jrichard Posted November 14, 2006 Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 I'll start with my question: How do I get the number of the Ford Regional Rep for a dealership in Oregon? I know her name and, obviously, that she serves my dealer. I'd like to talk with her directly. So, help a brother out and reply here or PM me if you're able to get a rep's name or tell me how to do it. My story: I have a deal for a 2007 GT500 at MSRP...the deal was made in June with the general manager and I left a $7,500 deposit. The deal is in writing, including a letter to me confirming the pricing. The dealership has had turnover in management and the current management and owner have told me they do not intend to sell me the car because they can get "$15,000 more from someone else" and it's not fair to them that I get the benefit of the higher prices in the current market. This chaps my hide. I absolutely do not mind dealers getting ADM if they are up front and honest about it (e.g. Five Oh B ). Perfectly acceptable. Perfectly unacceptable is taking my money and then going back on my deal. Fortunately, I have the resources to pursue this. My attorney has already sent a demand letter and we will file a complaint in Superior Court at the end of this week if the dealership does not affirm the contract. Fortunately, California takes jurisdiction as I am a California consumer and never travelled to Oregon to sign the contract. California has fairly strong consumer protection laws. I think this will end up costing the dealer much more than $15,000. Nevertheless, this has been discouraging and time consuming. It's taken a lot of the fun out of buying this car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grabber Posted November 14, 2006 Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 You have a contract that you did not sign ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rpretzel Posted November 14, 2006 Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 That sucks, jrichard! I hate to hear these stories. It sounds like you have a very stong case. Good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grabber Posted November 14, 2006 Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 There is more than 1 Ford Rep. in Oregon. The Rep. represents Ford, not the dealer. Your problem is with the dealer. I do not think the Rep. has any say in ADM or the issue you are faced with. IMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandyman Posted November 14, 2006 Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 I'll start with my question: How do I get the number of the Ford Regional Rep for a dealership in Oregon? I know her name and, obviously, that she serves my dealer. I'd like to talk with her directly. So, help a brother out and reply here or PM me if you're able to get a rep's name or tell me how to do it. My story: I have a deal for a 2007 GT500 at MSRP...the deal was made in June with the general manager and I left a $7,500 deposit. The deal is in writing, including a letter to me confirming the pricing. The dealership has had turnover in management and the current management and owner have told me they do not intend to sell me the car because they can get "$15,000 more from someone else" and it's not fair to them that I get the benefit of the higher prices in the current market. This chaps my hide. I absolutely do not mind dealers getting ADM if they are up front and honest about it (e.g. Five Oh B ). Perfectly acceptable. Perfectly unacceptable is taking my money and then going back on my deal. Fortunately, I have the resources to pursue this. My attorney has already sent a demand letter and we will file a complaint in Superior Court at the end of this week if the dealership does not affirm the contract. Fortunately, California takes jurisdiction as I am a California consumer and never travelled to Oregon to sign the contract. California has fairly strong consumer protection laws. I think this will end up costing the dealer much more than $15,000. Nevertheless, this has been discouraging and time consuming. It's taken a lot of the fun out of buying this car. Did the ownership change also? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrichard Posted November 14, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 Rob: The contract is signed. It's not a form contract, it consists of written communication between the dealership and me (...in contract law, except in certain circumstances, a form contract is not a requirement...only that certain specific elements of an agreement must exist to meet the definition of a contract for this type of purchase). I have quite a bit of experience with contracts and contract enforcement and, in my agreement with the dealership, the elements required by California (and Oregon) statutes exist. This one isn't even close to being in a grey area. You're right that my beef is with the dealer--that is why the complaint will be filed against the dealer and not Ford. Nevertheless, I wish to talk with the Ford rep that handles the dealership. That is not to say that I'm counting on her to resolve anything. At the end of the day, I'm not concerned about prevailing on this matter and I am willing to spend what it takes...well above the current ADM in the market. Unfortunately, I think many dealerships pull stunts like this because they bet, probably correctly, that most consumers will not spend the money to pursue it. The ownership is the same, but they've had a lot of turnover. The sales manager has turned over multiple times. The general manager has been replaced. I realize there is more than one rep in Oregon. So, I'm looking for someone that can help by ( a ) providing me the name of the rep if I provide more details (e.g. the rep's name and the dealership info) or ( b ) telling me the best way to go about securing the name of the rep. I'd rather not post the dealer name in a public form as this matter will soon be in litigation. JR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandyman Posted November 14, 2006 Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 At the end of the day, I'm not concerned about prevailing on this matter and I am willing to spend what it takes...well above the current ADM in the market. Unfortunately, I think many dealerships pull stunts like this because they bet, probably correctly, that most consumers will not spend the money to pursue it. I admire your attitute. Go for them like a dog on a cheap piece of meat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUFDRAFT Posted November 14, 2006 Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 Sober up, men. You know what this means. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rpretzel Posted November 14, 2006 Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 I can sick Machine Gun Kitty on them if you would like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grabber Posted November 14, 2006 Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 Ruf: When are you gonna start barkin out assignments? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColdwaterHotrod Posted November 14, 2006 Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 Ruf: When are you gonna start barkin out assignments? Count me in Ruf for duty, I can get to any airport much quicker now & since we have a fallen comrad, we must help our own right a wrong. Here Kitty, Kitty....bring your big gun Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grabber Posted November 14, 2006 Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 PM sent 10 minutes ago? What's up? Hotwater, your wanted on the stupid question thread! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColdwaterHotrod Posted November 14, 2006 Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 Hotwater, your wanted on the stupid question thread! ??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grabber Posted November 14, 2006 Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 ??? Sorry coldwatercoldrod, I mean coldwaterwarmrod. I ran out of Meds. again Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColdwaterHotrod Posted November 14, 2006 Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 Sorry coldwatercoldrod, I mean coldwaterwarmrod. I ran out of Meds. again I found the stupid question and replied Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CobraCrazy Posted November 14, 2006 Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 Rob: The contract is signed. It's not a form contract, it consists of written communication between the dealership and me (...in contract law, except in certain circumstances, a form contract is not a requirement...only that certain specific elements of an agreement must exist to meet the definition of a contract for this type of purchase). I have quite a bit of experience with contracts and contract enforcement and, in my agreement with the dealership, the elements required by California (and Oregon) statutes exist. This one isn't even close to being in a grey area. You're right that my beef is with the dealer--that is why the complaint will be filed against the dealer and not Ford. Nevertheless, I wish to talk with the Ford rep that handles the dealership. That is not to say that I'm counting on her to resolve anything. At the end of the day, I'm not concerned about prevailing on this matter and I am willing to spend what it takes...well above the current ADM in the market. Unfortunately, I think many dealerships pull stunts like this because they bet, probably correctly, that most consumers will not spend the money to pursue it. The ownership is the same, but they've had a lot of turnover. The sales manager has turned over multiple times. The general manager has been replaced. I realize there is more than one rep in Oregon. So, I'm looking for someone that can help by ( a ) providing me the name of the rep if I provide more details (e.g. the rep's name and the dealership info) or ( b ) telling me the best way to go about securing the name of the rep. I'd rather not post the dealer name in a public form as this matter will soon be in litigation. JR JR, Sorry to hear that yet another Ford dealer is unethical and greedy, and most of all that is has soured your Shelby experience. Go get em, kick some ass, and keep us posted! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrichard Posted November 14, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 Thanks for the support. I let everyone know the outcome once the dust settles. In the meantime, if anyone knows a way to get the number for this dealer's rep (...I know her first name and that she reps for this dealer...), please let me know. If you can't put it in writing, PM your phone number and I'll call you. As a little aside, the dealer doesn't even think what's he's doing is unethical or greedy, much less a breach of contract. Not only did he tell me our agreement isn't fair to him, but that I'd do the same thing if the shoe were on the other foot. Amazing. Most of what I do is governed by agreements...some in the form of formal written contracts, but much of it is informal...hand shake deals. I can't tell you how much money I've "lost" because of deals I've made that I later regretted. It just happens. It's life. But I've never gone back on a deal...written or verbal. Never. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grabber Posted November 14, 2006 Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 Thanks for the support. I let everyone know the outcome once the dust settles. In the meantime, if anyone knows a way to get the number for this dealer's rep (...I know her first name and that she reps for this dealer...), please let me know. If you can't put it in writing, PM your phone number and I'll call you. As a little aside, the dealer doesn't even think what's he's doing is unethical or greedy, much less a breach of contract. Not only did he tell me our agreement isn't fair to him, but that I'd do the same thing if the shoe were on the other foot. Amazing. Most of what I do is governed by agreements...some in the form of formal written contracts, but much of it is informal...hand shake deals. I can't tell you how much money I've "lost" because of deals I've made that I later regretted. It just happens. It's life. But I've never gone back on a deal...written or verbal. Never. Did the PM I send you go thru ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JETSOLVER Posted November 14, 2006 Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 As a little aside, the dealer doesn't even think what's he's doing is unethical or greedy, much less a breach of contract. Not only did he tell me our agreement isn't fair to him, but that I'd do the same thing if the shoe were on the other foot. Amazing. Most of what I do is governed by agreements...some in the form of formal written contracts, but much of it is informal...hand shake deals. I can't tell you how much money I've "lost" because of deals I've made that I later regretted. It just happens. It's life. But I've never gone back on a deal...written or verbal. Never. Remember our conversation on this very subject some time ago? I took a different viewpoint, but I never wished the same circumstances as some of the rest of us on you. And now it turns out you need an expensive form of KY repellant too. I am saddend by your case, but resigned to a new era of dealer/customer relations. Fight on, and hope you get a speedy and cost effective resolution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BadTony Posted November 14, 2006 Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 yeah, I don't think that the regional rep can help with the dealer issue, but they can help in making sure that the car is ordered, manufactured and delivered to the dealership. I do however, think a letter to Mr. Hazel may also stir up the chum behind the scenes. He will probably forward to the right parties (to include your actual regional rep) involved to help with customer satisfaction issues etc. As far as legal action goes, if you have a signed contract, my guess is that if the Ford store has changed hands since that written agreement was initiated, that they also have assumed liability over all of the previous dealer's debts, customers, services, and agreements with all their suppliers. Your contract should be no different. But check with your legal counsel to be sure. You may have to file in Oregon, as it sounds as though that's where the contract initiated (as is the dealer's physical location). Good luck in getting your Shelby soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carnut Posted November 14, 2006 Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 If not, call Uncle Sal in Philly. Badda Bing Badda Boom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrichard Posted November 14, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 Hey Jetsolver, yes, I remember our conversation. I still see ADM as ok but breach of contract as a very bad thing. I know some believe it is ADM that causes breach by enticing dealers to charge more after making a contract. I understand the logic behind that, but it discounts many other issues with respect to allocation, secondary markets, and breach in the absence of ADM. Nevertheless, some will think I'm getting my just rewards (I'm not implying that you feel this way by any means...but some will feel this way). Awatters, your comments about keeping tabs on the order are exactly why I want contact with the rep. I don't think there is anything she can do to force contract compliance. And your suggestion of writing a letter is a good one. I've already spent a lot of time on this, I might as well spend another half hour writing a letter! From a legal standpoint, this is already with my attorney. Frankly, I was getting too "wrapped up" in it anyway...phone calls to/from the dealership, trying to convince them that breaching the contract is a bad idea, etc. Feeling like they were cocky and I was bullied. Now I'm not really dealing with any of it directly....that's a good thing as it actually makes me less "stressed" about it. Regarding jurisdiction...this is something that may be helpful to others. In a consumer complaint, jurisdiction will typically be in the county of the consumer. Obviously, this depends on the codes of your state and the state of the dealer. But, in my case, the Oregon Revised Statutes explicitly give up jurisdiction if the consumer's assent to the contract did not take place in Oregon and the consumer is not a resident of Oregon. On the flip side, California codes are fairly aggressive about asserting jurisdiction. What this means is that the dealer has the added expense of defending my claim in California....and I have the added benefit of consumer protection laws in California including a provision for attorney's fees and costs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandyman Posted November 14, 2006 Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 The owner is the one ultimatley responsible for the employees of the dealership. With the amount of turnover you described and his attitude towards you, he must be a real loser. Maybe you and your attorney could meet with him and his attorney. Then maybe his attorney will tell this moron he needs to sell you the car as agreed because he is gonna get his ass kicked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrichard Posted November 14, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 The owner is the one ultimatley responsible for the employees of the dealership. With the amount of turnover you described and his attitude towards you, he must be a real loser. Maybe you and your attorney could meet with him and his attorney. Then maybe his attorney will tell this moron he needs to sell you the car as agreed because he is gonna get his ass kicked. Yep, he is responsible...and funny that you mention it because one of the many arguments from the general manager is that no one had the authority to enter a contract but for the owner. Of course, that doesn't fly as a legal theory. Heck, while I'm at it, here are a couple of other funny arguments: ( a ) I can't force him to sell the car, so if he keeps it for himself he can invalidate the contract. Or ( b ) we have a contract but it's verbal so I can't enforce it anyway (...this one ignores the fact that the contract is written...). As you imply, there is something "wrong" with this dealership and I'm seeing it on more than one front. At the end of the day, the dealership made a deal they wish they hadn't. Now they are playing a game of chicken to see who blinks first. To finish that analogy, I've closed my eyes and I'm driving straight ahead, so it doesn't really matter to me what the other guy is doing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandyman Posted November 14, 2006 Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 I had a contract signed by the fleet manager. This was last October and I paid a deposit. I had a terrible feeling they would back out on me. I made up my mind that I would fight it all the way. When I went to pick it up, the fleet manager said the owner wanted to "pull" the car from me. The fleet mgr. showed the owner our agreement and the guy said the owner was pissed. The filters won't let me say what he said. Needless to say the Fleet mgr. will never sign a contract for that dealership again. So, I can relate to your situation. Sic em. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SVTpower Posted November 15, 2006 Report Share Posted November 15, 2006 I'll start with my question: How do I get the number of the Ford Regional Rep for a dealership in Oregon? I know her name and, obviously, that she serves my dealer. I'd like to talk with her directly. So, help a brother out and reply here or PM me if you're able to get a rep's name or tell me how to do it. My story: I have a deal for a 2007 GT500 at MSRP...the deal was made in June with the general manager and I left a $7,500 deposit. The deal is in writing, including a letter to me confirming the pricing. The dealership has had turnover in management and the current management and owner have told me they do not intend to sell me the car because they can get "$15,000 more from someone else" and it's not fair to them that I get the benefit of the higher prices in the current market. This chaps my hide. I absolutely do not mind dealers getting ADM if they are up front and honest about it (e.g. Five Oh B ). Perfectly acceptable. Perfectly unacceptable is taking my money and then going back on my deal. Fortunately, I have the resources to pursue this. My attorney has already sent a demand letter and we will file a complaint in Superior Court at the end of this week if the dealership does not affirm the contract. Fortunately, California takes jurisdiction as I am a California consumer and never travelled to Oregon to sign the contract. California has fairly strong consumer protection laws. I think this will end up costing the dealer much more than $15,000. Nevertheless, this has been discouraging and time consuming. It's taken a lot of the fun out of buying this car. Trust me on this one..........if you have a written and signed contract.........Fight this!!! You will win. Your fight is against the dealer, not the staff or its turnover issues...........and trust me on this too..........Ford or the dealer Ford rep won't be able to help. The dealer can do it and is trying to shaft you. Get that letter out and I'm sure it has a date for them to reply. Good luck!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harley99fb Posted November 15, 2006 Report Share Posted November 15, 2006 Yep, he is responsible...and funny that you mention it because one of the many arguments from the general manager is that no one had the authority to enter a contract but for the owner. Of course, that doesn't fly as a legal theory. Heck, while I'm at it, here are a couple of other funny arguments: ( a ) I can't force him to sell the car, so if he keeps it for himself he can invalidate the contract. Or ( b ) we have a contract but it's verbal so I can't enforce it anyway (...this one ignores the fact that the contract is written...). As you imply, there is something "wrong" with this dealership and I'm seeing it on more than one front. At the end of the day, the dealership made a deal they wish they hadn't. Now they are playing a game of chicken to see who blinks first. To finish that analogy, I've closed my eyes and I'm driving straight ahead, so it doesn't really matter to me what the other guy is doing. Jrichard. I am going through almost exactly the same thing. My dealer refuses to sell me my car at msrp. I won't get into alot of the details but they still have my deposit. Do they still have your deposit? My dealership also changed GM's. I went ahead and bought a car and paid an ADM. I also have initiated litigation. After my last visit to the dealership I went home and filed a complaint with the Better Buisness Bureau, The States Attorney General, The Department of Labor, wrote letters to William Clay Ford Jr., Darryl B. Hazel, Alan Mulally and the Board of Directors. I also have the resources to go after the a-holes and intend to. Good luck. Let's keep each other posted. I hope in the end I have two in my garage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
442forever(noolds) Posted November 15, 2006 Report Share Posted November 15, 2006 This is an old story I'm sad to say. I went through this with promise of 5k adm's blowing up to 15-20k. I am hooked up at 7.5k over and a looming build date of 11/20. I think I've found an honorable dealer,yet you just don't know until the deal is done. My knowledge with my zone rep in this matter is this. The only help from them you'll get is if you line up another deal with another dealer, if that one falls through, If he or she knows you got jobbed like that they will try to get you a car sooner then later. That is what mine did for me. Sorry to hear this man. You do have the law on your side for this one. I hope the owner understands this promptly and does the honorable thing. Good luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrichard Posted November 15, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 15, 2006 Thanks for the input, guys. I have no illusion that Ford or the rep will step in and help me on this one. I do, though, want to establish a relationship witih the regional rep for a variety of reasons. Fortunately, someone stepped up and provided me the contact information for the rep. Help from Ford doesn't matter as the dealer is in a pickle on this one. I think his strategy is to ( a ) not respond to our letter demanding assurance that he will perform under the terms of the contract, ( b ) see if I actually file a complaint...then decide what to do from there. Of course, I will actually file a complaint. And I will move forward with it. My attorney has started work on it so we can file it this week in anticipation of the dealer "testing" my resolve. At the moment and prior to filing the complaint, I'll walk away from attorneys fees. But very soon the machine will be moving and the dealer will have to step up with the car (or damages) and my expenses to get out from under this. Ideally, the dealer will realize this is a losing battle and that it's always dumb to fight a losing battle. I've repeatedly encouraged him to seek out competent counsel....and he keeps telling me he has, but his comments with respect to the governing statutes make it painfully obvious he has not sought any counsel. I'm civil, I haven't gone on a tirade against the dealer, and I play well with others. If the dealer simply affirms this deal and delivers the car, I'll be easy to work with and we all win. Unfortunately, I think he's still in bully mode. Which isn't detrimental to my eventual success...but it is a pain. harley99fb, I share your frustration on this one. And, yes, they still have my deposit. I'll PM you with a direct email so we can share 'war stories' and strategies... JR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
442forever(noolds) Posted November 15, 2006 Report Share Posted November 15, 2006 Call any other dealer in your area and ask the gm or sales manager for the contact info. If they question you why you want it just tell them your having issues with a competitor and am looking for some help with contact info. That is how I got mine. Ask for phone and email address. If they are above board and you explain yourself they should provide it for you. I must add, I had to call three dealers before I found one willing to give up the info. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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