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Is a Manifold back Exhaust Still Possible?


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Just wondering what if any is the final outcome on the JBA manifold back testing for EPA certification. It had been mentioned that it was back to the drawing board but have not heard much. The SS packages were originally priced with the more expensive exhaust system. I hope that they just don't roll out with a simple cat back. I have never built anything too serious without full exhaust. The catback only is a little limiting in a supercharged application particularly when your pushing 2.8 liters of air in a high boost application. Feedback welcome...

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Agreed - I would like to have the JBA header/back set-up installed on my convertible.

 

Got a message yesterday from Doug at SAI who is always good about calling me back. He said the full exhaust is "off the table" and the SS packages for the foreseeable future will offer a Borla Catback only. I was hoping for a different answer. I guess we will have to do our own thing when the cars come back. Maybe they can apply the cost difference toward options. Any thoughts??

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IF SAI IS A MOD SHOP AFTER THEY COMPLETE THE SS PACKAGE AND HAVE ALL THE PAPER WORK DONE AND COMPLETE AND IS READY TO SHIP BACK TO THE OWNER COULD YOU NOT AT THAT POINT ASK THEM TO DO A MODIFICATION TO YOUR CAR---LIKE CHANGE THE EXHAUST?

 

BOBH

 

 

It is my understanding that since they EPA certify new cars they are held to a different standard than mod shops that do not certify cars. In order to avoid EPA penalties of some sort SAI has to meet new car EPA standards, which means they can't do it at any point.

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It is my understanding that since they EPA certify new cars they are held to a different standard than mod shops that do not certify cars. In order to avoid EPA penalties of some sort SAI has to meet new car EPA standards, which means they can't do it at any point.

 

If a part is not EPA certified, good luck getting an inspection sticker, too. Theoretically, it could be for "off-road use only".

IF JBA gets their cert, THEN we will offer it as an option, but it has not happened yet. Too bad, the Super Snake sounds insane with this set-up! I have to say, the Borlas do sound sweeeet, but the JBA is a little sharper (more of a bite) & louder.

I would not knock the Borlas, though. And we still can pull the 725+ out of the engine, no problem ;)

 

Chris

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If a part is not EPA certified, good luck getting an inspection sticker, too. Theoretically, it could be for "off-road use only".

IF JBA gets their cert, THEN we will offer it as an option, but it has not happened yet. Too bad, the Super Snake sounds insane with this set-up! I have to say, the Borlas do sound sweeeet, but the JBA is a little sharper (more of a bite) & louder.

I would not knock the Borlas, though. And we still can pull the 725+ out of the engine, no problem ;)

 

Chris

 

I just would prefer it if SAI, and JBA were still trying. Doug's message was pretty clear that it was a no go- I hope it can be added back in as a running change especially since it was built into the original price of the package. Exhaust is so important on heads that can flow as well as our modular heads, especially in a supercharged application. I just feel very disappointed that nothing else is in the works. What about Bassani, SS works, MagnaFlow, Mac etc,etc. Surely the best exhaust manufacturers can find a way if they want the Shelby contract !!

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I just would prefer it if SAI, and JBA were still trying. Doug's message was pretty clear that it was a no go- I hope it can be added back in as a running change especially since it was built into the original price of the package. Exhaust is so important on heads that can flow as well as our modular heads, especially in a supercharged application. I just feel very disappointed that nothing else is in the works. What about Bassani, SS works, MagnaFlow, Mac etc,etc. Surely the best exhaust manufacturers can find a way if they want the Shelby contract !!

I've had my 40th with 725 HP SuperSnaked KB for a couple weeks now. The Borla that comes with both the 605 and 725 is the same as that which comes on the 40th. It is the Borla 14022 or the "touring oval exhaust". I tried to adovocate, unsuccessfully I might add, to review this decision and at least go with the Borla 140210 for the 725. The 14210 is much more aggressive than the touring Borla. The 14210 is very similar to the old Stinger except with less droon. After two weeks with the touring mufflers, I can't stand it any longer, I will be reinstalling my FRPP 5GT's tomorrow.

 

The decision to go with the touring exhaust seems to be centered around having to be 50 state legal.

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I sure hope that we can have an exhaust that sounds like a SUPERSNAKE. It should not be weak. This baby should growl. I think it is too bad that one state can keep us from a mean exhaust. We should have the choice. I cant believe that we are spending 30K and not even getting the meanest sounding exhaust. We haven't even HEARD the exhaust yet. I think especially now that it is being produced we should get a dyno sheet and some clips of the exhaust that is on our cars, not Amy's or another prototype.

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I've had my 40th with 725 HP SuperSnaked KB for a couple weeks now. The Borla that comes with both the 605 and 725 is the same as that which comes on the 40th. It is the Borla 14022 or the "touring oval exhaust". I tried to adovocate, unsuccessfully I might add, to review this decision and at least go with the Borla 140210 for the 725. The 14210 is much more aggressive than the touring Borla. The 14210 is very similar to the old Stinger except with less droon. After two weeks with the touring mufflers, I can't stand it any longer, I will be reinstalling my FRPP 5GT's tomorrow.

 

The decision to go with the touring exhaust seems to be centered around having to be 50 state legal.

 

Cobrafan- Can you post a video of the SS exhaust as it came from SAI. I am sure a lot of guys would love to have some idea of what we are getting. I agree- the car should growl and bark at the same time. Also what are your overall impressions of the car now that you have it back?? Congratulations!

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I sure hope that we can have an exhaust that sounds like a SUPERSNAKE. It should not be weak. This baby should growl. I think it is too bad that one state can keep us from a mean exhaust. We should have the choice. I cant believe that we are spending 30K and not even getting the meanest sounding exhaust. We haven't even HEARD the exhaust yet. I think especially now that it is being produced we should get a dyno sheet and some clips of the exhaust that is on our cars, not Amy's or another prototype.

I think SAI has been wrestling with the exhaust since the get-go. The Borla that they install will not be considered aggressive by many folks. It is a step up from stock.

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Cobrafan- Can you post a video of the SS exhaust as it came from SAI. I am sure a lot of guys would love to have some idea of what we are getting. I agree- the car should growl and bark at the same time. Also what are your overall impressions of the car now that you have it back?? Congratulations!

Sorry, I don't have the ability to do a clip of the exhaust. If you expect it to bark and growl, it won't.

 

This car is bad to the bone. It is a different car, no comparison to stock. The power is crazy. You can make every launch like the first drop on a roll a coaster. It dynoed at 619 at the rear wheels on a hot day in Florida last Sunday and that may have been on 91 octane gas? That puts it right where it should be within a couple of percentage points of advertised.

 

There is a huge difference in handling. Much stiffer but very manageable. There is no more jumping around with the rear end when driving over rough roads or bumps in the road. I am absolutely blown away and extremely satisfied.

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COBRAFAN--DON'T KNOW HOW YOU GET TIME TO ANSWER ALL THESE QUESTIONS WITH THE CAR SITTING IN THE GARAGE BUT I'V GOT A COUPLE ---

 

DID YOU GET A PRICE ADJUSTMENT BECAUSE THE JBA MANIFOLD BACKS WEREN'T USED?

 

WHEN YOU TALKED TO THEM ABOUT WANTING A BETTER SYSTEM WHY WOULD THEY NOT GO TO ANOTHER BRAND THATS 50 STATE APPROVED THAT GIVES THE SOUND AND PERFORMANCE PROMISED?

THERES DOZENS OF THEM.

 

WHAT IS THE STORY WITH JBA--ARE THEY WORKING ON IT, SITTING ON IT OR FORGETTING ABOUT IT.

 

BOY IT WOULD BREAK MY HEART TO PAY THAT MUCH TO GET THE COMPLETE SS PACKAGE AND HAVE TO DRIVE IT HOME AND IMMEDIATELY TAKE IT OUT OF THE 'ORIGINAL CONDITION' AND HAVE TO PUT DIFFERENT EXHAUST SYSTEM ON--HORRIBLE.

 

IS THAT FUSE BOX COVER PART OF THE PACKAGE.

 

THANKS FOR TAKING THE TIME.

 

BOBH

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COBRAFAN--DON'T KNOW HOW YOU GET TIME TO ANSWER ALL THESE QUESTIONS WITH THE CAR SITTING IN THE GARAGE BUT I'V GOT A COUPLE ---

 

DID YOU GET A PRICE ADJUSTMENT BECAUSE THE JBA MANIFOLD BACKS WEREN'T USED?

 

WHEN YOU TALKED TO THEM ABOUT WANTING A BETTER SYSTEM WHY WOULD THEY NOT GO TO ANOTHER BRAND THATS 50 STATE APPROVED THAT GIVES THE SOUND AND PERFORMANCE PROMISED?

THERES DOZENS OF THEM.

 

WHAT IS THE STORY WITH JBA--ARE THEY WORKING ON IT, SITTING ON IT OR FORGETTING ABOUT IT.

 

BOY IT WOULD BREAK MY HEART TO PAY THAT MUCH TO GET THE COMPLETE SS PACKAGE AND HAVE TO DRIVE IT HOME AND IMMEDIATELY TAKE IT OUT OF THE 'ORIGINAL CONDITION' AND HAVE TO PUT DIFFERENT EXHAUST SYSTEM ON--HORRIBLE.

 

IS THAT FUSE BOX COVER PART OF THE PACKAGE.

 

THANKS FOR TAKING THE TIME.

 

BOBH

 

BOBH,

 

There was no price adjustment because of the JBA delete. I think JBA is working on trying to get their system certified, but I don't know that for a fact, everything gets a little blury with all the conversations I've had. The fuse box cover, strut tower covers, and bolt covers were mods that I did before it was converted.

 

My biggest concern was breaking up the package immediately as you mention. But the sound just isn't there for me with the Borla 14022. I've already sold them. Eventually I may replace the FRPP with the Borla 14210's as they will say Borla and at least fake out those that don't look under the car to see that they are not part of the package and they sound very close to the FRPP's. I'm sure many will be happy with the 14022's, but just not my kind of sound.

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BOBH,

 

There was no price adjustment because of the JBA delete. I think JBA is working on trying to get their system certified, but I don't know that for a fact, everything gets a little blury with all the conversations I've had. The fuse box cover, strut tower covers, and bolt covers were mods that I did before it was converted.

 

My biggest concern was breaking up the package immediately as you mention. But the sound just isn't there for me with the Borla 14022. I've already sold them. Eventually I may replace the FRPP with the Borla 14210's as they will say Borla and at least fake out those that don't look under the car to see that they are not part of the package and they sound very close to the FRPP's. I'm sure many will be happy with the 14022's, but just not my kind of sound.

 

THAT'S SAD---THAT YOU HAD TO REPLACE PART OF THE SS PACKAGE ALREADY AND I THINK ANYONE THAT ORDERS A 700+ HP CAR IS GOING TO EXPECT THE EXHAUST AND SOUND TO GO WITH THE CAR.

 

LOOKS GOOD

 

BOBH

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THAT'S SAD---THAT YOU HAD TO REPLACE PART OF THE SS PACKAGE ALREADY AND I THINK ANYONE THAT ORDERS A 700+ HP CAR IS GOING TO EXPECT THE EXHAUST AND SOUND TO GO WITH THE CAR.

 

LOOKS GOOD

 

BOBH

 

NOT TO PUT TO FINE OF A POINT ON IT BUT IF THE JBA IS APPROVED AT SOME POINT IN THE FUTURE WILL THEY THEN MAKE ARRANGEMENTS TO PUT IT ON YOUR CAR AT NO EXPENSE---SINCE YOU ALREADY PAID FOR IT?

 

I WROTE TO JBA AND ASKED THEM WHAT IF ANYTHING THEY ARE DOING ABOUT THIS AND IF THEY ARE WORKING ON IT IS IT A FRONT BURNER TYPE THING AND IF SO AND EVEN IF NOT WHAT IS THERE BEST GUESS FOR A RESOLUTION DATE.

 

NO ANSWER YET

 

BOBH

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NOT TO PUT TO FINE OF A POINT ON IT BUT IF THE JBA IS APPROVED AT SOME POINT IN THE FUTURE WILL THEY THEN MAKE ARRANGEMENTS TO PUT IT ON YOUR CAR AT NO EXPENSE---SINCE YOU ALREADY PAID FOR IT?

 

I WROTE TO JBA AND ASKED THEM WHAT IF ANYTHING THEY ARE DOING ABOUT THIS AND IF THEY ARE WORKING ON IT IS IT A FRONT BURNER TYPE THING AND IF SO AND EVEN IF NOT WHAT IS THERE BEST GUESS FOR A RESOLUTION DATE.

 

NO ANSWER YET

 

BOBH

BOBH,

I think this could best be answered by Amy on her forum. I'd sure like to have it when and if it b becomes available. The prototype SS is unbelievable.

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THAT'S SAD---THAT YOU HAD TO REPLACE PART OF THE SS PACKAGE ALREADY AND I THINK ANYONE THAT ORDERS A 700+ HP CAR IS GOING TO EXPECT THE EXHAUST AND SOUND TO GO WITH THE CAR.

 

LOOKS GOOD

 

BOBH

 

That's pretty depressing. All that money and it sounds so mellow. I planned on not spending much once the package was done. Plus I wanted to keep it original so as not to mess with the authenticity. Heck with that- might go with long tubes and full exhaust now.

As far as the money point that was raised, I agree that there should be a credit towards options provided rather than having to pay more for less. As it is the 700HP option is 4k more for a blower costing only $870 more in the Shelby catalog.(plus you get the one piece driveshaft). I think I will raise this issue with Amy soon, not as a slam of any kind but in search of some honest feedback, and possibly a solution.

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We removed the Borla 14022's that came with the 40th package and reinstalled my FRPP 5GT's. There ain't no comparison. This is what the car should sound like. I love that deep burbley poppy sound when you are downshifting. And these things scream when you get on them.

 

There are a couple of changes since the conversion. Drone is almost gone with the 3.73 gears. You don't get it around town at all and it only kicks in at 1900-2000 at highway speeds which equates to about 55-60 mph, which you can always downshift to 5th to get rid of it for short periods of time. At 65 mph it's out of the drone range. They also replace the axle over pipes for some reason with the conversion and the new ones must be made from a little different grade of stainless as the sound seems deeper and more raspy than before the conversion. Overall, this is good, no it is very good.

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We removed the Borla 14022's that came with the 40th package and reinstalled my FRPP 5GT's. There ain't no comparison. This is what the car should sound like. I love that deep burbley poppy sound when you are downshifting. And these things scream when you get on them.

 

There are a couple of changes since the conversion. Drone is almost gone with the 3.73 gears. You don't get it around town at all and it only kicks in at 1900-2000 at highway speeds which equates to about 55-60 mph, which you can always downshift to 5th to get rid of it for short periods of time. At 65 mph it's out of the drone range. They also replace the axle over pipes for some reason with the conversion and the new ones must be made from a little different grade of stainless as the sound seems deeper and more raspy than before the conversion. Overall, this is good, no it is very good.

 

We need a sound clip. Somebody grab a video camera!!!

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Guys, a couple of things you should know-

 

The driveshaft is very expensive- but necessary to handle all the power. The added cost for the blower does not include the new throttle body we use (nearly $1,000).

 

Also, have you heard the Borla system at WOT??? It is sick!!!

You will love it. There is nothing we can do with the exhaust system until it's approved by the Fed's. We are building the car with the componants that are available. I hope this adds to your understanding!

Chris

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I've had my 40th with 725 HP SuperSnaked KB for a couple weeks now. The Borla that comes with both the 605 and 725 is the same as that which comes on the 40th. It is the Borla 14022 or the "touring oval exhaust". I tried to adovocate, unsuccessfully I might add, to review this decision and at least go with the Borla 140210 for the 725. The 14210 is much more aggressive than the touring Borla. The 14210 is very similar to the old Stinger except with less droon. After two weeks with the touring mufflers, I can't stand it any longer, I will be reinstalling my FRPP 5GT's tomorrow.

 

I was wondering if you could post a video of your 40th exhaust sound before and after you change it. I talked to you at the Florida get together but can't remember the sound of your high HP Shelby. I'm still waiting on mine to be done. Thanks

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:talkhand:

Guys, a couple of things you should know-

 

The driveshaft is very expensive- but necessary to handle all the power. The added cost for the blower does not include the new throttle body we use (nearly $1,000).

 

Also, have you heard the Borla system at WOT??? It is sick!!!

You will love it. There is nothing we can do with the exhaust system until it's approved by the Fed's. We are building the car with the componants that are available. I hope this adds to your understanding!

Chris

 

Thanks Crispy- That explains some of the cost difference. Are you saying that they are in fact working toward exhaust system approval? My last conversation with Doug led me to believe that it is a dead issue for now- but that may be unoffical talk :talkhand: I would like to know for sure where it stands.

Can you put legs on this issue and find out? Doug may just be right although I hope not :cry:

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We need a sound clip. Somebody grab a video camera!!!

 

 

Question, Why are you parking that great looking car in the handicaped parking space reserved for VETs and VIPERs? :hysterical:

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:talkhand:

 

Thanks Crispy- That explains some of the cost difference. Are you saying that they are in fact working toward exhaust system approval? My last conversation with Doug led me to believe that it is a dead issue for now- but that may be unoffical talk :talkhand: I would like to know for sure where it stands.

Can you put legs on this issue and find out? Doug may just be right although I hope not :cry:

 

Well, let me put it this way....if there is no certification, there is no product to install. We cannot help that.

You could look at it this way--

the early cars will be different from the later cars, and this is a distinction. ;)

Glass half empty or glass half full :)

 

edit: This does NOT mean that JBA will get their certification. We have no crystal ball for that. Just want to be clear...

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Crispy,

 

Let me start by saying that I understand and appreciate your (SAI's) efforts and have been in the process with these exhausts from the get go with both the 40th conversion onto the JBA with 725, to the Upgraded Borla with the 725 , to where we are now. In fact, I was told at one point that you had to upgrade to the JBA as it was a requirement for the 725. (Similar to the Single Piece Drive Shaft approach)

 

I was then told that there were two Borla exhausts for the SuperSnakes; one for the 605 and a different Borla for the 725 because the JBA couldn't pass EPA. The 605 folks would have the option to "Upgrade" their exhaust to the 725 Borla. I have had conversations with John Walker, Bud, Adrienne, Cynthia, and personal email to Amy regarding exhaust. The person with the correct answer, at least for now, was Bud. He said from the beginning there was only one muffler for the SS and 40th. He gets to move on to the lightening round.

 

Now, just for the sake of discussion, I'm going to guess that there will be an alternative exhaust/mufflers for the 725 HP at some point in time and perhaps likewise the 625 SuperSnakes than that which is currently installed. It's just a guess, but that leads a question because in your above post, the word "distinction" means different. Which is fine, I'd rather have my car now with the current exhaust than to not have the program moving forward, I'm sure most if not all of us would agree with this.

 

Those ,like me, that are not satisfied with the current exhaust and later change it out to what is currently being offered, will their package be complete or will it be noted that they now have an aftermarket exhaust in the Shelby register even though it is the same exhaust as what is available on other SS's? Did any of that many any sense?

 

I know this may sound silly to some, but many of us are trying to preserve the all Shelby heritage of these programs and this is a concern. I have temporarly fixed my dissappointment in the mufflers by putting my old FRPP 5GTs back on, and they sound great. But long term if something more aggressive is being offered for the SS, I am sure many of us would like to have that and have it documented.

 

http://s262.photobucket.com/albums/ii115/0...FL%20Meet%2008/

 

I believe the above video is of a stock vert. The white coupe is my 40th with 725 HP SuperSnaked KB. This is much better than stock, no question, but not exactly what I was looking for. Who knows, this sound might be exactly what most folks want, which would make my whole hypothetical moot. But, if someone is keeping score, put me know for a more agressive exhaust.

 

Thanks

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Well I have a question then.

 

What exhaust is on the SS that was at the 85th BB?

 

Are headers on that one?

 

I thought that was the 605 package including exhaust that was going to be on the production cars. At least that was what I thought.

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I CONTACTED JBA BY EMAIL AND SPOKE WITH THEM ON THE PHONE AS TO WHAT IF ANYTHING WAS BEING DONE ABOUT THE 735 MANIFOLD BACK ISSUE. THE IMPRESSION I GOT IS THAT NOTHING IS BEING DONE ABOUT IT. THEY SAID THE SYSTEM IS THE SAME AS IT ALWAYS HAS BEEN.

 

THIS IS WHERE I REALLY GET LOST.

 

THEY SAID YOU CAN'T CHANGE MUFFLER OR CATS FOR 6 YEARS ON NEW CARS AS A MANUFACTURE OR YOU GOT TROUBLE WITH THE FEDS.

 

SO WHY WAS THE MANIFOLD BACK SYSTEM PROMOTED AS PART OF THE 735 OPTION?

 

JBA ALSO SAID THEY ARE SELLING TO INDIVIDUALS THAT ARE NOT HAPPY WITH THE BORLA AND ARE RELUCTANTLY REPLACING THEM AND THAT SOME HAVE ASKED FOR THE CAR TO BE SENT BACK TO THEM WITHOUT THE EXHAUST SYSTEM SO THEY CAN JUST ADD THE JBA WHEN THEY GET THE CAR BACK.

 

JBA SAYS IN THE SHELBY CATALOG ON PAGE 10 IS THE JBA-40-2633-1 WHICH IS THE SYSTEM .

 

SO WHAT AM I MISSING HERE

 

BOBH

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I CONTACTED JBA BY EMAIL AND SPOKE WITH THEM ON THE PHONE AS TO WHAT IF ANYTHING WAS BEING DONE ABOUT THE 735 MANIFOLD BACK ISSUE. THE IMPRESSION I GOT IS THAT NOTHING IS BEING DONE ABOUT IT. THEY SAID THE SYSTEM IS THE SAME AS IT ALWAYS HAS BEEN.

 

THIS IS WHERE I REALLY GET LOST.

 

THEY SAID YOU CAN'T CHANGE MUFFLER OR CATS FOR 6 YEARS ON NEW CARS AS A MANUFACTURE OR YOU GOT TROUBLE WITH THE FEDS.

 

SO WHY WAS THE MANIFOLD BACK SYSTEM PROMOTED AS PART OF THE 735 OPTION?

 

JBA ALSO SAID THEY ARE SELLING TO INDIVIDUALS THAT ARE NOT HAPPY WITH THE BORLA AND ARE RELUCTANTLY REPLACING THEM AND THAT SOME HAVE ASKED FOR THE CAR TO BE SENT BACK TO THEM WITHOUT THE EXHAUST SYSTEM SO THEY CAN JUST ADD THE JBA WHEN THEY GET THE CAR BACK.

 

JBA SAYS IN THE SHELBY CATALOG ON PAGE 10 IS THE JBA-40-2633-1 WHICH IS THE SYSTEM .

 

SO WHAT AM I MISSING HERE

 

BOBH

SAI cant put on anything thats not 50 state legal. Here in the part of GA that Im in we dont have emissons test, so we can run ANYTHING we want. So I can order the JBL and put it on with NO problem. Im not going to have a warranty so if I dont like the sound Im going to start looking at "off road use only" exhaust. Does that make sense Bob? I guess what Im saying is yes its availble for SPP, but SAI cant install it if its not 50 state legal. I LOVE GA!!!

michael morris

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