TCS or no TCS.... that is the question

[BoneDoc]

those of us lucky enough to be getting the GT500 will be the flagbearers for mustang on the street....

 

after all, this is the most powerful mustang ever built. we all need to be on the top of our games on the street to contnue uphold the reputation that mustang and shelby have built over the years. so I need a little advice.

 

Most of us do not drag at the 1/4 mile strip on a regular basis....

 

for those of us who don't... are'nt we generally quicker with TCS on? i used to street drag quite a bit with my 69 Mach I 428SCJ and my '87 5.0 Liter.... didn't lose many, but when i did it was generally a traction issue and not a HP/torque issue. smoking the tires off the line. Too excited and anxious to get down the street in a hurry! The '69 is extremely front heavy which accounts for some of that issue....

 

questions:

 

1- is there a "button" in the GT500 that will turn the TCS off/on?

2- do you think the average driver of a GT500 would be quicker with the TCS on or off?

 

thanks in advance.

I know we have a number of serious racers on this site. looking forward to your comments

[ratnacage]

Good question, but I think most people have been out on vacation lately...not much going on.

 

 

the "average" driver would probably be better off with it on especially on the street, but there is the potential of losing about 1/2 sec if you're really on your game.

[Guest evilchris]

There is a "TCS" button in the center stack on the top right.

 

I can drive s197's quicker with it off.

 

Keep in mind too that althought this is the most powerful STOCK Mustang, it is by far not the most powerful stang on the street. There are many 600 RWHP terminators and Fox's out there bearing the rep just fine =)

[JETSOLVER]

the "average" driver would probably be better off with it on especially on the street, but there is the potential of losing about 1/2 sec if you're really on your game.

 

Folks you owe it to your family to find a drag strip on a street legal night or a very quiet street, very far away from ANYBODY else, and you owe it to the reputation of the car to practice. As there is no footage of the car as yet, I present for comparison two video's. The first is a bone stock Stang GT vs a bone stock GT on a strip. Note that even though the stang leaves way first the GT easily reels it in. And note that that is a low 11 second time. Not what you should expect from your car or yourself without some practice AND some parts. 05 Stang GT vs. GT The second should put into perspective any trash talking one wants to engage in. This is illegal(legal disclaimer) but it demonstrates how a well driven car(C6 ZO6 with a tune and a CAI), can pretty handily beat a car which, by the numbers, should handle it easily. Note the numbers on the Z06 folks. That is what the GT500 should make. Ford GT stock vs. C6 Z06 with tune and CAI Please I don't want to debate the production values; I'm just trying to prevent carnage, both to people and street cred.

[Guest evilchris]

Folks you owe it to your family to find a drag strip on a street legal night or a very quiet street, very far away from ANYBODY else, and you owe it to the reputation of the car to practice. As there is no footage of the car as yet, I present for comparison two video's. The first is a bone stock Stang GT vs a bone stock GT on a strip. Note that even though the stang leaves way first the GT easily reels it in. And note that that is a low 11 second time. Not what you should expect from your car or yourself without some practice AND some parts. 05 Stang GT vs. GT The second should put into perspective any trash talking one wants to engage in. This is illegal(legal disclaimer) but it demonstrates how a well driven car(C6 ZO6 with a tune and a CAI), can pretty handily beat a car which, by the numbers, should handle it easily. Note the numbers on the Z06 folks. That is what the GT500 should make. Ford GT stock vs. C6 Z06 with tune and CAI Please I don't want to debate the production values; I'm just trying to prevent carnage, both to people and street cred.

 

 

The thing here though is, the Z06 and Ford GT are roughly the same weight. A well driven GT500 making the same numbers as a poorly driven C6 Z06 will still result in the Z06 eating it alive after launch. 700 lbs makes a gigantic difference.

[RUFDRAFT]

Like Chris said - it's the most powerful Factory Built Mustang - but not the fastest Mustang on the street.

 

I'm putting together a Mustang GT that should give you all you want, doc!

 

Oh - leave your TCS on if you like - I don't need it - and never have.

 

And - a big part of the racing dynamic is the driver.

 

The Z06 and the GT should have done that at the dragstrip.

 

Time slips settle things - not "let's go on three horn honkings!" :happy feet:

 

That shit is for Preludes with Dyson mufflers and NOS.

[kaylan1521]

First and foremost the track is where it's at.

 

Now, having said that I like every other Mustang owner has taken it through the gears on the street and my experience has been to turn off the TC and practice slipping the clutch and working the throttle together.

[cobra8u]

Like Chris said - it's the most powerful Factory Built Mustang - but not the fastest Mustang on the street.

 

I'm putting together a Mustang GT that should give you all you want, doc!

 

Oh - leave your TCS on if you like - I don't need it - and never have.

 

And - a big part of the racing dynamic is the driver.

 

The Z06 and the GT should have done that at the dragstrip.

 

Time slips settle things - not "let's go on three horn honkings!" :happy feet:

 

That shit is for Preludes with Dyson mufflers and NOS.

 

 

 

 

 

 

But, the Shelby IS the most powerful Mustang ever offered from Ford and with a few minor mods will stomp any modded Mustang GT and it will still be a SHELBY, and niether one of us knows the guy with the fastest Mustang on the street.

 

[wildosvt]

"from a roll" is the most GHEY form of racing! Let the lights tell you when to go.

 

With reports of the TCS not bogging down the engine, You may be fine with it on. With my 04 Term its switched off when im feeling sausay!

 

We will only know if wether its good or not til we get our cars (or those who have them beat them up a bit)

[RUFDRAFT]

Stomp?

 

sure - yeah - you're right - have a great day.

[Guest evilchris]

Stomp any? That's a BAD opinion.

 

A modded Mustang GT can smoke a modded GT500, just depends on the mods. Anyone who thinks a certain car "can never be beat" is an idiot with no experience in racing. Every car gets beat. I'd wager 90% of the terminators out there are faster than GT500's.

[BoneDoc]

thanks for all the comments. sounds like most experienced drivers turn it off?

 

I'll have to play with the car a bit when i get it and get the feel. I'm pretty good at modulating power through the clutch... I just get a little excited on the line at times..... call it "premature e-smoke-ulation"

 

i realize that GT500 is the most powerful.... but not necessarily the fastest. and i realize that there are a lot of "sleepers" out there with mods. But many people see this car as the car to beat in the new wave of muscle cars....especially with charger and camaro making a run. Ford has set the bar. others will be gunning for us. make no mistake about it.

[Guest evilchris]

thanks for all the comments. sounds like most experienced drivers turn it off?

 

I'll have to play with the car a bit when i get it and get the feel. I'm pretty good at modulating power through the clutch... I just get a little excited on the line at times..... call it "premature e-smoke-ulation"

 

i realize that GT500 is the most powerful.... but not necessarily the fastest. and i realize that there are a lot of "sleepers" out there with mods. But many people see this car as the car to beat in the new wave of muscle cars....especially with charger and camaro making a run. Ford has set the bar. others will be gunning for us. make no mistake about it.

 

 

Please remember, Ford set the bar in 2003 with the Terminator Cobra. This is a not a "new" thing. The SRT8 Charger cannot even DREAM of touching a STOCK 03/04 Cobra.

[RUFDRAFT]

"premature e-smoke-ulation" ??

 

Time for bed, Doc!

 

Toss a couple of Viagras in the tank if you see me in your mirrors.

[flattusmaximus78]

First off you want your traction control on if you race from a dig... well that atleast goes for the current gt. The current gt has the independent rear suspension so if one tire sits spinning the other one will to. For the gt500 I'm not quite sure.

 

And I don't agree that the trac is the only way to settle a race. Go from a light not a roll and that tells you what your car has.You want reaction time? Try staging a green light!

 

Please remember, Ford set the bar in 2003 with the Terminator Cobra. This is a not a "new" thing. The SRT8 Charger cannot even DREAM of touching a STOCK 03/04 Cobra.

 

Damn straight! Even if the charger has the extra 35 horse's. Same for the gto.

[Guest evilchris]

First off you want your traction control on if you race from a dig... well that atleast goes for the current gt. The current gt has the independent rear suspension so if one tire sits spinning the other one will to. For the gt500 I'm not quite sure.

 

 

 

 

The Mustang GT doesn't have IRS, it has a live rear axle like the GT500.

[mach1fever]

Well until you get a feel for the car go with the tcs. It is a lot less restrictive than the past versions where you have to turn it off to turn a decent time. Evan got a 12.2 without it and 12.60's the two times he ran with it on. Its a much improved system and until you get really comfortable would run with it on. Oh and post a video of your hijinks please.

 

Roger

[wildosvt]

The Mustang GT doesn't have IRS, it has a live rear axle like the GT500.

 

 

 

He was speaking of the Ford GT.

 

And a STOCK Term wont handle a STOCK GT500.

 

You know a topic has gone to hell when we start comparing mod'ed vs. stock cars.....

 

 

A mod'ed GT500 will EAT a Ford GT!

[Guest evilchris]

He was speaking of the Ford GT.

 

And a STOCK Term wont handle a STOCK GT500.

 

You know a topic has gone to hell when we start comparing mod'ed vs. stock cars.....

A mod'ed GT500 will EAT a Ford GT!

 

 

If you'd read the posts in order you'd see the argument was being made against people who think "no Mustang GT could ever beat a GT500 regardless of mods"

[68fastback]

those of us lucky enough to be getting the GT500 will be the flagbearers for mustang on the street....

 

after all, this is the most powerful mustang ever built. we all need to be on the top of our games on the street to contnue uphold the reputation that mustang and shelby have built over the years. so I need a little advice.

 

Most of us do not drag at the 1/4 mile strip on a regular basis....

 

for those of us who don't... are'nt we generally quicker with TCS on? i used to street drag quite a bit with my 69 Mach I 428SCJ and my '87 5.0 Liter.... didn't lose many, but when i did it was generally a traction issue and not a HP/torque issue. smoking the tires off the line. Too excited and anxious to get down the street in a hurry! The '69 is extremely front heavy which accounts for some of that issue....

 

questions:

 

1- is there a "button" in the GT500 that will turn the TCS off/on?

2- do you think the average driver of a GT500 would be quicker with the TCS on or off?

 

thanks in advance.

I know we have a number of serious racers on this site. looking forward to your comments

 

 

 

Doc, I don't know if it's a button or not but with traction control on there's a special launch feature, I've read, on the GT500. With the wheel straight, you bring the revs to 3,400 (I believe) and dump the clutch. The computer recognizes this and uses a special program to manage the launch. I've read you're pretty much assured 0-60 in 4.5-4.6 with stock tires assuming a reasonable road surface.

-Dan

 

<edit:> Having said that, the fun is all in learning how to launch that puppy with the TCS off. On my '01 Cobra I could beat TCS with practice, but the special mode on the GT500, while harder to beat with finesse, still won't be as much fun

[RUFDRAFT]

Maybe I didn't make myself clear on the TCS issue.

 

I don't care if using TCS assures me of a quicker launch.

 

Technology is creeping further and further into my life.

 

I WANT to be responsible for controlling how I drive.

 

If I don't launch properly - I'll get better.

 

Why don't I use voice-recognition software in my word processor? So I WON'T FORGET HOW TO TYPE!

 

Sorry.

 

I'll handle the traction issues in my ride as long as I can.

 

If you beat me - you've beaten ME - not my flippin' computer.

 

Thanks!

[68fastback]

Maybe I didn't make myself clear on the TCS issue.

 

I don't care if using TCS assures me of a quicker launch.

 

Technology is creeping further and further into my life.

 

I WANT to be responsible for controlling how I drive.

 

If I don't launch properly - I'll get better.

 

 

Thanks!

 

 

Amen, my bro! But let's leave the tripple synchros and two-stage rev-limiter operable, OK?

 

 

 

Why don't I use voice-recognition software in my word processor? So I WON'T FORGET HOW TO TYPE!

 

 

 

We'll that explains a lot <couldn't resist>

[iluvmyshelby]

i have my Shelby, but as some of you know im still in Iraq waiting to go home, so im the one person that has a car but the car does not have me, LOL

 

1. yes there is a button to shut the tcs off, and when you hit it lights up with the word OFF

2. it all depends on the driver, but you asked about the average driver, so i would say with the TCS on because of the hole shot.

 

when you first start the car, the tcs is ON, you have to hit the switch to shut it off, now if its anything like the Mach's were, it may have a rev limiter on it. but like others have said you can leave it alone from when you first start the car, and you can launch at 3,200 rpms and the computer will do the rest. you will get some lag out of it that way, with it off you will be straight on the pavement, with the tires screaming. but you can loose traction, and a loss of traction is a loss of seconds on the track. so you have to learn your car and your abilities of how YOU launch at that track. i usually shut the traction control off to light up the tires to get them warm. But that was in my Mach, now im not 100% sure how it will be with the Shelby, my wife said it still peels tire with the tcs on, so it must be different then the mach's. in the mach it would studder because of the rev limiter. But good luck and all it takes is practice!!!!!

 

the TCS is beside the Hazard Light Switch. Hope this Helps you some.

[cobra8u]

If you'd read the posts in order you'd see the argument was being made against people who think "no Mustang GT could ever beat a GT500 regardless of mods"

 

 

 

Chris,

I don't think the the point is that a Mustang GT with mods can't beat a stock Shebly, because it could happen. My point is that with a very few mods the Shelby will be would be way ahead of it. I just don't see the average GT with mods, even with a blower, hitting 11's. But I think most Shelbys will with only a tune, gears and DR's. A couple of months will tell.

 

Fuf,

Didn't mean to ruin your day, maybe stomp was the wrong word, OK probably was the wrong word. Anyway you know what they say about opions, but thanks for wishing me a nice day. Too hot here for a nice day.

[Alloy Dave]

Technology is creeping more and more into my life.

 

I WANT to be responsible for controlling how I drive.

 

+1

 

Now, where is that remote for the TV?

[RUFDRAFT]

Fuf? Sorry - had to laugh.

 

Thanks for the Stomp retraction!

 

There is Always somebody faster than you are, bro.

 

Then, there's bang for the buck. That's where we might differ.

 

I think someone with a GT can add some mods and run with a Shelby for thousands less. Which is why I'm buying a GT. To save money!

 

Dave - you're off your meds again!

 

What's my favorite button on the remote? The Mute button!

 

Hot? Gonna be 97 here tomorrow. Pass me a Corona! :happy feet:

[68fastback]

Chris,

I don't think the the point is that a Mustang GT with mods can't beat a stock Shebly, because it could happen. My point is that with a very few mods the Shelby will be would be way ahead of it. I just don't see the average GT with mods, even with a blower, hitting 11's. But I think most Shelbys will with only a tune, gears and DR's. A couple of months will tell.

 

Fuf,

Didn't mean to ruin your day, maybe stomp was the wrong word, OK probably was the wrong word. Anyway you know what they say about opions, but thanks for wishing me a nice day. Too hot here for a nice day.

 

 

I think on a road-course you'd really see the dif. Again, not because a GT could not be made to keep up with a 500 but because all the changes you'd have to make to do that flat out lap after lap would be tantamount to recreating many of the GT500's extras without which the GT, just with comparable lb/HP, would go up in smoke, just a matter of what woill fail first: cooling, brakes and clutch (in that order) would be my guess. A 1/4-mile drag is far less indicative of the cars capability that running at max on a roa course IMHO.

 

In RUF's case, he's designed his car for street fun so, while the clutch might be a prob at some point, the brakes and cooling will likely hang in there just fine.

 

All depends on the situation, I think, but having it all and being able to flog it all afternoon and drive it home at 22-25mpg (gently) and take it to work (god forbid) the next day is where the GT500's total engineering shines. It's an awesome value at $41K in that you're truly getting what you pay for.

 

Not trying to negate anyone else's points, just trying to bring another perspective I didn't see sufacing.

[SVTpower]

Fuf? Sorry - had to laugh.

 

Thanks for the Stomp retraction!

 

There is Always somebody faster than you are, bro.

 

Then, there's bang for the buck. That's where we might differ.

 

I think someone with a GT can add some mods and run with a Shelby for thousands less. Which is why I'm buying a GT. To save money!

 

Dave - you're off your meds again!

 

What's my favorite button on the remote? The Mute button!

 

Hot? Gonna be 97 here tomorrow. Pass me a Corona! :happy feet:

 

 

 

Ruf........

 

Don't take this the wrong way but..............I don't believe I'm the only one that will say here that your 'tone' towards the Shelby has changed since you've made your decision to 'save $$$'

 

I said it once but here goes again..........

 

Mod all you want but you will spend more than you think and in the end.........unless you spend a lot of $$, you will:

 

-maybe get 400-450 hp.......your 4.6 is now on borrowed time

-still not have the 5.4 built for boost

-your clutch will be toast sooner than you think vs a dual disc setup

-not have a reinforced diff

-biggie here..............3650 tranny vs. new version of the T56.............so your tranny is now on borrowed time too.

-bye bye warranty

- plus, plus, plus.........and in the end, will not be a Shelby, but another modded GT.

 

Just telling you the facts, you will spend more than you thought initially just to try to keep up and convince yourself that you made the right decision.

 

Now, if you bought it to truly save $$ with minimal mods, you will, however, if you mod to keep up, you will be in for a surprise.

 

Like I said, I post regularly, and read this forum often, and you have changed my friend.................

[RUFDRAFT]

PM Sent SVT -

[SVTpower]

PM Sent SVT -

 

 

 

Rec'd and replied...........all good bud!