mustang crazy Posted October 6, 2007 Report Share Posted October 6, 2007 Can any one share a little light on this subject.Like how much torque they took out.I know Fred can get it back but was waiting for some time before spending a few more dollors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_Slick737 Posted October 6, 2007 Report Share Posted October 6, 2007 Can any one share a little light on this subject.Like how much torque they took out.I know Fred can get it back but was waiting for some time before spending a few more dollors. I have no basis in fact.. but i wouldnt think this to be true IMHO... There was no reason to make a change to the torque. Remember Fred is trying to Sell something to you, and if by saying that Ford Lowered the Torque for the 08 model might create more sales for his company. They are in business to make $$$$ after all !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MStover1 Posted October 6, 2007 Report Share Posted October 6, 2007 I have no basis in fact.. but i wouldnt think this to be true IMHO... There was no reason to make a change to the torque. Remember Fred is trying to Sell something to you, and if by saying that Ford Lowered the Torque for the 08 model might create more sales for his company. They are in business to make $$$$ after all !!! +100 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColdwaterHotrod Posted October 6, 2007 Report Share Posted October 6, 2007 I have no basis in fact.. but i wouldnt think this to be true IMHO... There was no reason to make a change to the torque. Remember Fred is trying to Sell something to you, and if by saying that Ford Lowered the Torque for the 08 model might create more sales for his company. They are in business to make $$$$ after all !!! FRED wouldn't lie to get your business. His products, service & SPEED RECORDS say it all. I know of NO other speed shops that are working as closely to FORD/SVT than he is plus he has more access levels to the programming then others. TRUST EVO & THEY WILL MAKE YOUR CAR A ROCKET SHIP! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grabber Posted October 6, 2007 Report Share Posted October 6, 2007 I have no basis in fact.. but i wouldnt think this to be true IMHO... There was no reason to make a change to the torque. Remember Fred is trying to Sell something to you, and if by saying that Ford Lowered the Torque for the 08 model might create more sales for his company. They are in business to make $$$$ after all !!! Wow. Evo is one of our best vendors. You can trust him. I suggest you give them a call or PM him for some details. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShelbyDude Posted October 6, 2007 Report Share Posted October 6, 2007 Can any one share a little light on this subject.Like how much torque they took out.I know Fred can get it back but was waiting for some time before spending a few more dollors. Based on the order guides Ford did NOT take away any torque. 2007 Order Guide....500 HP....480 Torque 2008 Order Guide....500 HP....480 Torgue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LuckySnake Posted October 7, 2007 Report Share Posted October 7, 2007 Wow. Evo is one of our best vendors. You can trust him. I suggest you give them a call or PM him for some details. I can't find anything from Ford that says the 08 GT500 has been given a different tune than the 07's. Where does Ford state this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Snake Posted October 7, 2007 Report Share Posted October 7, 2007 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_Slick737 Posted October 7, 2007 Report Share Posted October 7, 2007 Wow. Evo is one of our best vendors. You can trust him. I suggest you give them a call or PM him for some details. Grabber I know my post was a little harsh with sceptisism.. up to this point the 08 have been out for 3 months and this is the first time anyone here has mentioned or brought up the notion that the 08's have be detuned to an amount much different than the 2007 model. I would just think that as many great people as we have on the forum, we would have heard something sooner about this from more sources, that FORD detuned the 08' models more than the 07's. I know EVO has been able to get every bit of juice out of these wonderful machines. My Hats off to them !! Im not a Gear head by any stretch, someone who is might give SVT a call and see what they say about this rumor, and can report back to the forum. :happy feet: Again my apologizes for my earlier post coming off harsh.. but when i read their post again about this subject.. It sounds like a sales pitch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grabber Posted October 7, 2007 Report Share Posted October 7, 2007 Let me see what I can find out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_Slick737 Posted October 7, 2007 Report Share Posted October 7, 2007 Let me see what I can find out. Thanks Grabber that would be awsome..... Yeah If I did it we would be on two different pages... and I would probably mess up what they told me when I tried to report back to forum.... LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShelbyDude Posted October 7, 2007 Report Share Posted October 7, 2007 Grabber I know my post was a little harsh with sceptisism.. up to this point the 08 have been out for 3 monthsand this is the first time anyone here has mentioned or brought up the notion that the 08's have be detuned to an amount much different than the 2007 model. I would just think that as many great people as we have on the forum, we would have heard something sooner about this from more sources, that FORD detuned the 08' models more than the 07's. I know EVO has been able to get every bit of juice out of these wonderful machines. My Hats off to them !! Im not a Gear head by any stretch, someone who is might give SVT a call and see what they say about this rumor, and can report back to the forum. :happy feet: Again my apologizes for my earlier post coming off harsh.. but when i read their post again about this subject.. It sounds like a sales pitch. What post was it that you read where it sounded like a sales pitch? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alloy Dave Posted October 7, 2007 Report Share Posted October 7, 2007 Remember Fred is trying to Sell something to you, and if by saying that Ford Lowered the Torque for the 08 model might create more sales for his company. They are in business to make $$$$ after all !!! Wow, I can't believe you'd make a statement like that about someone without any proof. Yes, they are in business to make money...and one way to make sure you don't make any money is to lie to your customers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LuckySnake Posted October 7, 2007 Report Share Posted October 7, 2007 Wow, I can't believe you'd make a statement like that about someone without any proof. Yes, they are in business to make money...and one way to make sure you don't make any money is to lie to your customers. Dave, do you know for a fact that the 08's have less torque than the 07's? Where does Ford state this? Where are the comparison dyno runs? Why would Ford risk false advertisement lawsuits by advertising the same torque on the 08's as the 07's? Personally, I think the BS flag is flying at full mast for everyone to see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crispy23c Posted October 7, 2007 Report Share Posted October 7, 2007 Dave, do you know for a fact that the 08's have less torque than the 07's? Where does Ford state this? Where are the comparison dyno runs? Why would Ford risk false advertisement lawsuits by advertising the same torque on the 08's as the 07's? Personally, I think the BS flag is flying at full mast for everyone to see. You never know where this comes from. Maybe Ford changed thee tune on the car and he interpreted it as a de-tune? I don't know why someone would say that without proof either.. or some kind of official document. Ford says it's the same, and a de-tune makes no sense at all. Yeah, Ford would detune the '500 with the competition right around the corner........ Riiiiight Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLB8SNK Posted October 7, 2007 Report Share Posted October 7, 2007 I will be neutral as I plan on keeping my car stock. But this makes NO sense at all. Lets review some of the facts we do know. Ford made some minor changes to the motor, do not recall but it was pulley or something along that line. Geared for less weight and better mods. Ford also knows this car is heavily modded, and a limited quantity car. Oh yea and we are close to competing with other HP cars. There is NO reason for Ford to drop their pants and lower torque on this car at all, as in doing so it would almost send the wrong message to anyone and everyone. So unless FORD states this in writing and makes it known, I do not buy it and we should not be so gullible to spread BS rumors. Now on to Fred, lets not kid ourselves, he may be a great guy, and a great vendor, but he is SELLING something! I am not saying that negative, but how many 08's do you guys think a little shop in PA is going to come across? I am certain the small sampling he based his comment on is just that, a small sample and his comments. I do not see any hard fact in that whatsoever. Bottom line, EVO is in the business to make money. They have a great product and many guys swear by it and buy it. So it is only normal that if Fred makes a comment, well then it has to be so. Well Fred is just that, Fred. One guy, with an opinion, and maybe geared to his belief. Please no negative responses about Fred or EVO, this is not to kick him or EVO, just stating my feelings. I KNOW he is a GREAT guy with GREAT products! I say stick with the facts, stick with logic, and try to make some sense of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SVTregistry Posted October 7, 2007 Report Share Posted October 7, 2007 Dave, do you know for a fact that the 08's have less torque than the 07's? Where does Ford state this? Where are the comparison dyno runs? Why would Ford risk false advertisement lawsuits by advertising the same torque on the 08's as the 07's? Personally, I think the BS flag is flying at full mast for everyone to see. wouldn't be the first time..... remember the underpowered 1999 SVT Cobra? at least Ford fixes their mistakes... --Russ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mustang crazy Posted October 8, 2007 Author Report Share Posted October 8, 2007 wouldn't be the first time..... remember the underpowered 1999 SVT Cobra? at least Ford fixes their mistakes... --Russ TALKED TO SVT TODAY AND THEY SAID THEY MAKE 3 OR 4 DIFFERENT CALABRATION FOR 08 SHELBYS. THE REASON IS SO THE EPA GUIDE LINE AND EMISSIONS TEST PASS SO IT MAY TAKE SOME TORQUE OUT OF THE VECHILE IT CHANGES FROM YEAR TO YEAR AND SOMETIME 6 MONTHS. THANKS TO ALL SVT WILL PUT THAT REST !!!!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLB8SNK Posted October 8, 2007 Report Share Posted October 8, 2007 TALKED TO SVT TODAY AND THEY SAID THEY MAKE 3 OR 4 DIFFERENT CALABRATION FOR 08 SHELBYS. THE REASON IS SO THE EPA GUIDE LINE AND EMISSIONS TEST PASS SO IT MAY TAKE SOME TORQUE OUT OF THE VECHILE IT CHANGES FROM YEAR TO YEAR AND SOMETIME 6 MONTHS. THANKS TO ALL SVT WILL PUT THAT REST !!!!!!!!!!!! So let me get this straight. SVT states that Ford builds a GT500 and that the hp or torque specs can change and differ from the advertised spec to the consumer, and all without having to state as much? Hummm I still find that hard to believe. So if I go to the dealer and state I want to know what tune I have? Or lets say I want the 07 tune placed on it? I don't know, but this makes no sense, and if indeed what you state is true, that could also account for the 07's so it obviously is not just the 08's? You did say 3 or 4 tunes, that could change every six months? All I can say is that for a guy who does not plan on Modding his car, I will be pissed if my tune is not what I purchased! 500HP and 480 Torque. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_Slick737 Posted October 8, 2007 Report Share Posted October 8, 2007 What post was it that you read where it sounded like a sales pitch? http://www.stangsunleashed.com/forums/inde...showtopic=10828 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moabman Posted October 8, 2007 Report Share Posted October 8, 2007 So let me get this straight. SVT states that Ford builds a GT500 and that the hp or torque specs can change and differ from the advertised spec to the consumer, and all without having to state as much? Hummm I still find that hard to believe. So if I go to the dealer and state I want to know what tune I have? Or lets say I want the 07 tune placed on it? I don't know, but this makes no sense, and if indeed what you state is true, that could also account for the 07's so it obviously is not just the 08's? You did say 3 or 4 tunes, that could change every six months? All I can say is that for a guy who does not plan on Modding his car, I will be pissed if my tune is not what I purchased! 500HP and 480 Torque. dans500 - These two "facts" are not mutually exclusive. The peak HP and Torque are what are advertised and are derived from WOT runs. The EPA and CAFE requirements revolve around "average" use which is certainly not WOT. I'm not an expert on PCM programing but I do know that it handles WOT differently than partial throttle acceleration. I believe these are called open loop and closed loop F/A management. I think WOT is called open loop programming. In closed loop programming, the "learning" that people speak about are long term and short term fuel trims that the program "learns" by examining the factory narrow band O2 sensors reaction to different inputs ( air, fuel, IAT, coolant temp, throttle position, etc.). The program can also learn transmission management on cars with autos but we don't have to worry about that with the GT500. Back to the story - Ford tweaks these closed loop programs all the time to meet different criteria that are important to meet Ford's regulatory requirements and this can result in a little more or less HP & torque at different partial throttle settings. They may even modify the Air fuel map for WOT occasionally. Fred and others work with these all the time and they are sensitive to these tweaks so it's not surprising to hear them say that the torque is detuned and yet Ford still quotes the same WOT specs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLB8SNK Posted October 9, 2007 Report Share Posted October 9, 2007 dans500 - These two "facts" are not mutually exclusive. The peak HP and Torque are what are advertised and are derived from WOT runs. The EPA and CAFE requirements revolve around "average" use which is certainly not WOT. I'm not an expert on PCM programing but I do know that it handles WOT differently than partial throttle acceleration. I believe these are called open loop and closed loop F/A management. I think WOT is called open loop programming. In closed loop programming, the "learning" that people speak about are long term and short term fuel trims that the program "learns" by examining the factory narrow band O2 sensors reaction to different inputs ( air, fuel, IAT, coolant temp, throttle position, etc.). The program can also learn transmission management on cars with autos but we don't have to worry about that with the GT500. Back to the story - Ford tweaks these closed loop programs all the time to meet different criteria that are important to meet Ford's regulatory requirements and this can result in a little more or less HP & torque at different partial throttle settings. They may even modify the Air fuel map for WOT occasionally. Fred and others work with these all the time and they are sensitive to these tweaks so it's not surprising to hear them say that the torque is detuned and yet Ford still quotes the same WOT specs. Now that does make sense! Thanks for the info. All said, then it really is a crap shoot of sort in that any of us (07 or 08) could have gotten differing tunes, dependent on build dates. Fred would see, what he would see, yet the sampling is subject to change throughout the build cycle. I can live with that logic. And if I understand you correct, that learning process itself could alter the car performance as well as the tune alone. So again, we all may have a "slightly" different motor, yet all fall well within the averages stated. Thanks again! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuckstang Posted October 9, 2007 Report Share Posted October 9, 2007 Who really cars because I bet you any 08 owner will not be able to leave it stock. With just a stage 1 and over 500rwhp, my stock GT500 seemed slow! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLB8SNK Posted October 9, 2007 Report Share Posted October 9, 2007 Who really cars because I bet you any 08 owner will not be able to leave it stock. With just a stage 1 and over 500rwhp, my stock GT500 seemed slow! Lost that bet, I am keeping mine stock, plenty of HP for me in my parts! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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