are above board hard working people. Of all the people I sold cars with there were only a couple I wouldn't recommend, most were great people just trying to make a living.

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I've been on both sides of the desk too. It was easy for me to buy a new GT500 because the sales manager is one of my best friends, but I still had to pay $5000 over MSRP to buy my car, just like everybody else. That's a hard thing to do for an old car salesman! At the time they were being offered $10,000 over from a dealer 1000 miles away, but they had agreed to sell all of the cars that were being allocated to local buyers for $5000 over so they stuck to their word.

 

I too have seen people mask huge problems with their cars at trade-in time, I've seen people swear up and down that their car is not a salvage vehicle and then when they bring in the title a couple days after they bought their new car, guess what? Branded title. " Oh, I didn't know what that meant" I've seen people sign odometer statements that state the miles are accurate, then you find a sticker under the hood that shows the car was serviced at 10,000 more miles than it had on it when it was traded in to you. We sold a car to a customer that was like that, when they discovered the mileage discrepancy we were the bad guys, not the guy who traded it in to us! Some people trade cars in because they won't sell it to somebody off the street because of a problem it has, but they don't even flinch about dumping it on the "dirtbag car dealer". I know a person who traded a car in with a cracked block, didn't mention a word to the salesman. You know that car was sold to an unsuspecting customer and the dealership became the bad guy. Fortunately those cuistomers are few and far between. Most of the customers I dealt with were great and fun to work with, just as I think most salespeople are above board hard working people. Of all the people I sold cars with there were only a couple I wouldn't recommend, most were great people just trying to make a living.

 

How true!

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That made me snicker a little bit.

 

"Limited" is a relative term. The numbers of our cars produced may be more than most of us want, but it is still a "limited" edition, considering the number of other Mustangs produced in each year.

 

The last 5 car purchases I've made, I did my research and knew my limits. I also knew what my vehicle was worth, trade in or sell it myself. I don't try to scalp them or anything, but when I've stated my price and they don't come to it, I get up and walk out. So far, it's worked. Had one call me back and misunderstood my bottom price and wound up $300 to my favor! Last Saturday of the month works best. I've made my best deals the last Saturday of the month 3 out of the 5.

 

What I hate is when the salespeople whine and groan and cry about how bad you beat them and they're not making any money and giving the car away, on and on and on......

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What I hate is when the salespeople whine and groan and cry about how bad you beat them and they're not making any money and giving the car away, on and on and on......

 

And yet the dealer owners in my area are the wealthiest memebers of the community. I think the salespeople bitch about making money should go to their management. The way I see it, is there is plenty of money to be made in owning car dealerships. Salespeople who think elsewise have been brainwashed by who they work for...

 

Multi million dollar homes, race teams, private planes, etc... They definitly make enough money....

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And yet the dealer owners in my area are the wealthiest memebers of the community. I think the salespeople bitch about making money should go to their management. The way I see it, is there is plenty of money to be made in owning car dealerships. Salespeople who think elsewise have been brainwashed by who they work for...

 

Multi million dollar homes, race teams, private planes, etc... They definitly make enough money....

 

 

Most dealers are profitable because of their service & parts departments. The used car departments also help out. It's very well known that most dealers operate at a loss on the new vehicles they sell. salespeople are paid a commission based on the profit over invoice. If they sell the car under invoice, the salesman usually gets anywhere between $50.00-100.00 flat. We sold a $79,000 escalade the other day & when all was said & done, the salesman got $100.00. He worked with this customer via the internet & spent 3 different visits w/ them @ the dealership. The customer got a great deal. However, I'll bet he also thinks the salesman made $5,000.00 himself. :hysterical:

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I have bought a few new Fords and never had a good experience with a Ford dealer :nonono: , If you want a good experience go to a Honda dealer :o (they have the best minivan).

 

 

The reason for the good experience was because of the dealer, not the brand. Same goes w/ a bad experience. I have a friend that owns both GM & Honda dealerships. He laughs about the publics "blind trust" in Hondas. He claims that he has replaced the transmissions in about 80% of all the Odyssey's he has sold. He claims that the cars built by GM today & in the last few years, are built better w/ much fewer problems that Honda. I guess he should know. He owns both stores.

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Most dealers are profitable because of their service & parts departments. The used car departments also help out. It's very well known that most dealers operate at a loss on the new vehicles they sell. salespeople are paid a commission based on the profit over invoice. If they sell the car under invoice, the salesman usually gets anywhere between $50.00-100.00 flat. We sold a $79,000 escalade the other day & when all was said & done, the salesman got $100.00. He worked with this customer via the internet & spent 3 different visits w/ them @ the dealership. The customer got a great deal. However, I'll bet he also thinks the salesman made $5,000.00 himself. :hysterical:

 

I undestand that the "new car business" isn't the big money maker in the dealer. It is however, what primes the pump, so that these cars come back for the very lucrative service you speak of.

 

So...my point is, that the dealerships themselves are very profitable. The overall "dealership machine" is generally making the owners very wealthy. So, if the new car salespeople arn't making enough money, they best figure out how to get a bigger peice of the pie from their employers, and not blame the customers.

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I undestand that the "new car business" isn't the big money maker in the dealer. It is however, what primes the pump, so that these cars come back for the very lucrative service you speak of.

 

So...my point is, that the dealerships themselves are very profitable. The overall "dealership machine" is generally making the owners very wealthy. So, if the new car salespeople arn't making enough money, they best figure out how to get a bigger peice of the pie from their employers, and not blame the customers.

Understood. I am not "blaming" the customer. No one is holding a gun to either sides head. All I am saying is good salesmen usually get thrown into the bad apple pile all too often. We all should walk a mile in the other mans shoes before we judge them.

 

As far as dealers being wealthy, they deserve the profit they generate. Think about this for a second, If you had 10 million dollars what would you do?

A) Build a dealership, employ 100 people, give to local charities & contribute thousands to state, federal & local taxes & hope to keep 2-3% for yourself?

B) Put it into a CD & earn 5% per year w/o the risks or headaches & just sit on the beach.

 

I don't feel sorry for them either. However, I do feel if a man invests in a business and puts people to work, he deserves a fair profit.

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Understood. I am not "blaming" the customer. No one is holding a gun to either sides head. All I am saying is good salesmen usually get thrown into the bad apple pile all too often. We all should walk a mile in the other mans shoes before we judge them.

 

As far as dealers being wealthy, they deserve the profit they generate. Think about this for a second, If you had 10 million dollars what would you do?

A) Build a dealership, employ 100 people, give to local charities & contribute thousands to state, federal & local taxes & hope to keep 2-3% for yourself?

B) Put it into a CD & earn 5% per year w/o the risks or headaches & just sit on the beach.

 

I don't feel sorry for them either. However, I do feel if a man invests in a business and puts people to work, he deserves a fair profit.

 

I agree. I have no issue with a dealer owner making a good living, or even a great living. My latest issue is that my hard earned tax dollars are lookng to be heading to them when GM cancles some of their agreements. These guy's earns 10's of times (maybe even 100's) what I do every year, yet now when the "risk" they took that has paid off over the last 3-4 decades goes bad, they are in line to get a big chunk of my money. When my business goes bad, I end up SOL?

 

I sell for a living, and customers can be very demanding. All I have to do is remember who pays my house payment, pays for my kids activities, paid for the GT500, etc... It is not my employer, but rather my customers. My employer only keeps me around because they make their fair share on each deal, too. If my customers don't keep coming back, my paycheck ends. I get very frustrated at times, but simply remembering that myself and customer arn't some "team" as some people think, but rather I am in the relationship to serve them as they need. When you serve the customer, than they will reward with purchases. This works very well for me, and I suspect other could too. Some salespeople start to overvalue themselves in the customer / salesperson equation, and this is a huge turn-off for many customers.

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