BillyRay Posted August 16, 2006 Report Share Posted August 16, 2006 Friends, Here is my dilemma, if money is not the really the issue would you at this time buy a coupe and a convertible Shelby if you could? I have money down on a Grabber Orange with Tungsten stripe and I have money down on a triple black convt. I just got back from Berge Ford here in Mesa AZ they have a Grabber orange on the showroom with the stripe delete option. I,am sorry but as I walked around the car I wasnt that impressed. It looked like any other Mustang with Cobra emblems. I know with the Horsepower and if I went for a ride that would make a difference but just to look at the car I wasnt that excited. I,am currently paying 10K for the convt. and 12.5K over for the coupe. I may have woke up today on the wrong side of the bed...I dont know.. I guess my question will be is the Shelby a good investment 20 yrs down the road? Would you buy 2-Shelbys or just get one? If you only buy one..which one? Thanks for any help..BillyRay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joe53 Posted August 16, 2006 Report Share Posted August 16, 2006 Billy Ray, If money were no object, then buy both with the ADM, but the GT 500 is not worth any ADM, in my opinion. It's nice but not 10k over nice. It sounds from your comments you may be feeling that way as well. Folks buying the car as an investment in the future, especially with an ADM will be disappointed at their return. The car will go down in value and might eventually return to near msrp. Given Ford's recent announcements of the "flavor of the month Shelby" who knows which one of the "limited editions" is the one to by. Just my opinion. Good Luck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5.4 Shelby Posted August 16, 2006 Report Share Posted August 16, 2006 Friends, Here is my dilemma, if money is not the really the issue would you at this time buy a coupe and a convertible Shelby if you could? I have money down on a Grabber Orange with Tungsten stripe and I have money down on a triple black convt. I just got back from Berge Ford here in Mesa AZ they have a Grabber orange on the showroom with the stripe delete option. I,am sorry but as I walked around the car I wasnt that impressed. It looked like any other Mustang with Cobra emblems. I know with the Horsepower and if I went for a ride that would make a difference but just to look at the car I wasnt that excited. I,am currently paying 10K for the convt. and 12.5K over for the coupe. I may have woke up today on the wrong side of the bed...I dont know.. I guess my question will be is the Shelby a good investment 20 yrs down the road? Would you buy 2-Shelbys or just get one? If you only buy one..which one? Thanks for any help..BillyRay Do whatever your heart tells you to, but, I wouldn't buy either at ADM. I'm waiting for sticker. These cars are NOT investment material. IF you want to invest - first, put in the market. If you want to invest in cars, buy an older muscle car. These cars are not proven to go up. They will depreciate just like any other new car. IF they ever do go up, the money will have performed better in the market. just MHO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrichard Posted August 16, 2006 Report Share Posted August 16, 2006 If money is no object, skip buying two GT500s and go directly to the GT. :happy feet: As an investment, these cars blow. Unequivocally, you are throwing money down the drain. And that's if the car quintuples in value. If it goes down in value, it's just that much more money flushed away. I went through this on another post, but some may not have seen it, so I'll go through it here (some of my base assumptions might have changed...I can't remember exactly what I used previously). Assume: ( a ) purchase price of $50,000 all cash (financing doesn't change the equation much...generally, it actually makes the picture worse). ( b ) Maintenance / insurance / storage / gas / detailing / misc cost of ownership equal to $1500/ year escalating at 2.5% year (inflation). That's another $65,850 that you'll pour into the car. ( c ) Your car quintuples in value over a 30 year holding period...so you sell in in 2036 for $250,000. Sounds good so far. But you have alternative investments. You could take that same money and invest in a diversified portfolio. Let's be fairly conservative and assume a 7.5% annual return (the market ain't what it used to be). Do it in your IRA or 401(k) and it's tax free. In 30 years, your portfolio is worth $652,449. Holy cow! You just flushed $402,449 down the drain assuming the GT500 escalates in value by 5 times! And that's just one car! If the car simply keeps its value instead of quntupling in value, then you flushed another $200,000 down the drain. But, it's not as bad as it sounds because we're talking "tomorrow" dollars. If I discount them back to today at a 2.5% rate of inflation (...so we can compare spendable dollars tomorrow with spendable dollars today...), your car valuation is $119,185 and your portfolio valuation is $311,050. So, in reality, you only flushed $191,865 of today's dollars down the crapper. That's not so bad...well, your wife and kids might have a different opinion. If the car simply maintains its $50,000 value for 30 years (at which point many folks would claim they had not lost money on the car), the discounted value is $23,387...so, you flushed $287,212 into the sewer (today's dollars). And remember, in today's dollars, you will have sunk $95,000 into the car over a 30 year period. That's some meaningful negtive cash flow to get a low return. I'm not playing with the numbers here...all of this is easily replicated. I think if "investors" did the basic math, they would conclude that a home-run car investment is horrible. Unless you assume some astronomical future value for the car, it will cost you money...and a lot of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest evilchris Posted August 16, 2006 Report Share Posted August 16, 2006 The logic of " well 60's Shelby's are worth a lot so these will be too in 40 years " is logically rediculous. Buy them if you wanna drive em, not as an investment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillyRay Posted August 16, 2006 Author Report Share Posted August 16, 2006 If money is no object, skip buying two GT500s and go directly to the GT. :happy feet: As an investment, these cars blow. Unequivocally, you are throwing money down the drain. And that's if the car quintuples in value. If it goes down in value, it's just that much more money flushed away. I went through this on another post, but some may not have seen it, so I'll go through it here (some of my base assumptions might have changed...I can't remember exactly what I used previously). Assume: ( a ) purchase price of $50,000 all cash (financing doesn't change the equation much...generally, it actually makes the picture worse). ( b ) Maintenance / insurance / storage / gas / detailing / misc cost of ownership equal to $1500/ year escalating at 2.5% year (inflation). That's another $65,850 that you'll pour into the car. ( c ) Your car quintuples in value over a 30 year holding period...so you sell in in 2036 for $250,000. Sounds good so far. But you have alternative investments. You could take that same money and invest in a diversified portfolio. Let's be fairly conservative and assume a 7.5% annual return (the market ain't what it used to be). Do it in your IRA or 401(k) and it's tax free. In 30 years, your portfolio is worth $652,449. Holy cow! You just flushed $402,449 down the drain assuming the GT500 escalates in value by 5 times! And that's just one car! If the car simply keeps its value instead of quntupling in value, then you flushed another $200,000 down the drain. But, it's not as bad as it sounds because we're talking "tomorrow" dollars. If I discount them back to today at a 2.5% rate of inflation (...so we can compare spendable dollars tomorrow with spendable dollars today...), your car valuation is $119,185 and your portfolio valuation is $311,050. So, in reality, you only flushed $191,865 of today's dollars down the crapper. That's not so bad...well, your wife and kids might have a different opinion. If the car simply maintains its $50,000 value for 30 years (at which point many folks would claim they had not lost money on the car), the discounted value is $23,387...so, you flushed $287,212 into the sewer (today's dollars). And remember, in today's dollars, you will have sunk $95,000 into the car over a 30 year period. That's some meaningful negtive cash flow to get a low return. I'm not playing with the numbers here...all of this is easily replicated. I think if "investors" did the basic math, they would conclude that a home-run car investment is horrible. Unless you assume some astronomical future value for the car, it will cost you money...and a lot of it. If money is no object, skip buying two GT500s and go directly to the GT. :happy feet: As an investment, these cars blow. Unequivocally, you are throwing money down the drain. And that's if the car quintuples in value. If it goes down in value, it's just that much more money flushed away. I went through this on another post, but some may not have seen it, so I'll go through it here (some of my base assumptions might have changed...I can't remember exactly what I used previously). Assume: ( a ) purchase price of $50,000 all cash (financing doesn't change the equation much...generally, it actually makes the picture worse). ( b ) Maintenance / insurance / storage / gas / detailing / misc cost of ownership equal to $1500/ year escalating at 2.5% year (inflation). That's another $65,850 that you'll pour into the car. ( c ) Your car quintuples in value over a 30 year holding period...so you sell in in 2036 for $250,000. Sounds good so far. But you have alternative investments. You could take that same money and invest in a diversified portfolio. Let's be fairly conservative and assume a 7.5% annual return (the market ain't what it used to be). Do it in your IRA or 401(k) and it's tax free. In 30 years, your portfolio is worth $652,449. Holy cow! You just flushed $402,449 down the drain assuming the GT500 escalates in value by 5 times! And that's just one car! If the car simply keeps its value instead of quntupling in value, then you flushed another $200,000 down the drain. But, it's not as bad as it sounds because we're talking "tomorrow" dollars. If I discount them back to today at a 2.5% rate of inflation (...so we can compare spendable dollars tomorrow with spendable dollars today...), your car valuation is $119,185 and your portfolio valuation is $311,050. So, in reality, you only flushed $191,865 of today's dollars down the crapper. That's not so bad...well, your wife and kids might have a different opinion. If the car simply maintains its $50,000 value for 30 years (at which point many folks would claim they had not lost money on the car), the discounted value is $23,387...so, you flushed $287,212 into the sewer (today's dollars). And remember, in today's dollars, you will have sunk $95,000 into the car over a 30 year period. That's some meaningful negtive cash flow to get a low return. I'm not playing with the numbers here...all of this is easily replicated. I think if "investors" did the basic math, they would conclude that a home-run car investment is horrible. Unless you assume some astronomical future value for the car, it will cost you money...and a lot of it. Thanks again I thought you guys would KNOCK some sense into me!! BiiyRay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUFDRAFT Posted August 16, 2006 Report Share Posted August 16, 2006 Investments? Stock Market. Fun? Buy and drive the car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerry Chase 1128 Posted August 16, 2006 Report Share Posted August 16, 2006 Investments? Stock Market. Fun? Buy and drive the car. +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColdwaterHotrod Posted August 16, 2006 Report Share Posted August 16, 2006 BUY BOTH! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JETSOLVER Posted August 16, 2006 Report Share Posted August 16, 2006 BUY BOTH! One new one for fun and an old one for investment purposes....Mr. Jackson got another one for you Really though wouldn't you rather just one you could drive and spend the money on your kids? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alloy Dave Posted August 17, 2006 Report Share Posted August 17, 2006 I don't understand this "buy for investment" concept. What do you think it will be worth in 20 years? If you take 47,000 now (MSRP + gas guzzler + taxes and options on a coupe), and invest it at 5% (a very conservative figure) for 20 years, you'd have $124,704. Do you think this car will be worth more than that? Cars as purely an investment are typically not a good return item. Just remember that you'll be spending at least hundreds of dollars and many hours a year to maintain it. If you want it to be in good condition 20 years from now, you'll have to either hermetically seal it (which will cost money), or wash/wax, replace battery every 5-6 years, pay storage costs unless in your own garage, change oil even if you don't drive it, change anti-freeze (you don't really think 20-year-old anti-freeze will be any good do you?), and so on. Now I know that some people say well...it's partly an investment and partly for fun...and that's great. If you look at it that way, it's basically that you're looking for a car that won't depreciate as much as a "typical" car...and you'll likely be successful. However, as a PURE investment...this is not the way to make money long-term IMHO. Put it in the stock market, real estate, fine art, or some other long-term investment...and let it ride. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwinTurboBoss Posted August 17, 2006 Report Share Posted August 17, 2006 Friends, Here is my dilemma, if money is not the really the issue would you at this time buy a coupe and a convertible Shelby if you could? I have money down on a Grabber Orange with Tungsten stripe and I have money down on a triple black convt. I just got back from Berge Ford here in Mesa AZ they have a Grabber orange on the showroom with the stripe delete option. I,am sorry but as I walked around the car I wasnt that impressed. It looked like any other Mustang with Cobra emblems. I know with the Horsepower and if I went for a ride that would make a difference but just to look at the car I wasnt that excited. I,am currently paying 10K for the convt. and 12.5K over for the coupe. I may have woke up today on the wrong side of the bed...I dont know.. I guess my question will be is the Shelby a good investment 20 yrs down the road? Would you buy 2-Shelbys or just get one? If you only buy one..which one? Thanks for any help..BillyRay Berge says that car is already sold? They said they had over 200 people on waiting list for 10k over. Earnhardts is 25k over, grubby lous is 25k over, 5 snar ford is 20k over. Only dealer in town who sold them at MSRP was Sanderson. Thats because mr K is a standup guy and WILL NOT gouge his customers. Its no wonder his customer service is on highest level of any Ford Dealer in country. Thats why he was only ONE of 19 Dealers in the country to win the Big Triple Crown Award from Ford. And 2nd year running. Do not think there has been another dealer that has ever done it. I have bought new veh from Berge, 5star, Ehards, Grubby Lou(fd of n scts) and Sanderson. THe others are not even in same league. Friends, Here is my dilemma, if money is not the really the issue would you at this time buy a coupe and a convertible Shelby if you could? I have money down on a Grabber Orange with Tungsten stripe and I have money down on a triple black convt. I just got back from Berge Ford here in Mesa AZ they have a Grabber orange on the showroom with the stripe delete option. I,am sorry but as I walked around the car I wasnt that impressed. It looked like any other Mustang with Cobra emblems. I know with the Horsepower and if I went for a ride that would make a difference but just to look at the car I wasnt that excited. I,am currently paying 10K for the convt. and 12.5K over for the coupe. I may have woke up today on the wrong side of the bed...I dont know.. I guess my question will be is the Shelby a good investment 20 yrs down the road? Would you buy 2-Shelbys or just get one? If you only buy one..which one? Thanks for any help..BillyRay Buy them BOTH! You have to think of the enjoyment you will get also. Its not just the $$. How many one owner 07 Shelby's do you think you will see in 20yrs? Slim to none. How much enjoyment would you get out of investing it some other way? If you have the funds BUY THEM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
subguns Posted August 17, 2006 Report Share Posted August 17, 2006 Friends, Here is my dilemma, if money is not the really the issue would you at this time buy a coupe and a convertible Shelby if you could? I have money down on a Grabber Orange with Tungsten stripe and I have money down on a triple black convt. I just got back from Berge Ford here in Mesa AZ they have a Grabber orange on the showroom with the stripe delete option. I,am sorry but as I walked around the car I wasnt that impressed. It looked like any other Mustang with Cobra emblems. I know with the Horsepower and if I went for a ride that would make a difference but just to look at the car I wasnt that excited. I,am currently paying 10K for the convt. and 12.5K over for the coupe. I may have woke up today on the wrong side of the bed...I dont know.. I guess my question will be is the Shelby a good investment 20 yrs down the road? Would you buy 2-Shelbys or just get one? If you only buy one..which one? Thanks for any help..BillyRay There seems to be a connection with current 07 Shelby owners or owners to be and ones who do not and will not own an 07 Shelby. Those of us who have or are buying one think they are a good investment and the others think it sucks. Go figure.... I personally think it will not be a home run investment, but for those of us who will limit mileage and drive only on nice days or trailer the car to events will not lose any money and probably make some 20 years from now. When I am 70 years old I will not give a darn. I am looking at the fun I will have and think the recreational cost will be worth it. I wonder what the opinion would be if there was a thread like this in 1969 and we were talking about Hemi Cudas????? Only time will tell. Some speculators are right and some are wrong. I would like to have a back yard full of junker Mustangs of all types right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Martin Posted August 17, 2006 Report Share Posted August 17, 2006 Invest in gold. Buy the car and enjoy the 500hp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUFDRAFT Posted August 17, 2006 Report Share Posted August 17, 2006 :bandance: "How much for your women? How much for the lit-tle girls?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florida Chris Posted August 17, 2006 Report Share Posted August 17, 2006 :bandance: "How much for your women? How much for the lit-tle girls?" Now that made me laugh. Blues' Brothers...what a great movie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mach1fever Posted August 17, 2006 Report Share Posted August 17, 2006 have you seen one in real life with the stripes? It makes a huge difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old guy Posted August 17, 2006 Report Share Posted August 17, 2006 $60,000 compounded every 3 months at 4%/year over 20 years is about $133,000. Your guess is as good as mine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alloy Dave Posted August 17, 2006 Report Share Posted August 17, 2006 Those of us who have or are buying one think they are a good investment and the others think it sucks. Go figure.... I personally think it will not be a home run investment, but for those of us who will limit mileage and drive only on nice days or trailer the car to events will not lose any money and probably make some 20 years from now. I am buying one, and I don't consider it an investment at all. I believe MY car will be worth more than $45k in 20 years...but how much more is anyone's guess. The reason I say MY car is that I plan to drive it infrequently (3,000 miles/year or so), and it will rarely see rain and never see snow. Cars that are driven daily for 20 years will be worn out and will have to be restored (20 yrs x 10,000 miles/year = 200,000 miles...yikes). Even if I knew this car would depreciate as fast as a 1972 Gremlin, I'd buy it....I want it for the performance...not the investment. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUFDRAFT Posted August 17, 2006 Report Share Posted August 17, 2006 In 20 years - I'll probably be wearing Depends - drooling - and trying to race people down the hall with my walker. Presuming I last 20 more... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alloy Dave Posted August 17, 2006 Report Share Posted August 17, 2006 In 20 years - I'll probably be wearing Depends - drooling - and trying to race people down the hall with my walker. Presuming I last 20 more... Just remember....Carroll Shelby is over 80 and still does burnouts (no, I'm not talking about sex with young girls on pot). Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUFDRAFT Posted August 17, 2006 Report Share Posted August 17, 2006 Still does burnouts...You're KILLIN' me over here! :happy feet: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alloy Dave Posted August 17, 2006 Report Share Posted August 17, 2006 Thanks for any help..BillyRay Is your last name Cyrus? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest evilchris Posted August 17, 2006 Report Share Posted August 17, 2006 Just remember....Carroll Shelby is over 80 and still does burnouts (no, I'm not talking about sex with young girls on pot). Dave You mean he gets out of a GT-H in a commercial after a stuntman does burnouts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carnut Posted August 17, 2006 Report Share Posted August 17, 2006 Just remember....Carroll Shelby is over 80 and still does burnouts (no, I'm not talking about sex with young girls on pot). Dave The sex would be good too :bandance: I don't understand this "buy for investment" concept. What do you think it will be worth in 20 years? If you take 47,000 now (MSRP + gas guzzler + taxes and options on a coupe), and invest it at 5% (a very conservative figure) for 20 years, you'd have $124,704. Do you think this car will be worth more than that? Cars as purely an investment are typically not a good return item. Just remember that you'll be spending at least hundreds of dollars and many hours a year to maintain it. If you want it to be in good condition 20 years from now, you'll have to either hermetically seal it (which will cost money), or wash/wax, replace battery every 5-6 years, pay storage costs unless in your own garage, change oil even if you don't drive it, change anti-freeze (you don't really think 20-year-old anti-freeze will be any good do you?), and so on. Now I know that some people say well...it's partly an investment and partly for fun...and that's great. If you look at it that way, it's basically that you're looking for a car that won't depreciate as much as a "typical" car...and you'll likely be successful. However, as a PURE investment...this is not the way to make money long-term IMHO. Put it in the stock market, real estate, fine art, or some other long-term investment...and let it ride. Dave Ain't this a car site screw the money, its about PASSION :happy feet: :happy feet: :happy feet: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5.4 Shelby Posted August 18, 2006 Report Share Posted August 18, 2006 screw the money, its about PASSION :happy feet: :happy feet: :happy feet: Very true. I don't want to see people buying the car just to invest. That is why I always post "it is not a good investment". It will not make a ton of money for them and it would be a waste of a good car. Even Carroll SHelby will tell you "it is meant to be driven." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUFDRAFT Posted August 18, 2006 Report Share Posted August 18, 2006 Chris - you know - sometimes I think you need an old-fasihoned AZZ Kicking. I'm, once again, growing weary of your continuous negativity. Try this for a while - if you can't say something nice - just shut the up and grow up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alloy Dave Posted August 18, 2006 Report Share Posted August 18, 2006 Chris - you know - sometimes I think you need an old-fasihoned AZZ Kicking. I'm, once again, growing weary of your continuous negativity. Try this for a while - if you can't say something nice - just shut the up and grow up. Don't know what he said...but ignore has been working well for me RUF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColdwaterHotrod Posted August 18, 2006 Report Share Posted August 18, 2006 I don't understand this "buy for investment" concept. What do you think it will be worth in 20 years? If you take 47,000 now (MSRP + gas guzzler + taxes and options on a coupe), and invest it at 5% (a very conservative figure) for 20 years, you'd have $124,704. Do you think this car will be worth more than that? Cars as purely an investment are typically not a good return item. Just remember that you'll be spending at least hundreds of dollars and many hours a year to maintain it. If you want it to be in good condition 20 years from now, you'll have to either hermetically seal it (which will cost money), or wash/wax, replace battery every 5-6 years, pay storage costs unless in your own garage, change oil even if you don't drive it, change anti-freeze (you don't really think 20-year-old anti-freeze will be any good do you?), and so on. Now I know that some people say well...it's partly an investment and partly for fun...and that's great. If you look at it that way, it's basically that you're looking for a car that won't depreciate as much as a "typical" car...and you'll likely be successful. However, as a PURE investment...this is not the way to make money long-term IMHO. Put it in the stock market, real estate, fine art, or some other long-term investment...and let it ride. Dave Very well put.... I buying my as an investment in FUN! If I ever get to "F"ing order it You mean he gets out of a GT-H in a commercial after a stuntman does burnouts? Chris go back & look at some of the earlier videos of the proto-type on this site & you will see that the OLD man isn't afraid to spin a car around even with someone else in it with him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Martin Posted August 18, 2006 Report Share Posted August 18, 2006 Buy the car to drive. Invest in tires. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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