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ilmor

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I think this is simple, dealers thought the Shelby GT was going to bring the same ADM's or close to the same as the GT500. I can tell you the one I bought 2 days ago had a Market Adjustment of $3000. I offered X-plan minus $1000 rebate. That was over a month ago, they just called me 3 days ago and took my offer. Worked out in my favor because I got the 0% financing. I checked 3 other dealers in my area, none would take x-plan. One had 4 Shelby GT's and bought them and had them shipped from dealers all over the place, he is going to lose money.

 

Remember the Thunderbird???????????? ADM's drove that thing out of production.

 

How about the 2004 Mach 1????????? ADM's and then they could not give them away. At the end they were offering $3000 rebate plus 0% for 60-72 months.

 

How about Chevy with the new Vette in 2005, ADM's and a year later rebates out the a$$. Z06's are going for 10k under MSRP.

 

I am really surprised the GT500 has lasted this long, not until recently can you find MSRP.

 

My opinion is if most dealers would have sold the Shelby GT's for MSRP or allowed the Ford Plans to be honored they would be very few left. You still some on ebay trying to get over MSRP, pretty funny.

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You asked for my opinion so I will give it. The Shelby GT is $3-4K overpriced for what you get. Nothing new from me as I've said it many times before. Car should have started in the low $30Ks vice mid $30Ks.

 

Plus the EPA test failure added that $1K GGT. That really hurt because the car passed the test the 1st time.

 

Also 19hp just doesn't sound like much psychologically. The original estimate of 325HP just sounded so much better, even though it's only 6hp.

 

Understand that it costs more to ship cars out to Las Vegas to mod, but when you compare the price of a SGT to the Bullitt (comparable performance), you see how much cheaper it can be done in house.

 

Agree with other comments on lack of advertizing and initial ADMs hurt.

 

With Ford factory and MM offered incentives back in Nov, I got a great deal on my 08, and it was worth it to me personally, but I'm really a niche buyer. Probably not 8962 other niche buyers out there for a GT-H or SGT even with these incentives.

 

Long term I'm not too concerned that this reflects negatively on the Shelby GT. Ford wasn't able to sell anywhere near the initial estimates on the 1968 California Special, but now they are pretty desirable.

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You asked for my opinion so I will give it. The Shelby GT is $3-4K overpriced for what you get. Nothing new from me as I've said it many times before. Car should have started in the low $30Ks vice mid $30Ks.

 

Plus the EPA test failure added that $1K GGT. That really hurt because the car passed the test the 1st time.

 

Also 19hp just doesn't sound like much psychologically. The original estimate of 325HP just sounded so much better, even though it's only 6hp.

 

Understand that it costs more to ship cars out to Las Vegas to mod, but when you compare the price of a SGT to the Bullitt (comparable performance), you see how much cheaper it can be done in house.

 

Agree with other comments on lack of advertizing and initial ADMs hurt.

 

With Ford factory and MM offered incentives back in Nov, I got a great deal on my 08, and it was worth it to me personally, but I'm really a niche buyer. Probably not 8962 other niche buyers out there for a GT-H or SGT even with these incentives.

 

Long term I'm not too concerned that this reflects negatively on the Shelby GT. Ford wasn't able to sell anywhere near the initial estimates on the 1968 California Special, but now they are pretty desirable.

 

 

I also agree the price is steep for what you get, but I knew that when I bought. I think the price difference between the Shelby GT and Mustang GT with the same options added should easily be made up plus some in resale down the road. Maybe not the next year or so, but I do not intend to sell any time soon. I do not mind the slow down in production at all, makes our cars rare. Mustangs are everywhere, I might see a Shelby once every 3 months.

 

I also agree Ford did not advertise these at all.

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I paid 34,400. for my SGT last August, and it's worth every penny of it. I love this car, and now (according to THIS thread), I can get 500 HP to the wheels with a simple bolt on blower kit.

 

http://forum.shelbyautos.com/index.php?showtopic=3590&hl=

 

 

 

Again...your dealer took a HUGE hit on that deal. They needed to pay $7.3K to SAI, leaving 26K, not even close to what your car's base was unless you have no options other than the 54U.

 

BTW!

 

I think it's all BS...I can sell just my two side emblems and my hood scoop and make $1200 based upon ebay prices.

 

Please...this was a great deal!

:)

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It looks like the '08 goes for more.

 

The MSRP for the base car for my BJ convertible GT 5-speed is 31845. Options and delivery take it to 35795.

 

The Shelby package is now 10,800, BJ package 1250, CSCF donation 250 and GG surchange of 1000 brings the Shelby adds to $13,300...

 

Total = 49095.

 

The automatic adds 545.

 

He sent me coupe sheets (in case I wanted to buy one of them). Base price is 27020, so the conv adds about 4800.

 

By the way, if you price one at the Ford racing/specialty you get exactly these prices. No secrets.

 

Totally unrelated, I watched Bullitt this afternoon. The car chase scene bounced all over SF. The transporter must have moved them around alot). Does the end of the chase scene turn into a morality play - (Ford) Mustang over the (Dodge) Charger? :-)

 

Cheers,

Tony

 

(By the way, I don't have a sig yet. I'm noodling on how to pose the two cars to take the picture. Some scene with the Rockies with snow and the cars parked at an angle. Gotta work on it.)

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Again...your dealer took a HUGE hit on that deal. They needed to pay $7.3K to SAI, leaving 26K, not even close to what your car's base was unless you have no options other than the 54U.

 

BTW!

 

I think it's all BS...I can sell just my two side emblems and my hood scoop and make $1200 based upon ebay prices.

 

Please...this was a great deal!

:)

 

I know he didn't make a lot of money on the deal, but he doesn't believe in ADM fees and surcharges. Also, he felt he was stuck with the car too. A sports car like the SGT in the corn belt, on a lot full of pick-ups and dump trucks, go figure.

 

I have the IUP and Shaker 500 audio, I don't think there were many other options at that time. I've read others here who mention NAV, but I didn't see that in the brochures the dealer gave me. If I had known, I would have asked for a dealer install. I got the Sirius too, but never use it.

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Personally, I think the SGT is a great car for the money (I paid $37.8K). Again, all the value is not in the horsepower; I don't know why so many people focus solely on the horsepower number. Heck, I haven't been able to fully use the 319 hp that I have.

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I think I got a good deal at 36K for mine in early September, had to drive 800 miles back up north to get it tho. At the time I thought it was a great deal considering the local guy wanted 44K for the same thing. The difference between this and a mustang GT is HUGE if you ask me and was well worth the extra cash. I agree tho ford needs to move these cars with the Challenger and Camaro coming out all in the same price range and bringing over 400HP. Sticker for the Challenger is $37,320 for the SRT8 model and don't know the camaro off hand but it should be about the same.

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You asked for my opinion so I will give it. The Shelby GT is $3-4K overpriced for what you get. Nothing new from me as I've said it many times before. Car should have started in the low $30Ks vice mid $30Ks.

 

Plus the EPA test failure added that $1K GGT. That really hurt because the car passed the test the 1st time.

 

Also 19hp just doesn't sound like much psychologically. The original estimate of 325HP just sounded so much better, even though it's only 6hp.

 

Understand that it costs more to ship cars out to Las Vegas to mod, but when you compare the price of a SGT to the Bullitt (comparable performance), you see how much cheaper it can be done in house.

 

Agree with other comments on lack of advertizing and initial ADMs hurt.

 

With Ford factory and MM offered incentives back in Nov, I got a great deal on my 08, and it was worth it to me personally, but I'm really a niche buyer. Probably not 8962 other niche buyers out there for a GT-H or SGT even with these incentives.

 

Long term I'm not too concerned that this reflects negatively on the Shelby GT. Ford wasn't able to sell anywhere near the initial estimates on the 1968 California Special, but now they are pretty desirable.

 

 

Now you see what I have been talking about the is whole entire time, 319 HP over a stock GT is just not the ticket. Yes extremely nice looking car the SGT is BUT it is over priced by about 3-4K easily. People who buy these cars will look harder at the new and soon "improved " version of this car when Shelby decides to do another one. They won't be so Shelby nuts the next time, "Mark" my words. Also the lack of advertising and ADM's drove this car to be looked at under a microscope and once that was done they started to see the HP difference and that killed it. However if someone wants to install the Paxon SC they'll be happy but then they might as well buy the GT500 as the cost is about the same except no warranty! Yes a quandry but what are you going to do now.

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Regarding the Paxon SC, it might end up costing as much as a GT500, but it will never weigh that much. I thought about the GT500, but I like handling as much as, if not more, than straight line speed. That is why my decision turned to Shelby GT or Roush.

 

 

+1 - plus, I think the Shelby GT is just so much better looking...but I know that's a matter of personal taste. I'm not sure exactly why that is; may be a combination of things.

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Regarding the Paxon SC, it might end up costing as much as a GT500, but it will never weigh that much. I thought about the GT500, but I like handling as much as, if not more, than straight line speed. That is why my decision turned to Shelby GT or Roush.

 

Not really. Added weight of either blower (and accessories) is about the same, 120-130 pounds to the nose of the car. Not enough to require any changes in spring/shock rates. But, the GT 500 is a 5.4L-4V too, and this engine weighs a tad more than the 4.6L-3V. This combined weight is still not enough to change anything else, but you may want to recalculate your front suspension alignment.

 

If you can change out a spark plug, you can install a Paxton/Novi kit yourself. The kit should run about 5200 bucks, and if self installed, then there's only dyno and professional tuner time, and an aftermarket hand held programmer to consider. Add it all up and you're still under 6K if you shop smartly.

 

It would take a lot more than 6K to bring the SGT to GT 500 performance watermarks, unless you're as lucky as Hypersurf1.

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There is a much larger weight difference than that, cast iron block (GT500) vs. aluminum block (SGT). Even with the SC, the SGT will always be lighter in the nose.

 

 

I think I read somewhere that the 5.4 is 96 lbs. heavier than the 4.6. I'm sure someone here can confirm. I talking about the engines only, not the entire car.

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Not really. Added weight of either blower (and accessories) is about the same, 120-130 pounds to the nose of the car. Not enough to require any changes in spring/shock rates. But, the GT 500 is a 5.4L-4V too, and this engine weighs a tad more than the 4.6L-3V. This combined weight is still not enough to change anything else, but you may want to recalculate your front suspension alignment.

 

If you can change out a spark plug, you can install a Paxton/Novi kit yourself. The kit should run about 5200 bucks, and if self installed, then there's only dyno and professional tuner time, and an aftermarket hand held programmer to consider. Add it all up and you're still under 6K if you shop smartly.

 

It would take a lot more than 6K to bring the SGT to GT 500 performance watermarks, unless you're as lucky as Hypersurf1.

 

 

Lulu,

 

you are way off. i only paid 4000 for my paxton HO kit. :)

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Well, as for the SGT vs GT-500 debate, the GT-500 is heavier, but they gave us a base HP rating of 500 ponies to compensate for the weight disadvantage. A few quick mods and we're pushing close to 600 HP.

 

While i love my GT-500, i really think the SGT is a sharp car. They did a great job on the suspension and the car is unique. Here's where i believe they failed.

 

1. "Marketing": Definately not enough publicity. This car "should" be flying off the showroom floor.

2. HP rating: They should've made this a 375 HP car as a base. Hey, this is a special car.

3. Badging: Why SGT? Why not "GT-350"?

 

If they made this a 375 HP car with GT-350 badging, and advertised it, it would be a hot seller. I think it would be more sought after than the GT-500.

 

If i had extra dough, i would pick up an '08 SGT without hesitation. On the bright side, the SGT's are more rare now.

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+1 - plus, I think the Shelby GT is just so much better looking...but I know that's a matter of personal taste. I'm not sure exactly why that is; may be a combination of things.

 

 

I find it interesting that the 500 and the GT seem to have totally different target audiences. It does remind me somewhat of the old days the small block GT350's were always the more balanced cars and the big block 500's were the brute force american approach. I like both approaches and the GT with the blower is me trying to have my cake and eat it to :)

 

The cars are very over priced IMHO but I knew this going in, HOT ROD said you could build one for $2600.00 over the cost of the GT. Since everything on our cars is over the counter available from FRPP its kind difficult to see it any other way. In the end I thought that I was buying in to some exclusivity by going Shelby rather then building my own car. I must say I love my Shelby but I'm in it enough that I could have bought a C6 which is technically alot more car.

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Well, as for the SGT vs GT-500 debate, the GT-500 is heavier, but they gave us a base HP rating of 500 ponies to compensate for the weight disadvantage. A few quick mods and we're pushing close to 600 HP.

 

While i love my GT-500, i really think the SGT is a sharp car. They did a great job on the suspension and the car is unique. Here's where i believe they failed.

 

1. "Marketing": Definately not enough publicity. This car "should" be flying off the showroom floor.

2. HP rating: They should've made this a 375 HP car as a base. Hey, this is a special car.

3. Badging: Why SGT? Why not "GT-350"?

 

If they made this a 375 HP car with GT-350 badging, and advertised it, it would be a hot seller. I think it would be more sought after than the GT-500.

 

If i had extra dough, i would pick up an '08 SGT without hesitation. On the bright side, the SGT's are more rare now.

 

+1, but I would have been happy with 350 hp. The car handles great, but there is just something pshchologically depressing about 319...even if this is more than enough to get really silly in 2nd gear.

 

If I could find simple bolt-ons to pick up 29 honest horsepower, I'd do it quick and be proud to claim 350 at the crank. For the money that would be needed to pick up the multiple goodies required to do this, I'd rather spend a little more and drop a SC in it. Maybe this is why nothing was really done to bump it up at SAI...

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I posted the following on Team Shelby site. Just my .02.

 

Couple of thoughts I haven't seen already mentioned. Basically the cars are not born the same, the SGT is created from a much smaller company. Now don't get me wrong. I own a SGT but I would love to own a GT500 just as well. They are both Shelbys, just different. But the way the car is created contributed to the glut of SGTs.

 

Advertising:

I agree will every ones comments that the SGT suffered from lack of advertising. But I can't really blame Ford for not advertising it. The company that creates the car is the company that advertises the cars. This is one of the areas that really separates the SGT from the GT500. Ford builds the GT500, Ford advertises their cars, they have a much deeper pocket to advertise the GT500. The GT500 is a status car that can help sells their bread and butter GT and V6 Mustangs. But the SGT is a Shelby creation (of course with Fords help), a car that competes with Fords other mustangs. SAI is a small company that just can not spend millions trying to sell 6000 cars. Shelby seems to rely on car magazine reviews to advertise their cars. I just can't see what justification Ford could come up to advertise another company's cars, yes, they are both Shelbys, but they are created by two different companies. And I just can't see SAI spending millions on advertising its very limited edition cars. Like it or not, small companies just can't compete with big blue oval in advertising.

 

Late 2007 models:

Shelby pushed out a lot of 2007 cars to dealers very late in the 2007 model year. It took time for SAI to gear up to crank out 6000 cars. It took months from order to delivery. Personally, I think it was a mistake to make 6000 cars in the first year (2007) but I believe it was Ford that was pushing that number. It makes sense that Ford would set a minimum order size, the volume had to be enough to make it worth it to Ford...and even 6000 cars barely makes a dent in Fords volume. I thought I also read that Ford wanted every Ford dealer (approx 3700+) to have a chance to sell the Shelby. The extra time SAI needed to convert 2007 mustangs to Shelbys was just too long and too late.

 

The cars will sell, they are great deals for those folks that have been waiting on the fence.

 

 

 

Sorry, had to post this GT500 owner reply to my .02 post....I'm going to miss our ShelbyAutos forum. :)

 

Sorry, but this car was created by Ford. Ford was going to produce it themselves, but after it would take 3 years to gear up to produce it they let SAI do it because they said they could be ready in 6 months.

 

The mustang is built by Ford. Most of the parts installed at SAI are Ford racing parts. Ford makes all the money on these mustangs. So they are Ford's cars that were built at Ford and then shipped to SAI. All the cost to ship them was built into the $7,390 cost. So Ford isn't out any extra cost here. They could have easily advertised this car.

 

The KR is going to be shipped to SAI as well, yet Ford has had no problem with promoting this so far! They are building only a 1000. They have given more press on this car than the SGT.

 

 

 

Hey, even you got to admit that the SGT is no KR. The KR is another status car that helps sales of all mustangs. The SGT competes with other Ford products...such as upcoming Bullet. We haven't seen how much advertising Ford will do for 1000 cars but if they do...it is because its the "King of the Road"....it could maybe pump up GT500 sales.

 

On your other point...they are both Fords and Shelbys...lets not go there. I'm just saying the advertisement falls on SAI because the SGT is considered a product of SAI and the GT500 is a product out of Ford. I agree with you that the cars is originally built by Ford, shipped to SAI, parts are Ford racing etc....nobody disagrees with you there. I never said Ford lost any money...but there is less than 6000 cars. Do you see Ford advertising Roush, or Saleen, or any one of a dozen other post Ford mustangs. Yes, Ford makes money off these, and maybe the "partnership" is stronger with SAI that other mustang offerings, but IMO, the advertising falls on the company creating it....SAI. SAI pitched the idea of the SGT to Ford. I don't fault SAI or Ford, it just the way it is. Low volume cars just will not support a lot of advertisement. We shouldn't expect it.

 

Just how much do you think Ford (or SAI) should of spend per car??? $50? $500? $5,000? more? How many commercials should they have ran to make a difference for the SGT? 20? 50? 500? more?

 

Network TV: A 30-second spot in prime time ranges from $80,000 to $600,000, depending on how high a show is rated and the show's genre. The average is $120,000 to $140,000. This does not include the cost to make the spot. I must of seen the GT500 commercial at least 20-30 times. I know I didn't catch everyone.

 

Now a better comparison would be the Bullet mustang. How much will Ford advertise it? I'm guessing not much. Its another low volume car (maybe 1 year, 7700 cars). But it is created 100% in house by Ford...don't know. Will be interesting to see how they sell...but I'm willing to guess that Ford won't flood the market with a shipment of 2008 Bullets just before the 2009 are released.

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+1 - plus, I think the Shelby GT is just so much better looking...but I know that's a matter of personal taste. I'm not sure exactly why that is; may be a combination of things.

 

Looks was what sold me on it.

 

As far as SAI is concerned, they sold every 2007 Shelby with minimal advertizing (sold them to the dealers). Obviously it's the dealers that could benefit from more advertizing as they are the ones stuck with the cars.

 

Based on this experience, the next time a SAI product comes out (e.g. GT 350), dealers may be more hesistant to purchase.

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I agree with most of the points. Especially lack of advertising and rated horsepower. I would like to emphasize one thing that was touched on. That is the name. Shelby GT500 strikes a chord with people. Even people who aren't Mustang enthusiast have heard of a GT500. Like wise they have heard of a GT350.

 

They haven't heard of a Shelby GT. It has no pedigree. It is all well and good to say it has the heart or the DNA of a 66 GT350 but it doesn't have that magical name. I think if it had the GT350 name, maybe 350 HP and the proper colors they really would be sold out and we would be moaning about having to pay for the ADMs.

 

I for one am happy to have mine; bought at MSRP and then beefed up and personalized for what I was going to have to pay for a stock GT500.

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Looks was what sold me on it.

 

As far as SAI is concerned, they sold every 2007 Shelby with minimal advertising (sold them to the dealers). Obviously it's the dealers that could benefit from more advertising as they are the ones stuck with the cars.

 

 

You are absolutely right. Good point. If anyone should be complaining about advertising...it should be the dealers.

 

2. HP rating: They should've made this a 375 HP car as a base. Hey, this is a special car.

 

 

Agree, more hp is nice and a very special car to SAI and to us. But we got to keep in mind that the SGT was created to be a quick response to the public demand for a GT-H rated at 325 hp. It was not created to be a "GT-350". Amy has said any new GT-350 (if created) would have to be around 400+ hp. I think it would have taken more time to create the "GT-350" that many of us think a GT-350 should be. Also, keeping the base car at 319 hp made the car more affordable. I can't see SAI creating cheaper Mustangs. And they did give owners hp options all the way to GT500 levels. Of course this was another secret many dealers did not know.

 

3. Badging: Why SGT? Why not "GT-350"?

 

 

I believe they badge it as a SGT to preserve the "GT-350" name for that future 400+ hp GT-350. I would be surprise if a GT-350 is not created someday.

 

I agree with most of the points. Especially lack of advertising and rated horsepower. I would like to emphasize one thing that was touched on. That is the name. Shelby GT500 strikes a chord with people. Even people who aren't Mustang enthusiast have heard of a GT500. Like wise they have heard of a GT350.

 

They haven't heard of a Shelby GT. It has no pedigree. It is all well and good to say it has the heart or the DNA of a 66 GT350 but it doesn't have that magical name. I think if it had the GT350 name, maybe 350 HP and the proper colors they really would be sold out and we would be moaning about having to pay for the ADMs.

 

I for one am happy to have mine; bought at MSRP and then beefed up and personalized for what I was going to have to pay for a stock GT500.

 

 

Another good point....I like this site so much....going to miss it.

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Again...your dealer took a HUGE hit on that deal. They needed to pay $7.3K to SAI, leaving 26K, not even close to what your car's base was unless you have no options other than the 54U.

 

BTW!

 

I think it's all BS...I can sell just my two side emblems and my hood scoop and make $1200 based upon ebay prices.

 

Please...this was a great deal!

:)

 

 

I agree hole heartedly...

 

Maybe some of us need to check out the prices for Shelbys of old (especially those out of LA) are going for?

 

If one would take a minute to peruse through the lastest copy of "Mustang Milestones, Collector Edition,

or the 2007 Shelby Mag, one would find that no other car appreciates in value long-term like a Shelby does.

 

I'm not saying that anyone should buy one soley just for investment purpose as I do plan to enjoy driving mine some...

 

But lets face the facts here... THE NUMBERS DO NOT LIE!!!

 

A 1968 Shelby GT 350 originally cost about somewhere in the neighborhood of $5500... today a #1 would

cost about $75,000 for one with substantion mileage.

 

Granted although production numbers were much lower around 1,253 cars, having said that, even a entry level standard 1968 Mustang (63A) fastback with a production number around 33,585 will still set you back

approx $27k.

 

A 1965 Shelby GT restored to #1 still pulls $300K and at one point, a few months back the average was $350K.

 

Remember, classic Mustangs appreciate well... Classic Shelbys will eventually shoot up in price like rockets.

 

You're not just buying a car... your paying into the exclusiveness of the car based on it's rarity as a result of low production numbers as well as the history behind it.

 

When's the last time you saw a Shelby around town? SHELBY CARS STOP TRAFFIC!!!

 

Yes there is a premium on Shelbys... but remember, we're talkin about a car manufactured at SAI...

by an American Icon, e.g. Mr. Shelby's cars took down Ferraris.

 

http://thecobraferrariwars.com/

 

In about 10 years they will begin to shoot up and within 20 years these cars will be worth at minimum, 2x-4x what the current MSRP is today depending on milage and overall condition.

 

Remember all American Car Manufacturer's overall sales are in the toilet, especially on vehicles with 300+ HP.

 

Given that there were over 7000 Shebly GT(s) made in 2007... and the fact that there are only 1,669 left...

I'd venture to say I'm not the only one doing the math here and it would seem to me that they are selling like hot cakes.

 

If you want to move in Shelby circles... you have to be willing to pay a little premium to play.

 

The cars are actually selling at a bargain prices due to the current state of the economy.

 

R/ J

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