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Interesting story and question about our paint quality?


chuckstang

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Today at work, I was talking with this guy who owns a new BMW 1 series in which it is his toy car that he treats well, you know like how we treat our GT500s.

 

He has about 6,500 miles on his, and noticed that he has a ton of stone chips on his hood, way more than he feels should be there on a vehicle that he takes such good care of and drives so little, especially on the highway. This is not his daily driver.

 

I fit the same story as this guy with my car and I am sure many other Shelby owners as well only have very few miles and some as old as 3 years and are not used as daily commuters with little freeway time.

 

He went to his BMW dealership and just made a complaint saying, he was worried what the front of his car would look like at 30k miles. He brought his Scion with 35k miles which he uses for commuting and brought to show how little stone chips were on the front of this car and how he drives 50 miles a day on the freeway with it commuting to and from work.

 

To make a long story short, the dealership agreed that this was excessive and because the owner did not yell and was polite, they decided to repaint it for free just in case it was a factory defect.

 

 

 

Now, is this just a case of why many don't buy American and buy Foreign?

Or would people like me and others I imagine that have theyre front end covered with chips way more than what appears to be normal have a case try going to there Ford dealership and request the same service?

 

Obviously it can not hurt to ask but does anyone have a nice story like this to share with their car?

 

I find the paint of very cheap quality on these cars. Are the Ford GTs any better?

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Good luck with that! You will be lucky if the Ford dealer doesn't lean on it with a wrench and dent the front fender while looking at the chips!

 

My last Acura had a zillion stone chips way to early in it's life. I think different paints are just very different. Some are softer and scratch, but probably give a little more, while others are rock hard, but I think chip easier.

 

I had a Jeep that, if bird crap was on it for 1/2 day, it would crater into the paint. That thing, along with all of them on the new car lot, all had bird crap damage because of this. I picked the best one at the time. Then added to the damage, because I wasn't going to run up to my wifes work, ispect, wash, and return to work everyday. She would get home in the PM and I'd look it over, and even in one day, etching happened.

 

The Acura had hard paint. No scraches, no bird poop damange, etc... just a gazillion stone chips.

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My dark blue Maxima had a milliion chips in the front in a short time. I would hit them with touch up paint but wax would collect in them and make them stand out. When I switched to Turtle wax icc, things are much better. The chips stay dark and you have to get down close to notice them now.

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Having had experiance painting cars, here's my .02.

 

No two paint finishes are created equal. Humidity, air pressure, barametric pressure, paint dilution, prep and hundreds of other factors have an effect on the paint finish and its durability.

 

A good dealer is a good dealer! Any dealer that wants return and referral business will do what they belive to be the right thing in order to satisfy they're customer.

 

Fortunately for me, I have a Ford dealer that takes good care of me. As far as my Mercedes dealer....don't get me started. :banghead:

Mark

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I agree that our paint is not done with the same quality in mind that gm uses on the z06 or bmw and mercedes uses on their vehicles. I have found three fish eyes in my paint and a bubble in the front facia below the hood. Now the previously mentioned companies go to the extent that when someone is selected to be a painter for these vehicles they have to pass a couple of tests. First they have to touch a piece of test metal which is then put through the same paint process the cars go through but on a smaller scale this is to check the ph levels from the oil on their skin. If the painted piece of metal they touch ends up with a fish eye or uncovered spot through the paint then they cannot be a painter. If they do pass this test then they are asked to use certain hygene products and they are expected to follow a set out diet also because all of these things can effect the ph levels in their body. Now all that being said about our paint Discovery Ford has offered to repaint the car but I think they will only try and repair the spots where the fish eyes and the bubble are and not repaint the whole car!! But in my mind I lose the original paint and therefore diminish the value of my car!

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When I bought this car I did not do the clear bra thing, I just said to myself I would paint the front end at I dont know say 50k miles

 

After not even 10k miles, I find myself wanting to paint it.

 

I personally hate the look of touch up paint and would rather see a chip. I want someone to prove to me that touch up paint can look good and how its done!

 

I have 2 that I want fixed up that are not on the front end which I will undoubtly paint very soon

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Heck, I couldn't get my dealer to do anything when my new 87GT was a year old and the paint was peeling around the drivers side roofline for absolutely no reason. They knew there were paint issues and would just fight any warranty issues. That was the last Ford product I bought up until the 08.

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I agree that our paint is not done with the same quality in mind that gm uses on the z06 or bmw and mercedes uses on their vehicles. I have found three fish eyes in my paint and a bubble in the front facia below the hood. Now the previously mentioned companies go to the extent that when someone is selected to be a painter for these vehicles they have to pass a couple of tests. First they have to touch a piece of test metal which is then put through the same paint process the cars go through but on a smaller scale this is to check the ph levels from the oil on their skin. If the painted piece of metal they touch ends up with a fish eye or uncovered spot through the paint then they cannot be a painter. If they do pass this test then they are asked to use certain hygene products and they are expected to follow a set out diet also because all of these things can effect the ph levels in their body. Now all that being said about our paint Discovery Ford has offered to repaint the car but I think they will only try and repair the spots where the fish eyes and the bubble are and not repaint the whole car!! But in my mind I lose the original paint and therefore diminish the value of my car!

 

It was my impression that most production cars were painted with a computerized spray booth? Could you provide a link/info that some of the manufacturers hand paint their cars. I am in the market for a new BMW and this would be good info to know.

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Heck, I couldn't get my dealer to do anything when my new 87GT was a year old and the paint was peeling around the drivers side roofline for absolutely no reason. They knew there were paint issues and would just fight any warranty issues. That was the last Ford product I bought up until the 08.

 

We can all thank the EPA for those cars. Clearcoat sunburn.

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It was my impression that most production cars were painted with a computerized spray booth? Could you provide a link/info that some of the manufacturers hand paint their cars. I am in the market for a new BMW and this would be good info to know.

I found this info out on the speed channel. For the most part the cars are painted by robots but certain areas have to be painted by people. So if there is a tear in the paint suit or sweat soaks through and happens to touch an area that is to be painted it could contaminate it. I remember watching it on the speed channel one day and they showed how the z06 was built. Then a program to show how the bmw z4m was built. Then various other programs on AMG mercedes, Ferrari. I just remembered for those four manufacturers. I would suggest just going on the BMW site and ask someone, since the only one I can remember painted the cars by hand for sure was Ferrari. Sorry I could'nt be more help I was just facinated about the whole idea of that if you ate certain foods or used certain hygene products that these things in conjuction with each other could do something like that to the paint. To me it was impressive that these manufacturers would go to these lengths to ensure the perfect paint job!!

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Just not ours though

Chuck, I know your pain. I know that this may sound lame and is not intended as an excuse for bad quality products, but some times I forget that our cars started out as a $19,995.00 M.S.R.P. car to compete with the import sport coupe's. Not a $100+K exotic from Italy. :hide:

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Kind of related.

I take my F150 for service at Ford. Free coffee, stale donuts, 45 min wait (old couch) for a courtesy van that takes over an hour to get me home. I have to keep calling to see if my truck is done. I finally get there and they can't seem to find my truck. I finally get the truck and I get "that ding was already there".

 

I take my Cadillac CTS-V for service. Free CTS rental car, free breakfast sandwich and fancy coffee in their very comfortable upscale coffee house. Courtesy call during and immediately after repairs. Car is washed and ready at the front door as I drive in.

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Chuck, I know your pain. I know that this may sound lame and is not intended as an excuse for bad quality products, but some times I forget that our cars started out as a $19,995.00 M.S.R.P. car to compete with the import sport coupe's. Not a $100+K exotic from Italy. :hide:

Sooo true! But our cars little shortcomings is why we love em!!

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It was my impression that most production cars were painted with a computerized spray booth? Could you provide a link/info that some of the manufacturers hand paint their cars. I am in the market for a new BMW and this would be good info to know.

 

Candian Bacon:

 

I visited four BMW factories in Germany recently and they paint their cars totally by the computerized spray machines that look like weird dragons that move around and spray various sections in coordication with each other. Looks like a mechanical ballet! The spray booths are completely inclosed and the only time techs go in is to clean the machines and skirts that go around them. Very impressive and why BMW's paint quality is so nice.

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Kind of related.

I take my F150 for service at Ford. Free coffee, stale donuts, 45 min wait (old couch) for a courtesy van that takes over an hour to get me home. I have to keep calling to see if my truck is done. I finally get there and they can't seem to find my truck. I finally get the truck and I get "that ding was already there".

 

I take my Cadillac CTS-V for service. Free CTS rental car, free breakfast sandwich and fancy coffee in their very comfortable upscale coffee house. Courtesy call during and immediately after repairs. Car is washed and ready at the front door as I drive in.

So do we have you to blame for the GM bankruptcy? :D My wife gets lousy service at her Buick dealership for her Park Avenue. She has to wait 30 to 45 minutes for the courtesy van to drive her 3/4 of a mile to work. I guess she should've bought a Caddy.

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I've actually been told by a couple of different guys who have detailed my car that the paint quality is very high on it, and it's a "soft" paint. They were both impressed. I must say I also feel the paint quality is some of the best paint I've seen....way way better than the paint on my Honda Accord.

 

My car is Performance White, so I don't know if Black is a completely different issue....

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Give us a break, Chuck. :doh: So you want the dealer to repaint your car because you chipped it? :hysterical2:

The BMW dealer was doing your friend a favor- its not an "import" or "American" car thing. BMWs are also more expensive and limited.

 

My GT500 is black. The paint on it looks great! I also owned an '05 Mustang GT that was black. The paint was just as nice. I drove it everyday and it got chips. Just like any other car.

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I have a white Shelby GT500 with 13,000 miles. The paint looks flawless and the car looks brand new. I had a black 05 Mustang GT and the paint on that was incredible the first couple years and after 72,000 miles and 3 years later still looked brand new. In fact when I flipped it on the highway the Sherrif said "brand new too, that's a shame". I'm happy with the build quality.

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Stone chips! 40+ years from now, that'll be referred to as "patina" and it'll be worth more :hysterical: an unrestored original...

 

My '68 KR has a totally chipped lower valance, and when I drive it, and another rock hits me, i don't worry about, its not concours, its not a garage queen, drive them, enjoy them, thats what they were made for...

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I've actually been told by a couple of different guys who have detailed my car that the paint quality is very high on it, and it's a "soft" paint. They were both impressed. I must say I also feel the paint quality is some of the best paint I've seen....way way better than the paint on my Honda Accord.

 

My car is Performance White, so I don't know if Black is a completely different issue....

 

+1 I have been told it is soft also or at least on the soft side of medium.

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Give us a break, Chuck. :doh: So you want the dealer to repaint your car because you chipped it? :hysterical2:

The BMW dealer was doing your friend a favor- its not an "import" or "American" car thing. BMWs are also more expensive and limited.

 

My GT500 is black. The paint on it looks great! I also owned an '05 Mustang GT that was black. The paint was just as nice. I drove it everyday and it got chips. Just like any other car.

 

Interesting but my GT500 is much more rare that most BMWs and cost more as well.

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I have had my 08 Grabber Orange GT500 in twice for paint related issues. First when drying the car I had paint flaking off under the trunk lid along the drip channel. Then while drying again I had paint coming off the bottom of the passenger door right behind the front fender. Both times the dealer took care of it right away with no problems.

 

I believe the problem on some of our cars is that the paint is to thin or not enough material being applied.

 

The body shells of our cars and most other cars are bolted on a conveyor system and the shells are dipped or submerged in vats of corrosion fighting washes and primers until they are finally put through the paint booth where robots apply the color and clearcoat. Once this is completed the shells are baked at a very high temp to cure the product and give it a nice shine. At this point is where the weak link enters the picture, we cannot duplicate the paint process that the factory applies. The factory has a onsite paint touchup team that repairs scraps, scratches etc that happen during assembly. The factory team uses the same methods and materials that any other body shop in the country uses and when making the repairs is where you find dirt, fisheyes etc. When the factory bakes the new finish the conveyor never stops moving so the shell is super heated to 300 to 400 degrees for a fast cure. The regular body shop can only heat our cars to a max temp of 140 because of all the plastics, fuel and most of all the cars computer will fail being heated to much more than 140. The is a QC team that is supposed to review the vehicle before it leaves the factory. If your car has a imperfection or paint related issue take it back to the dealer and have them make it right.

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